For me it's always been a combination of "breaking down exactly where everything falls in relation to everything else" and "putting it on autopilot". Depending on the parts, my attention shuttles around several times a second. Aside from repetition, the biggest aid for me has always been to make and listen to recordings of everything together. Helps train my brain to hear them as one unit.
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Took me a long time to just be able to talk to somebody if necessary while playing...still not quite up to singing while playing whole notes, still working. Voice ain't great and I snore.
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You beat me to it. I find it much easier to sing with my eyes closed. I think it has to do with eliminating other distractions so I can concentrate just on singing and playing.
To the OP, it just takes practice, practice, practice. Start with super easy stuff--I mean, like "Mary Had a Little Lamb" type of easy. You can build from there.
I agree with everybody else. It's a matter of practicing until you're not thinking.
If you think about it, when you're trying to learn a song you're probably trying to think about playing the bassline and singing the right note on pitch and maybe even reading the words. That's too much to think about, you're gonna trainwreck.
You have to eliminate stuff to think about. Get the bass line down until you can't mess it up. Get the vocal part down until you have the lyrics memorized and can't mess them up. Then you stand a chance of putting them together.
I can't do anything more complicated than Green Day. And for some reason I have a mental block where I can play with a pick and sing, but I can't play fingerstyle and sing. I'm working on it, slowly. I'd really like to be able to do backup vocals or lead songs at church, but I just flat out can't play and sing that stuff at the same time.
If you think about it, when you're trying to learn a song you're probably trying to think about playing the bassline and singing the right note on pitch and maybe even reading the words. That's too much to think about, you're gonna trainwreck.
You have to eliminate stuff to think about. Get the bass line down until you can't mess it up. Get the vocal part down until you have the lyrics memorized and can't mess them up. Then you stand a chance of putting them together.
I can't do anything more complicated than Green Day. And for some reason I have a mental block where I can play with a pick and sing, but I can't play fingerstyle and sing. I'm working on it, slowly. I'd really like to be able to do backup vocals or lead songs at church, but I just flat out can't play and sing that stuff at the same time.
I feel for ya. I have tried myself too many times while grooving and singing and I just can't split my mind doing that (not that I have a great voice anyway). Also during gigs (in the old days) I had band members talking to me while playing the bass and I can't really talk to them without losing tightness on the grooove. I can only give everything on one thing at a time. I just stopped trying to do it and focussed only on the bass after that, I sing with my bass
This is what works for me. Finding the syncopation between the two parts. I start off learning the bass line and the vocal line separately, to the point where I don't need the recording. Then I slow everything waaaaay down and often use a metronome to keep the tempo and work them together, sometimes repeating one line over and over, until it clicks together. Sometimes making the vocal line a non-melodic rhythm to get that down first helps. Keep it slow. Speeding up before you're ready only hides the errors you're trying to fix. Then gradually ramp it up to performance tempo. Once it clicks, it's like riding a bike. I used this method for Smash Mouth's Allstar and Sublime's Wrong Way. Both of those are rapid fire vocals tunes with a lot words to spit out, and distinctive bass line, but using this method, I was able to nail them.
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^ This
I have to make my playing mechanical, not thinking about pitch, or anything. Just move fingers at the right time. And then, my mind is clear to sing the right notes. But, the more complicated the singing, the simpler the bass line becomes.
The hardest part for me was to not look at the fretboard so I could look out at the audience while singing.
Since I have zero capability to memorize I have to have a lyric sheet in front of me. I keep my stand low so it's not too obnoxious. (Ducking tomatoes for using a stand!)
Here I am in action. Yep, I still look at the fretboard, and you can also see me look down to pick up lyrics. At least I don't stand there and read all the lyrics!
(The video was shot by the Drummer's wife if you couldn't tell!)
Since I have zero capability to memorize I have to have a lyric sheet in front of me. I keep my stand low so it's not too obnoxious. (Ducking tomatoes for using a stand!)
Here I am in action. Yep, I still look at the fretboard, and you can also see me look down to pick up lyrics. At least I don't stand there and read all the lyrics!
(The video was shot by the Drummer's wife if you couldn't tell!)
I have always sung the lyrics with the lead vocalist - under my breath. This let me catch the chord changes dead on. When I sing backup on the chorus - I just increase the volume.
Start singing and do a lot of it... it will come.
Course I'm playing backup R-5 and letting the vocalist have center stage... Do the same, your voice is singing the melody and your bass is backing that up. Less is usually more.
Start singing and do a lot of it... it will come.
Course I'm playing backup R-5 and letting the vocalist have center stage... Do the same, your voice is singing the melody and your bass is backing that up. Less is usually more.
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Work on just pumping straight 8th Notes at first. With 4 different notes. Then sing a scale over that. Or even the ABC song. Just get your brain used to doing two things at once. Basslines that involve pumping straight notes are the best ones to start with. If you have an easier time with guitar then use a pick.
And it will require practice. And lots of it. There’s no quick fix trick I’m afraid.
And it will require practice. And lots of it. There’s no quick fix trick I’m afraid.
It's a question of finding a way to eat the elephant one bite at a time.
You've got a complicated skill that's hard to learn. You have to figure out how to break it down into simpler skills that are easier to learn, and then build back up to the more complicated skill.
Ideas, most already mentioned above:
- practice the bass line separately.
- practice the vocal line separately.
- learn just one bar at a time.
- chart out how the bass line and vocal line rhythms interact.
- slow it down as much as you need to make it easy, even if it seems ridiculously slow.
- practice tapping the two rhythms on a table with your fingers, instead of singing one and playing the other.
- tap the bass rhythm on a table while you sing the vocal part.
- forget about getting the right notes in bass line, just rest your fretting hand across all four strings to mute, and worry about getting the right rhythm with your plucking hand.
You've got to break it down into the tiniest pieces you can, until you find something that's easy to learn, then learn that. Be slow and methodical, and you'll get back up to the more complicated thing sooner than you expect.
And with practice you'll eventually find you need to break things down a little less, and can go for more complicated things from the start.
But I always try to err on the side of being slow and methodical at first. You'll get there.
You've got a complicated skill that's hard to learn. You have to figure out how to break it down into simpler skills that are easier to learn, and then build back up to the more complicated skill.
Ideas, most already mentioned above:
- practice the bass line separately.
- practice the vocal line separately.
- learn just one bar at a time.
- chart out how the bass line and vocal line rhythms interact.
- slow it down as much as you need to make it easy, even if it seems ridiculously slow.
- practice tapping the two rhythms on a table with your fingers, instead of singing one and playing the other.
- tap the bass rhythm on a table while you sing the vocal part.
- forget about getting the right notes in bass line, just rest your fretting hand across all four strings to mute, and worry about getting the right rhythm with your plucking hand.
You've got to break it down into the tiniest pieces you can, until you find something that's easy to learn, then learn that. Be slow and methodical, and you'll get back up to the more complicated thing sooner than you expect.
And with practice you'll eventually find you need to break things down a little less, and can go for more complicated things from the start.
But I always try to err on the side of being slow and methodical at first. You'll get there.
The first way works better for me, although I can't say I have a major problem with it. Just once in a while. My major problem is having a voice that's only OK
copied from another similar thread:
It's a polyrhytmic issue: Play Rhythm A while singing Rhythm B.
Here's how to untangle the rhythms:
Put the bass down.
Clap the exact Bass rhythm (rhythm A)
once you Clap rhythm A accurately and with confidence,
Clap it while singing rhythm B.
The trouble spots you need to work on should become immediately apparent.
Then swap which rhythm you are clapping/singing
Only pick up your bass after you can do this with full confidence while clapping and singing. Otherwise you're at the mercy of mental overload defaulting to habit.
It's a polyrhytmic issue: Play Rhythm A while singing Rhythm B.
Here's how to untangle the rhythms:
Put the bass down.
Clap the exact Bass rhythm (rhythm A)
once you Clap rhythm A accurately and with confidence,
Clap it while singing rhythm B.
The trouble spots you need to work on should become immediately apparent.
Then swap which rhythm you are clapping/singing
Only pick up your bass after you can do this with full confidence while clapping and singing. Otherwise you're at the mercy of mental overload defaulting to habit.
Excellent! I was just wondering if there was any value to "switching" the parts like that - probably not with actual bass playing (sing the bass part and play the vocal line on bass), but the clapping approach to figure out the rhythm interleave "both ways" sounds great. That's the hard part, for me, at least.
Be patient... it gets easier with time.
You've touched on the two approaches that I am aware of learn the parts separately and combine, or learn them together from the outset. Both work.
Try both... the discovery is a fun part of the process!
You've touched on the two approaches that I am aware of learn the parts separately and combine, or learn them together from the outset. Both work.
Try both... the discovery is a fun part of the process!
I struggled with singing and playing years ago when I first tried it. I would open my mouth to sing and my fingers would stop working. I gave up.
Years later, at a gig, I was called upon to sing a song (that my former band had played hundreds of times) and just did it, no problem. I realize now that early-on, my bass playing had required my concentration. When I didn't anymore, I could easily sing while playing.
Others have already said it:
Get the bass playing on autopilot, get the singing on autopilot.... and then you can do them at the same time.
Years later, at a gig, I was called upon to sing a song (that my former band had played hundreds of times) and just did it, no problem. I realize now that early-on, my bass playing had required my concentration. When I didn't anymore, I could easily sing while playing.
Others have already said it:
Get the bass playing on autopilot, get the singing on autopilot.... and then you can do them at the same time.
Good Luck. singing and playing bass at the same time is something I've never been able to do...I get asked to do vocals, and my response is basically something along the lines of "do you want the groove to happen or do you want me to sing? because both ain't happening at once".
I really wish I could do it, honestly.
Also, FWIW the bass players (and even some guitar players) in my area that do sing? Yeah some of those guys almost stop playing entirely or play the most very basic of thing they can possibly get away with while they sing.
