How would you do this (fuzz face content)

[DosiYanarchy]

Hey peeps,

I just took delivery of an Dunlop Eric Johnson Fuzz Face.
I love how it sounds but it kills the lows a bit on bass. This isn't a suprise as I bought it for guitar, what is a suprise is how much I love it on bass. It's got a gnarly tone that I'm just really enjoying.


How would you deal with the low end loss? I don't want to mod the pedal (might get a cheaper fuzz face to have modded).

Concerns:
1. A buffered signal splitter (ls2, jhs summing amp, Singlecross) will introduce a buffer to the signal, affecting the fuzz face tone (I tested with a boss rc3 in a tbp loop, the EJ fuzz face definitely doesn't like buffers before it)
2. Am I wrong in thinking that an unbuffered signal splitter will be detrimental to the overall tone?

I suspect the blending might just not work properly. Shame I just sold my ehx knockout, this would have been a perfect bass boost.

 

[gh0st42]

A Parallel Blender like the Boss LS-2, Damnation Audio Loop Blender, or anything like that is probably going to be your best bet to blend back in some clean lows. Lots of Loop Blender options these days from different manufacturers.

Otherwise you can try an EQ after the Fuzz Face, and try boost enough lows back in to thicken it up, but that can often introduce more noise as well.

 

[IronLung1986]

Yea I mean you could do the LS-2 thing with it. I'll say this though, I've never been inspired to play a dirt pedal with an LS-2 clean blend. Something about it just isn't super exciting or something. Idk. That type of blending kind of neuters the sound imo and takes the fun out of it. I would maybe run the Fuzz Face into like a Spark Booster or something with EQ and dial it back in. Or just use it vanilla and not care haha.

Low end loss wasn't something I cared all that much about until my band actually mentioned it. I was using an Acapulco Gold at super low gain and even though I knew that a little low end was being shaved off I thought (and still think) it sounded great. But one of the guys said he noticed it and felt like we needed that deep low end back in our sound. So I obliged and stopped using that pedal on bass, and started being more aware of it in general.

I generally don't even like the clean blends that are built into pedals. I like to stick to dirts that don't need it like the Green Russian RI. Uncompromised, all-in type sounds are just way more fun to me. The only clean blend I like is on my Malekko Diabolik. On my board I have a bunch of guitar-only pedals that I don't use on bass and since I play a good deal of guitar too I'm fine with it. By the way, how are you liking that Fuzz Face on guitar? I had my hands on it at the store but backed out since it would never fit on my board lol.

 

[DosiYanarchy]

Thanks for your responses!
I guess my concern is that I suspect that things like the Bloop and the ls-2 use buffers in their signal splitting and those buffers will react poorly with the fuzz face.

I also suspect that something that splits the signal without the buffer (I.e. Passive signal splitter) overall just won't sound very good. I'm not too technically minded so I'm not sure if this is actually the case.

I think the EQ option might be the way to go.

I'm really liking the fuzz face on guitar too, it's gnarly, spitty, kinda gated, almost synthy but still sounding really organic. I was looking for a vintage garage rock fuzz tone and this does it. Slowly I'm trying to build my collection of fuzz archetypes (Muffs, Superfuzz, Tonebenders, rats and now a fuzz face)

 

[Fuzzonaut]

Maybe you could try one of those "buffer buster" things after blending with a buffered signal splitter?

 

[DosiYanarchy]

Oh I didn't know about that.
I'm doing some research now and have come across this :
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I'll do some reading up on this stuff

 

[inchoate]

I've had good luck running LPFs after fuzzes. Use the LPF to knock the top off and then up the gain to bring the signal back to where you want it.

 

[G.Bisson]

I've tried using a Radial Dragster before a Woolly Mammoth in a blend loop and was dissatisfied with the results. Mammoth fuzz doesnt play nicely with active basses or buffered pedals. Impedance correction didn't seem to change that. Maybe a Fuzz Face will behave differently? Needing two pedals to support one fuzz was also impractical for board space and power supplies. Good luck in your search for a solution.

 

[Swimming Bird]

I use an Amptweaker Bass Tight Fuzz for this - essentially to add a parallel low boost, add a buffer buster, and put a little more dirt on the output. The buffer buster has really helped de-mud my muff (used in the Amptweaker pre loop). You can turn the gain almost all the way off (I configure mine as a slightly crunchy drive) and I think there are probably also lower gain OD versions out there. Plus the clean lows seems to grab signal from the input and it can add some real heft.

Seriously, it completely merged my bass and guitar boards. The only dirt setting I really tweak when switching anymore is the amount of clean low coming off the Amptweaker (bass at about 9, guitar almost full off).

 

[markjazzbassist]

FWIW i have owned and modded a number of vintage fuzz faces. when you add back in the bottom that was lost, it no longer has that "fuzz face sound". because it has the big bottom. it sounds more muff like. so i just play them stock now with the bass cut and use that tone because it's the tone i love.

 

[sifrancis]

All the signal blender/loopers mentioned above have buffers so will not play ball with the Fuzz Face as you have stated.

Damnation did make a version of their signal blender called the "Mammoth Tamer" for exactly this: sending an unbuffered signal to the pedal in the loop, and blending that with your clean lows (with some extra mods to eventuate this). Not currently available, but worth reaching out to see if they'd make some more.
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[Killing Floor]

The EJ is a great guitar box. Curious what you come up with.
I've had great luck with Wampler fuzz pedals for holding the bottom on basses.

 

[BruceWane]

IMO, your best bet is to place an EQ pedal after your EJ fuzz, then use them as a pair.

I don't have experience with your particular pedal, but every time I've set up a clean blend for distortion or fuzz I've been disappointed. Buffer/impedance issues aside, there has always been a feeling of "separateness". The clean and the dirt seem to never quite merge back into a single thing. It'll get very, very close, but never quite there. This can still be a sound that's "useful in a mix" so to speak, but it's always left me wanting to fix it. Uninspiring. I've seen discussion that this effect may be due to the way that dirt add compression, so when you try to merge the dirty/compressed signal back with a clean signal that is not identically compressed you get this "oil and water" effect.

So even if there aren't other technical issues with an unbuffered/passive blend, even if that gets you past the issue of your fuzz needing to have the impedance of a passive instrument on the input, it's pretty likely that the dirty and clean signals are not going to completely merge back together as you probably want.

 

[Jared Houseman]

Are there any transformer based splitters for bass? I have some for microphones but idk if that works well with high impedance signal or not. If so that would allow you to have an isolated split without a buffer

 

[gh0st42]

All the signal blender/loopers mentioned above have buffers so will not play ball with the Fuzz Face as you have stated.

Damnation did make a version of their signal blender called the "Mammoth Tamer" for exactly this: sending an unbuffered signal to the pedal in the loop, and blending that with your clean lows (with some extra mods to eventuate this). Not currently available, but worth reaching out to see if they'd make some more.
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Good point!

You can also grab a Passive Pickup Emulator pedal and stick the Fuzz Face in it's loop if you want to use a different blender that usually isn't friendly with buffered signals, or use one of these buffer hating fuzzes after a buffer equiped pedal in your signal chain.

@Mosfed might still have a couple around. They work great, and come in a sweet acid etched enclosure.

 

[DosiYanarchy]

Thank you everyone, some really great suggestions.
I won't be disappointed if I just run the ff stock, with no blend or with an eq after it. I've got plenty of bass fuzzes and guitar fuzzes that work great on bass without blends so I've not lost out with the EJ FF as I just bought it for guitar.
I just shot a bass demo of the EJ and it's pretty quiet compared to the bypassed signal, you can't get unity gain and it feels like it looses lows. Just an FYI for anyone who was thinking about the EJFF for bass. I think I'm going to start collecting a few of the big dunlop fuzz faces to see if they all respond the same.

The Amptweaker suggestion was great and ill hold off on the Dragster for now.

As a side note for people mentioning how clean blends don't always sound so great. I've found that the missing ingredient is actually compression on the clean signal. When i use my BYTE HEAVEN Singlecross I send the low frequencies to my Spectra Comp and VT Bass and the highs through my fuzzes, delays etc onto a Tech 21 Leeds.

 

[dwagner]

You could use a Goodwood Audio Bass Interfacer.

 

[Jared Houseman]

You could use a Goodwood Audio Bass Interfacer.

It's buffered so that's not going to work with a fuzz face style pedal

 

[iiipopes]

Buy a Rickenbacker 4003 bass guitar. Buy or have made a Ric-O-Sound cord/box/splitter. Run the bridge pickup through the fx pedal/box to one amp for the color desired. Run the neck pickup through another amp for the fundamental desired. Blend to suit.

 

[DosiYanarchy]

Buy a Rickenbacker 4003 bass guitar. Buy or have made a Ric-O-Sound cord/box/splitter. Run the bridge pickup through the fx pedal/box to one amp for the color desired. Run the neck pickup through another amp for the fundamental desired. Blend to suit.

Although I'm definitely not going to buy a rick just to do what I want to with a fuzz face, this makes alot of sense. The FF wants to see a pickup, if I had two outputs on my bass then this would be the perfect solution.