I Want a Tube Amp

[agedhorse]

Tube preamps, the really good ones, can be wonderful things. specially so on guitar, but also can be on bass.

Tube power amps, for the power you need for bass guitar, are NEARLY always (yes I am aware of a couple of exceptions) very heavy, expensive, heavy, hot, heavy, weigh a lot, picky about the cab impedance, heavy, and are not light.

At least in my 50s now that is the biggest memory I have of the tube amps I used to play through as a bassist. And I played through ampegs off and on for years, ampeg all tube heads, as well as music man tube power amps, for bass.

the only tube amp I still own is a Genz Benz El Diablo 112 combo... the single greatest guitar amp I've ever owned in my life. But it just lives in my music studio.... way too heavy for me to move around. But WHAT an amp. It is the only non-presettable guitar amp I've owned over the years that I still own, other than cheapos lying around the house for convenience. All other guitar amps (and non amps, like modelers) I own can be configured for total recall of all parameters with footswitch etc... but if I am searching for the ideal tone on guitar, that Genz Benz amp is far more versatile than any other tube amp I've worked with, while having exceptional tones all over the map.

Still, that being said, you may well love the features you are looking for in a tube preamp, as has been discussed already, without a very heavy and hot tube power amp stage.... a good bass tube preamp, like you said, that is sexy. I even agree that they can be sexy looking, although that often isn't the priority for bass amp designs, from my experience.... looking "tube-y".

The Diablo heads are too heavy for me too… and I designed it

That head is a good example of what I posted earlier about how many different tones, textures and dynamics profiles can be designed without changing g the tubes.

Differences are more typically due to the circuit design than the specific tubes themselves.

On those heads, you can drive the power amp input (effects return jack) with a bass preamp. They actually work well for bass guitar.

Just because I'm known for, and generally associated with class d amps doesn't mean that I have r designed my share of commercially successful tube and class AB solid state amps.

 

[Dynacord]

Check out Ashdown--CTM 100,200,300. Have the aesthetics you want, gets dirty, plenty of headroom.

Seconded. Best to try one first if possible as they are pretty dark sounding and not the most flexible EQ so some may not like them. I love them myself. I A/B'd CTM-100 with Ampeg V4B and much preferred the Ashdown - but if someone came to the opposite conclusion, they wouldn't be 'wrong'.

The 100 is loud enough for anything I do and I like that one can get the power section character working at manageable volume, the 300 might be better if playing with someone playing a cranked Marshall.

50 lbs, there are IMHO only the V4BH (40 lbs) and the Orange (58). Maybe some Ashdown?

***Edit: Ashdown CTM100 is 30 lbs, probably using toroidal transformers.

CTM-100 I have is 41 lbs.

 

[cnltb]

Just to say it again...
RHEINGOLD

Rheingold-Music / Amps&Tools

 

[pepj]

Best amp out there is the DB750 or DB751.
I'd say the carry is way more than 45lbs though.
Add in a proper case...and you need to because it will destroy canvas bags..and you are closer to 60 plus lbs, imv.

The SVT is also a great amp but the EQ is pretty average. However, the glorious tube stage largely negates all that.
You need an 810 too..lol

 

[Dynacord]

Just to say it again...
RHEINGOLD

Rheingold-Music / Amps&Tools

Sure - though 4,000 euro for the 300w so one has to be really sure of what one wants.

 

[cnltb]

Sure - though 4,000 euro for the 300w so one has to be really sure of what one wants.

Oh, absolöutely.

 

[Deleted member 271037]

If you're looking for a bit of dirt: Used 70s Marshall Superbass. It's my favourite amp for rehearsals/gigs. Some people don't like them because they can't get SVT loud and stay clean. I like them BECAUSE they can get dirty at a (relatively) reasonable volume. It's still a loud amp though. When I jump the channels I get more than enough volume with a Bertantino 2x12 for my prog band with two guitar players, organ/Leslie/synths and a LOUD drummer. It won't give you an ultra clean tone at loud volumes though.

Just make sure you don't get one that's modded into a Superlead. This is often done by guitar players because the Superbass can usually be found a lot cheaper than a Superlead. At least that was the case the last time I checked. I was told (so take this with a grain of salt!) that Marshall didn't mess around with the design of the Superbass as much as they did with the Superlead over the years. Which means that a 70s Superbass is supposedly closer to a Plexi than the 70s Superleads. But like I said, take this with a grain of salt, I just heard it from a local amp tech (who I normally trust).

 

[BOOG]

I'm interested in acquiring a tube amp for the dirty pre-amp and aesthetics. I need help surveying my options.

I'm currently running an Aguilar TH500 thru a pair of Ampeg SVT 112 speakers. I play in a rock power trio and the guitarist plays a Marshall JCM 2000 thru a 412. The Aguilar is plenty loud, but it'd be nice to have a big, heavy, dirty amp that's in the same echelon as the Marshall. Also, as cliché as it sounds, the Aggie doesn't look cool next to the Marshall.

What are my options? No price constraints. But weight is a factor. Can we keep it close to 50lbs?

Ampeg V4B, SVT-CL; Aguilar DB751; Fender Super Bassman -- All come to mind immediately.

Just looking to work this problem out out-loud. Let me know your thoughts.

Thanks!
John

This is what I played at a classic car/air show yesterday and it pumped out nicely. 100watts/410 outdoors has No problem at all keeping up with three guitars, keys, and the loudest drummer I've ever played next to.

 

[Kendescending]

These two AMT drive/preamp pedals will give a you a saturated tube sound. The blue one, which is the one I have, is based on a Fender/Alembic amp while the orange one, which produces an even more saturated tone, is based on an Orange amp. They are well made and I'm happy with mine, which I use in front of a Little Mark Vintage head (has tube preamp) and the combo gives me a nice and thick sound on the verge of break up (with a dark Pbass with flats) but also a snappy sound (with a bright Pbass with nps rounds).

AMT Bricks A-Bass

AMT Bricks O-Bass

Sushibox FX makes versions of these as well and he's a TB member. Worth checking out if you go the tube preamp pedal route.

 

[Dynacord]

This is what I played at a classic car/air show yesterday and it pumped out nicely. 100watts/410 outdoors has No problem at all keeping up with three guitars, keys, and the loudest drummer I've ever played next to.
View attachment 4745254

I really love that head - totally loud enough for anything I need and the DI is great as well. Would like to get a matching cab just for the look...

 

[PeaveyPlayer]

There's also this one: it's only a tube preamp (+ class G power section, whatever that is), but I really love the sound on the demo

Sisma – Hybrid Tube/Class-G Bass Head | Jad Freer Audio

Wow that sounds good!

 

[Phaidrus]

Sushibox FX makes versions of these as well and he's a TB member. Worth checking out if you go the tube preamp pedal route.

I already have but unfortunately, as far as I know, Sushibox FX are not available in Europe. So I opted for the AMT drive/preamp pedal. There were a couple more choices (Effectrode, quite expensive; EBS, but I think discontinued; another discontinued, of which I don't remember the make), so the AMT was pretty much the only realistic choice for me. With the gain knob maxed (fitted stock with a Tung-Sol 12AX7), it does deliver a nice saturated tone and gives my passive Pbasses a welcome boost.

 

[Kendescending]

I suggest taking your time and playing as many amps as you can get your hands on. People seem to break it down into tube VS solid state. If you do this you miss a lot of important nuance, because different models tend to have their own unique personality attributes. Ampeg SVTs and Hiwatt DR201s are both all-tube amps, but the sound and way they respond to your touch is drastically different. Even amps that can be dialed in to sound similar tend to have a range of tones that are a bit different from each other. Also not all tube amps are great for distortion.

Rather than lumping everything together into this idea of "tubey-goodness", you need to identify and explore the types of characteristics that make an amp sound "tubey" to you. The mix of characteristics you prefer are likely to be a bit different from the next person.

Also as far as distortion goes, most die-hard tube fans seem to prefer a pushed output section rather than preamp drive. When you push the output section the sound typically thickens up and the way the amp responds to your touch changes. It's sometimes described as a sensation like the amp is pushing back.

The problem is being tied to a pushed output section limits our ability to make volume adjustments. You have to push the amp into a certain power level and range of overload to get the desired level of saturation. Turn up or turn down very much, and you are out of the sweet tone zone.

One benefit of preamp drive is you can crank the gain to whatever level of saturation you want, and then adjust the amps master to get the desired volume. Sometimes it's cool to push both the preamp and output section right to the edge of distortion. IMHO, pushing multiple stages to the edge tends to produce a richer and more complex sound. But the two tube amps I own that I think produce the best distortion can't even produce preamp drive.

One final bit of advice: Don't underestimate the value of pedals. If you buy a tube amp for distortion, it's likely to be sort of a one trick pony. Pedals tend to allow you to create a wider variety of distortion sounds. Also if you have not already done so, I suggest fully exploring the range of the Drive control on your TH500.

Nailed it!


I use my Music Man 100B amp (SS preamp and tube output) for great pushed output richness and tube saturation. It has such a powerful EQ, and I've never needed more than the 100 watts this is rated for as long as there is PA support. Had this amp for 20+ years and will never sell it.

My V4B reissue just has that great Ampeg sound that I love.

My Marshall JCM 800 Superbass II (model 1992) just sounds huge.

I have several tube preamp pedals for various distortion and/or tone enhancement.

As mentioned before, try as many amps as you can. Learn which amps have what kind of tone stack and figure out which kind of tone stack you like best which may help you with which direction to go. Seems like most people love either a Fender style tone stack or an Ampeg style. I'll let those more qualified than me describe those tone stacks better.

 

[gtirard]

I already have but unfortunately, as far as I know, Sushibox FX are not available in Europe. So I opted for the AMT drive/preamp pedal. There were a couple more choices (Effectrode, quite expensive; EBS, but I think discontinued; another discontinued, of which I don't remember the make), so the AMT was pretty much the only realistic choice for me. With the gain knob maxed (fitted stock with a Tung-Sol 12AX7), it does deliver a nice saturated tone and gives my passive Pbasses a welcome boost.

I live in France and I had no problem ordering a Sushi Box pedal from the website. Sometimes when people can't find their country in the list, they ask if it's normal in the Sushi Box Thread in Talkbass, and most of the time he will fix the website and add the missing country (can't think of a country where they wouldn't want to send their pedals).

 

[Phaidrus]

I live in France and I had no problem ordering a Sushi Box pedal from the website. Sometimes when people can't find their country in the list, they ask if it's normal in the Sushi Box Thread in Talkbass, and most of the time he will fix the website and add the missing country (can't think of a country where they wouldn't want to send their pedals).

It could be my next one, perhaps. Which one would it be for bass, the Slampegg Bee Pre X? It says it is out of stock.

 

[gtirard]

It could be my next one, perhaps. Which one would it be for bass, the Slampegg Bee Pre X? It says it is out of stock.

Every month he takes 20 orders, they are generally sold out in a couple of days… until next month. You can subscribe to the newsletter to get notification where he opens a batch, or follow the Sushi Box Thread here on Talkbass (he announces the new batch on TB a couple of hours before sending the corresponding newsletter). Usually it's not a crazy race that end up with many crushed dreams as it is for Broughton audio, you should get yours easily if you can wait a few days.

-------------

Most of the pedals are designed for bass and are tube driven, so you have a lot of choice. Go to the Shushi box thread for advices (I only have the Space Heater)
- Space Heater (or Finally with DI output): no EQ, just tube warmth
- Underground Accelerator: one of the best seller, I think it's a Fender tonestack
- Slampegg: another classic, inspired from Ampeg B15

 

[sonic 7]

Orange AD200B is exactly what the OP is looking for. He wants a grindy tube amp that'll look cool on stage with the guitar players Marshall. It's only 200 watts but it'll probably be cranked. Those boutique tube amps that have been mentioned are not at all appropriate for what he wants. Plus the Orange amps are usually readily available from just about every major retailer (at least they were before the world broke down) Ampeg B4B a close second. I don't really know why most people associate the SVT with distortion and overdrive, I've always them to great sounding

 

[sonic 7]

Clean amps. Back in the 70s when they were pretty popular I don't remember any players that sounded distorted or overdriven when using them.

 

[logdrum]

Mesa Boogie D-180. But if I were you. I'd split the signal. Overdrive a guitar head or sub 200 watt bass tube head (cut the bass and maybe even use a treble booster ) and use your current amp for a clean sound. Works for a power trio specially when the guitar player is soloing . You got the crunch and still a solid bottom. I'd get an ABY splitter that has a phase control

 

[logdrum]

I also have a Peavey 50/50 stereo power amp that can be bridged mono for 100 watt ( goes down to 2 ohms in bridged mode - Most stereo power amps go the opposite ). Then I have an old Demeter tube pre with a Jensen transformer. I think I paid 225 for the both 175 for the Demeter and 50 for the Peavey which I retubed. I sold my Prodigy when I was in California and found those. I used 2 EA Wizzy M Line cabs. I do not know how Peavey squeezed 100 watts out of 8 EL-84s. The Demeter is a very polite preamp as well. Both are rack mounted and the Peavey gets really hot, it can be used to cook eggs.