Double Bass Instrument Finish and Workmanship

[Michael Pearce]

I've been playing electric bass for a little while now, and I have a growing urge to acquire and learn how to play a double bass. However, every time I go into a store to look at one, I'm always turned off by what I perceive as very low quality finish and workmanship. I'm talking about uneven stains, runs in the finish, sawdust embedded in the finish. I'm talking about thickly-applied, self-leveling semi-opaque finishes that have clearly been applied in a single coat. I'm talking about cheaply stamped brass plates that are poorly aligned with the scroll work. Today, I went into a store with the widest selection I've ever seen, and they were all like that, including instruments priced above $7000.

Am I unaware of something about double basses that necessitates this? Am I unfairly judging this workmanship? Is it unrealistic of me to expect a finish that is at least a good as any $50 wooden product made in Asia? What am I missing?

 

[Jeff Bonny]

I'd hope not to be seeing sawdust or runs in the finish on a $7K bass. That said a new $7K bass is still more than likely going to be a factory Chinese instrument and perfection is not a reasonable expectation. You do realize that $7K for a double bass barely equates to a MIM Fender P bass? From a sonic point of view it's a non issue....the only thing to watch for here is overspray. From a re-sale point of view you're going to take such a gigantic hit anyway when you sell a bass you bought new it's also kind of a non-issue.

You might get a better response if you give brands and models and pics.

 

[drurb]

$7k will buy you a nice DB. At that price-point, one is typically speaking of nice hybrids to decent, but relatively inexpensive carved basses. It's fair to say that $7k is above average for the budget of a first DB. I don't know where you've been shopping, but at $7k, one should not expect to find, nor does one typically find, the types of obvious flaws you've mentioned so long as one is considering reputable makers. As Jeff points out, you won't find near-perfection, but it doesn't sound like you're expecting it. If you look very closely, you will find minor blemishes here and there on basses in that price range but, again, nothing of the sort you've mentioned. Finishes and alignment of parts are usually far superior to what you've described. I wouldn't expect to find, nor would I accept, what you're describing even on basses at half that price. Oh, by the way-- cheap finishes can certainly compromise the sound of the instrument.

So, perhaps you could give a bit more information about what you've seen and where, although we sure don't want to start a brand/shop war!

 

[Eric Hochberg]

You could take some pictures of what you describe, too.

 

[T-Bird]

Hi.

Am I unaware of something about double basses that necessitates this? Am I unfairly judging this workmanship? Is it unrealistic of me to expect a finish that is at least a good as any $50 wooden product made in Asia? What am I missing?

The level of automation.
If anything.

It's entirely one thing to use a track router or a NC machinery to carve a slab and neck out of firewood, and another to carve a scroll by hand.
There are NC carved scrolls, necks, and tops out there as well though .

However, every time I go into a store to look at one, I'm always turned off by what I perceive as very low quality finish and workmanship. I'm talking about uneven stains, runs in the finish, sawdust embedded in the finish. I'm talking about thickly-applied, self-leveling semi-opaque finishes that have clearly been applied in a single coat. I'm talking about cheaply stamped brass plates that are poorly aligned with the scroll work.

+1 for the pics Mr. Hochberg suggested.

Save for the unidentified eastern block ply I have, all my classical instruments have been less than 1500€ CC's, DB's and Cellos.

The runt of the litter Sam Jin's and Sonata's mainly no less.

None of those have exhibited the flaws You mention, and neither has any other CCB I've seen.

I haven't been around too many ~5000€ DB's, but I can't imagine them being worse than the cheapest ones.

Regards
Sam

 

[drurb]

Hi.



The level of automation.
If anything.

It's entirely one thing to use a track router or a NC machinery to carve a slab and neck out of firewood, and another to carve a scroll by hand.
There are NC carved scrolls, necks, and tops out there as well though .



+1 for the pics Mr. Hochberg suggested.

Save for the unidentified eastern block ply I have, all my classical instruments have been less than 1500€ CC's, DB's and Cellos.

The runt of the litter Sam Jin's and Sonata's mainly no less.

None of those have exhibited the flaws You mention, and neither has any other CCB I've seen.

I haven't been around too many ~5000€ DB's, but I can't imagine them being worse than the cheapest ones.

Regards
Sam

One would expect that DBs created almost completely from automated processes would exhibit very few idiosyncratic "flaws" in terms of the woodwork. What Michael seems to be point to, though, are flaws in the processes that are related to the work done by hand (finish, alignment of parts) and the quality of the hardware (tuning plates, etc.). I agree that it's rare to see the type of shoddy workmanship he describes even on entry-level instruments that are well-regarded, much less on $7k basses. As Eric and you mentioned, pics would be very revealing.

 

[arnoldschnitzer]

In the realm of handmade string instruments, it is accepted and expected that there exist some evidence of the maker's hand tool usage. Some tool marks, such as those left by a gouge or scraper, are encouraged. In fact, at the maker competitions judges will often mark down an instrument that looks too perfect, sometimes referring to its texture as looking "sanded" rather than carved. (Ask me how I know!) A monochromatic, even finish is also discouraged, as this is the look of a factory fiddle. But significant drips, sawdust in the varnish, and misaligned parts should not be present on instruments at any price range.

 

[Eric Rene Roy]

In the realm of handmade string instruments, it is accepted and expected that there exist some evidence of the maker's hand tool usage. Some tool marks, such as those left by a gouge or scraper, are encouraged.

And it's a great balancing act! Clean enough to show off your skill but tool marks enough to show your hand...and all without looking contrived!

 

[Eric Hochberg]

Perfect imperfection. I assume antiqued finishing is discouraged?

 

[John Sprague]

I have bumped into situations where for some reason I'm showing instruments to folks who are primarily guitar or band focused, and get comments that gee that lacquer varnish looks great on the entry level instrument, but what is this uneven, dull (matt) hand-applied looking stuff on this expensive one? My point Michael is maybe it will take a bit of getting used to violin looks as compared to anything else. It's a different standard. Not saying better or worse, just different. Ken Smith's website is a good example in contrast. His electric basses look incredibly pristine and well finished, yet the older double basses that he deals in look like they've lived through several wars (and many have). Both beautiful.

One thing is for sure: bassists often gravitate toward instruments that are so ugly only a blind mother could love it.

 

[drurb]

Old instruments with wear and tool marks showing desired imperfection are one set of things. What the OP was complaining about are quite different. He was talking about real flaws that were the result of poor workmanship. Arnold's comments served to reinforce the distinction.