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Is an Acoustic bass worth it
- Thread starter Kalsarikannit
- Start date
I feel like specifying: "their own soundS and vibeS", as there is a difference to be heard among the ways the vibration of the strings is being picked up: using a piëzo-acoustic pick-up (at the bridge or elsewhere on the body), a microphone or a magnetic pick-up.
Getting on steam: obviously, the same applies to guitars. So, if an acoustic guitar and any bass guitar compete for being heard, it's not necessarily the bass that must adapt.
I'd think that the difference in pick-up style becomes more audible (and therefore relevant) of the notes played are longer. I wouldn't insist on an acoustic bass in funky playing, but I would when the bass is to provide the harmonic basis for a ballad or a piece of swing. Moreover, I'd use round-wound strings in funky stuff and flat-wound strings for said basis. (I'm not yet familiar with tape-wound strings.)
(I played my older acoustic bass guitar on somebody's demo recording, using both a stick-on acoustic pick-up and a sound-hole humbucker (intended for guitar), inspired by upright-bass players at a jazz club. I loved mimicking a tuba on my older solid-body bass guitar. These and my newer acoustic bass guitar have flat-wound strings.)
I've got an acoustic that can hold its own against a dreadnaught - but it's a 3/4 size upright. My Spector Timbre is fine for the back porch or a small campfire singalong with one guitar. In a larger setting or against more instruments the combo amp comes out.
But, almost every gig I've played in the last 20 years every instrument onstage is amplified somehow. If it's an "acoustic" set I bring my ABG and/or my upright…and plug in with everyone else.
But, almost every gig I've played in the last 20 years every instrument onstage is amplified somehow. If it's an "acoustic" set I bring my ABG and/or my upright…and plug in with everyone else.
Wise words. I had a Kala, and didn't like it because it was too "fiddly" (although the sound was great). ABGs look great, but they are something of a flawed concept, in my view.
It doesn't really though. Assuming you get rid of the horrible phosphor bronze strings (which are the worst things about ABGs, in my view), it sounds like a fully hollow bass with a piezio pickup (which is after all what it is). There are other ways to get that sound. I can get pretty much ABG sound with a Hofner hollowbody, and pretty close with a Guild semi-hollow.
I don't know what the gig was, but DBs can hold their own without amplification in many scenarios (and have been doing so since before their was amplification). ABGs can't. You are therefore going for the "look" only. To be honest, DBs are pretty much about the "look" nowadays too, which is why lots of jazzers play electrics.
Agree about the vibe (although I would call it "look"). Disagree about sound. There are ways you can get that out of a hollowbody Hofner.
If you leave the phosphor bronze strings on, play with a pick, and dig in, that is true, but I wasn't prepared to do the first two.
I just had a look to see whether I had any pics of ABGs I'd owned, and I found this one. It reminded me of just how huge the Earthwood was (the Martin next to it is pretty much dreadnought size). The Earthwood was so huge you could hear it against a steel string if you used a pick, but it was difficult to play because of its size. I still have a Guild B-30, which isn't small, but I like it because the neck fees the same as that on my Guild Starfire (which is my main gigging bass).
Do you think I bought my second acoustic bass guitar for the looks rather than the sound, some forty years after the first one? And how about the guitarron mentioned a day ago?
And yes, you could argue that these acoustic instruments often needs amplifying. Big deal: after all it's the power of a mere finger movement that you'd want heard across some audience, moreover transmitted as an air wave in a frequency range that our ears aren't particularly sensible in. In a dedicated concert hall, with a dedicated (silent!) audience, that might succeed. Otherwise, you'll obviously need amplification, but still the characteristics of a resonating instrument body would be heard, at least when using a microphone or a piëzo-acoustic pick-up. Far less so when using magnetic pick-ups.
Never played one. Never even seen one in the flesh, to be honest. I'd like to have a go on one, but I don't think there are a lot here in Australia. From photos I have seen, they seem to have a big body, but a short neck. I get your "vibrations" comment (one comment that I often annoy my band mates with is "I want to hear my fingerprints coming out of the speaker"), but if I want a "hollow" sound, and have to be plugged in anyway, I'll reach for something other than an ABG.
I love my little Guild ABG, but the vast majority of the most famous folk songs and acoustic guitar-driven singer/songwriter hits ever written, were accompanied by a P-bass or some other electric slab. When it comes to large events, even upright bass and drums are usually amplified at Folk and Bluegrass festivals.
This idea that you need an ABG to support acoustic music is just a poorly-considered assumption.
Take James Taylor, Joni Mitchell, Neil Young, Pentangle, Jim Croce, Stephen Stills, Dylan, Gordon Lightfoot, CSN, Steve Bell, Pierce Pettis, Judy Collins, Dan Hill, Laura Nyro, Pete Seeger, Bruce Cockburn, Fairport Convention, Paul Simon, Don Ross, Steeleye Span, etc. Pile all their albums up to the ceiling, and there'll be nary an ABG track in the whole lot.
For the most part, ABG's only became popular as a visual style choice thanks to MTV Unplugged.
The only practical reason to pick up an ABG, is because you literally want to play somewhere with no AC power and can't get hold of an acoustic upright, or because you have a specific sound in your head that you can't get from your other basses.
This idea that you need an ABG to support acoustic music is just a poorly-considered assumption.
Take James Taylor, Joni Mitchell, Neil Young, Pentangle, Jim Croce, Stephen Stills, Dylan, Gordon Lightfoot, CSN, Steve Bell, Pierce Pettis, Judy Collins, Dan Hill, Laura Nyro, Pete Seeger, Bruce Cockburn, Fairport Convention, Paul Simon, Don Ross, Steeleye Span, etc. Pile all their albums up to the ceiling, and there'll be nary an ABG track in the whole lot.
For the most part, ABG's only became popular as a visual style choice thanks to MTV Unplugged.
The only practical reason to pick up an ABG, is because you literally want to play somewhere with no AC power and can't get hold of an acoustic upright, or because you have a specific sound in your head that you can't get from your other basses.
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Absolutely correct! Certainly nobody in the 1960s used an ABG, because they didn't come out until 1972!
"This idea that you need an ABG to support acoustic music is just a poorly-considered assumption." - I can't remember any of us assuming so.
"For the most part, ABG's only became popular as a visual style choice thanks to MTV Unplugged." - Maybe, but I have never heard of that program.
"The only practical reason to pick up an ABG, is because you literally want to play somewhere with no AC power and can't get hold of an acoustic upright, or because you have a specific sound in your head that you can't get from your other basses." - Well, I might have been able to get hold of an upright bass, but my musical hearing is inadequate. (I have an acoustic and an electric violin waiting for the miracle to happen.) Besides, I have always been limited to bicycles and public transport. (The bicycle shouldn't have been a problem, as I once met a man who had weekly(?) carried his upright bass on his bike for some 12km, and I remember riding home at night through Amsterdam city next to a friend who carried somebody on the baggage rack holding an upright bass.)
You must not have been round in the 1990s then. A heap of major artists did MTV Unplugged shows, and some "Unplugged" albums were mega sellers. Clapton's "Unplugged" album sold more than 25 million copies.
So what? I bought my first acoustic bass guitar around 1981, I'm not sure if I even had access to MTV in the 1990s, and I have a life beside music.
Setup and string height make a huge difference to how loud an AGB will go. It also matters to how good they sound acoustically and amplified. All the ones I play in stores are setup with low action so as not to terrify electric bass players. These are useless as acoustic instruments to play with other acoustic instruments. But if you set one up with higher action more like an upright a good ABG with a large body like a Stoll or a Taylor AB-2 among others will in fact keep up with a strummed acoustic guitar...easily. Contrast that to an upright bass with super low action which won't.
I'd bet that most people adamant you can't get useful acoustic volume out of an ABG have never played a good one set up for maximum acoustic volume. Or tried a bunch of different strings to find out what works. The stock bronze strings with their loss of bottom end and string noise imo are about the worst sounding strings you can use on an ABG.
I'd also guess that a large number of those people have not spent any real time learning to draw sound out of an ABG. This is really where the rubber meets the road. Your light electric bass touch won't cut it and neither will just banging at it harder. Getting pleasing sound and more volume out of any acoustic instrument is a different touch than playing a solid body. It takes a lot time and practice. Even with many years playing the double bass it took me a while to start to figure it out on an ABG...and I'm still working on it over twenty years in.
I don't have any illusions any of this this will change the minds of those folks who already have theirs firmly made up.
But for all y'all who are on the fence don't think those ABG's you've played off the rack in music stores are where it's at volume-wise. If you get one (or have one) and want it louder and better sounding have it set up with the strings a little higher than you are comfortable with and try set of nickel rounds. Then spend some time finding the volume. If you do the work there's more sound there than most people think. What you learn will directly effect the sound you can get electric out of an electric bass for the better too. This alone makes having an ABG "worth it".
I'd bet that most people adamant you can't get useful acoustic volume out of an ABG have never played a good one set up for maximum acoustic volume. Or tried a bunch of different strings to find out what works. The stock bronze strings with their loss of bottom end and string noise imo are about the worst sounding strings you can use on an ABG.
I'd also guess that a large number of those people have not spent any real time learning to draw sound out of an ABG. This is really where the rubber meets the road. Your light electric bass touch won't cut it and neither will just banging at it harder. Getting pleasing sound and more volume out of any acoustic instrument is a different touch than playing a solid body. It takes a lot time and practice. Even with many years playing the double bass it took me a while to start to figure it out on an ABG...and I'm still working on it over twenty years in.
I don't have any illusions any of this this will change the minds of those folks who already have theirs firmly made up.
But for all y'all who are on the fence don't think those ABG's you've played off the rack in music stores are where it's at volume-wise. If you get one (or have one) and want it louder and better sounding have it set up with the strings a little higher than you are comfortable with and try set of nickel rounds. Then spend some time finding the volume. If you do the work there's more sound there than most people think. What you learn will directly effect the sound you can get electric out of an electric bass for the better too. This alone makes having an ABG "worth it".
Maton Bindara B60 (1968) and Harptone B4 (1967). Also, the viola baixo (ABG) is old hat in Portugal.
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