Is the Berg Forte HP too HP?

[Whale]

In defense of RichSynder, I had my speakers blown from someone accidentally turning a volume knob. Back in the early 80s we had a lead singer who thought he was the second coming of Mick Jagger. During one gig he was bouncing around stage like a half-crazed chimp, tripped on his mic chord, and fell against my bass head. My bass became SUPER loud for a split second and then there was nothing but a weak buzz. He had somehow cranked the volume on my Fender 400PS knob to 10. I can’t remember how many watts the 400 put out, but it completely and instantly trashed the speakers in both of my cabs.

As for the Forte HP, I have one and swear by it. The even sweep of the volume knob is just one great aspect. I am constantly adjusting the controls on my bass and my amp to fit the song being played so my favorite features of the amp are the wide array of tones, the clarity of the sound, and the incredible amount of “punch” it gives me. I cannot count the number of times I’ve had other bassists come up to ask what head I’m using. I’ve become sort of a Bergantino evangelist.

My only gripe is that the power switch is on the back of the amp. I have my head in a rack so it’s a bit of a pain to reach back and turn it on or off. But other than that small issue, the Forte HP is (by a VERY VERY wide margin) the best amp I’ve ever owned in the 40+ years I’ve been playing.

 

[pepj]

My point was that at 1200W there aren't a lot of cabs out there that can handle 1200W, bigger cabs tend to be 4 ohm. The feature set of the amp in question would be nice with lower wattage, but I'm afraid of watts and sports cars. Anyways, not an issue any longer. Thx.

I wanted it for the 2ohm facility, so I could hook up multiple cabs. I no longer need that, and have a 750w cab that goes loud enough. I don't think 1200w is an issue for me per se, but it is when the only use it gets is as a practice amp at home.

 

[rodl2005]

I’m sorry that I ever mentioned anything about Berg. I will not ever again.

And don't do it again. Ever.

But seriously.... I don't think anyone thought you were slagging off Berg, or being stupid.
Like others have mentioned, I've never had a volume knob 'accident' in my 40+ yrs of playing.... but that's not to say it can't happen. Someone mentioned above that it happened to them.
It's, in my opinion, probably easier to fall off stage, yank yr lightweight amp offa it's cab and make a right mess o things...

I use the BAmp into small cabs all the time, and it's no slouch with its 700 or 800w.

TBH I've never blown a speaker in my bass playing days, I always listen carefully.... I think I've gotten closer to it with my all tube 300w Super Bassman into its matching Bassman Pro Neo 115. But careful listening and adjustments to my EQ and/or volume negated the chances

 

[Geddy Claypool]

Extreme necropost, but seems relevant to the topic here. I just picked up a Forte HP2 which I LOVE. I'm going to re-evaluate my cab situation soon, but currently I have a Schroeder 1x12 (600W 8ohm) and an Ampeg 212AV (600W 4ohm).

Since the Forte HP2 is rated at 600W 8ohm and 1200W 4ohm, ironically the little Schroeder is pretty well suited to the head. But I'm a little more concerned about the Ampeg. I've read everything here about gain structure and how to be mindful and listen carefully for signs of distress in the speaker. But I still can't shake the feeling that the margin for error with the 4ohm Ampeg is pretty small. I can use the built-in high pass filter on the Forte to get rid of some extra low frequencies, and the cab sounds clear and full with the input gain at about 1 o clock and the master volume at maybe 10:30pm (as loud as I've needed to go when competing with dueling guitars in my heavy band). But still, I find myself being scared of pushing too much distortion through it with pedals, hitting too many ultra low notes (5 string tuned to low A or even sometimes low G), or slapping through it. Like I feel like I can't relax and just play because I'm always listening carefully in the band mix for any signs of speaker distress.

Any advice here? Much ado about nothing? Or reasonable chance for an accident waiting to happen? Thanks yall.

 

[5StringPocket]

Extreme necropost, but seems relevant to the topic here. I just picked up a Forte HP2 which I LOVE. I'm going to re-evaluate my cab situation soon, but currently I have a Schroeder 1x12 (600W 8ohm) and an Ampeg 212AV (600W 4ohm).

Since the Forte HP2 is rated at 600W 8ohm and 1200W 4ohm, ironically the little Schroeder is pretty well suited to the head. But I'm a little more concerned about the Ampeg. I've read everything here about gain structure and how to be mindful and listen carefully for signs of distress in the speaker. But I still can't shake the feeling that the margin for error with the 4ohm Ampeg is pretty small. I can use the built-in high pass filter on the Forte to get rid of some extra low frequencies, and the cab sounds clear and full with the input gain at about 1 o clock and the master volume at maybe 10:30pm (as loud as I've needed to go when competing with dueling guitars in my heavy band). But still, I find myself being scared of pushing too much distortion through it with pedals, hitting too many ultra low notes (5 string tuned to low A or even sometimes low G), or slapping through it. Like I feel like I can't relax and just play because I'm always listening carefully in the band mix for any signs of speaker distress.

Any advice here? Much ado about nothing? Or reasonable chance for an accident waiting to happen? Thanks yall.

Running a 4ohm and 8ohm cab in parallel for a 2.67 ohm load should get around 600 watts to the 4ohm cab and 300 watts to the 8ohm cab at full volume. I run my Forte HP gain about 1:00 and the master around 10:30 as well and it is loud but nowhere near full volume, so your power to the cabs should be okay. Two things that help protect your speakers are use of the HPF to limit power from the lowest frequencies which can cause over excursion and the compressor (VRC) which can help limit your dynamic peaks which can also cause damage.

However, a cab’s mechanical limit at lower frequencies, not the advertised thermal rating, is the real power limit and may be substantially lower. Adjusting the HPF at robust volume while listening to the cabs lets you keep the low end tight while maintaining enough depth not to sound thin. Just don’t expect the cabs to deliver something they aren’t capable of. If you need something capable of very loud and low with distortion, I’d invest in a cab like the Barefaced Big Twin 3 or some other high performance cab which can handle anything you could throw at it.

 

[JohnnyBottom]

Extreme necropost, but seems relevant to the topic here. I just picked up a Forte HP2 which I LOVE. I'm going to re-evaluate my cab situation soon, but currently I have a Schroeder 1x12 (600W 8ohm) and an Ampeg 212AV (600W 4ohm).

Since the Forte HP2 is rated at 600W 8ohm and 1200W 4ohm, ironically the little Schroeder is pretty well suited to the head. But I'm a little more concerned about the Ampeg. I've read everything here about gain structure and how to be mindful and listen carefully for signs of distress in the speaker. But I still can't shake the feeling that the margin for error with the 4ohm Ampeg is pretty small. I can use the built-in high pass filter on the Forte to get rid of some extra low frequencies, and the cab sounds clear and full with the input gain at about 1 o clock and the master volume at maybe 10:30pm (as loud as I've needed to go when competing with dueling guitars in my heavy band). But still, I find myself being scared of pushing too much distortion through it with pedals, hitting too many ultra low notes (5 string tuned to low A or even sometimes low G), or slapping through it. Like I feel like I can't relax and just play because I'm always listening carefully in the band mix for any signs of speaker distress.

Any advice here? Much ado about nothing? Or reasonable chance for an accident waiting to happen? Thanks yall.

Put the Forte in 2ohm mode while running the single 4ohm cab. That will cut the wattage to a safer point, otherwise you may blow the cab imho.

 

[Geddy Claypool]

Running a 4ohm and 8ohm cab in parallel for a 2.67 ohm load should get around 600 watts to the 4ohm cab and 300 watts to the 8ohm cab at full volume. I run my Forte HP gain about 1:00 and the master around 10:30 as well and it is loud but nowhere near full volume, so your power to the cabs should be okay. Two things that help protect your speakers are use of the HPF to limit power from the lowest frequencies which can cause over excursion and the compressor (VRC) which can help limit your dynamic peaks which can also cause damage.

Good tips, thank you. And good to know about how the wattage gets distributed when running at 2.67 ohms. But I usually run the cabs in isolation, so the Ampeg is potentially getting the full 1200 watt load when running alone.

Put the Forte in 2ohm mode while running the single 4ohm cab. That will cut the wattage to a safer point, otherwise you may blow the cab imho.

Could you please explain how 2ohm mode distributes the load when running just a single cab? Does it just automatically send 600 watts maximum to each speaker output?

 

[5StringPocket]

Good tips, thank you. And good to know about how the wattage gets distributed when running at 2.67 ohms. But I usually run the cabs in isolation, so the Ampeg is potentially getting the full 1200 watt load when running alone.


Could you please explain how 2ohm mode distributes the load when running just a single cab? Does it just automatically send 600 watts maximum to each speaker output?

The amp does not send 600 watts to each output. It is a mono amp, not stereo, and the two speaker outputs are in parallel so there is no isolation between them. The gain and master regulate signal output voltage across the pair which is distributed to whatever load (combination of cabs) is connected to them. Two-ohm mode limits the output voltage so that too much power is not applied to the load. 1200 watts at 2 ohms should translate to about 600 watts at 4 ohms which should be a safer way to run your 4-ohm cab. Jim Bergantino could explain better but this is my understanding.