Is There A Future For Tube Amps?

[JimmyM]

I am both of these people, but under different circumstances. At gig volumes, I think the nuances of an all-tube rig get lost in the mix. I find it is much easier if I simply run with a nice clean signal from a solid state rig and then let the PA guy/girl work his/her magic.

There was a short time I bought into that when I first switch from being exclusively tube to exclusively hybrid in 1998. Then I got a B-15 a couple years later and realized that it's wrong SS can sound absolutely wonderful on a gig, but even in the live environment, I can tell.

 

[jamro217]

I think that as long as there is a market for a product, someone somewhere will produce it. Maybe not as prevalent or as upscale as you'd like, but there'd be some variation available. If there is enough of a demand, more than one company will manufacture the product and a healthy competition will arise. I can't see tube amps disappearing entirely, but tastes change and they may come and go in prominence. I like to use a tube preamp with a solid state head. Lighter weight, and I have the ability to bypass the preamp and run straight through the amp.

 

[JimmyM]

Just out of curiosity, those of you who swear by tube amps . . . do you like a slightly overdriven tone?
I really prefer a very clean bass tone so I would think that would require a pretty hi wattage tube amp.

I LOVE a slightly overdriven tone, but I only want to hear overdrive when I want to hear it and the rest of the time I want clean. For me, my 25w B-15 will accomplish this if I keep the volume down on it, but there are times it's too quiet for us, although after going a little too far the other way, we're all making a conscious effort to bring stage volume down a little so the B-15 s back in the realm of possibility. But I can totally run a 100w V4B clean on the gig and never run out of clean headroom. Of course, the SVT is king for clean headroom, but I get plenty for my purposes out of the V4B. And yes, I've heard the "tubes don't matter if all you want is clean tones," and it's BS revisionist history done by kids today who see some of their favorites cranking tube amps hard and thinking that's all they're good for or by old farts who have a thing against tube amps.

Bands that are big enough to have a road crew will always use tube bass amps or rack systems. Bands that aren't will use micros more often because it's easier. That's really all its about.

While I'm quite happy with the performance of my micros, I believe this to be true. I've informally polled many backline company owners, and requesting micro heads seemingly never happens, although Clair Bros at Hershey Park did bring a Markbass SD1200 as a backup to the SVT they brought for me last year. And while I know some major players like Rocco Prestia, Jeff Berlin, and John Paul Jones have gone micro, the vast majority have not. And quite frankly, the only reason I ever bring micros is due to space or unusual schlep considerations. I bring a 40 lb V4B a lot more than an 80 lb SVT but I still bring tubes to most gigs.

 

[Jughead6]

There was a short time I bought into that when I first switch from being exclusively tube to exclusively hybrid in 1998. Then I got a B-15 a couple years later and realized that it's wrong SS can sound absolutely wonderful on a gig, but even in the live environment, I can tell.

I have to admit that I have been GASing for a B-15. One day, I may indulge myself.

 

[markjazzbassist]

it doesn't matter. the manufacturers don't make products for pros now, they make them for the people who buy them who are mostly hobbyest musicians. no problem or judgement there, just they are making 15000 dollar coffee table basses of which 5% of bass players who are pros use. the doctors, lawyers, accountants, etc who make more than most can afford these. road dogs making 25k or less a year touring and playing in bands cannot.

the most used rig of all time is fender bass, ampeg amp. passive and tube, classic. don't care how much hybrid, class D, sizzling tweeters are selling, I have never been in a studio where an engineer has said "hey man can i get that class D solid state type sound". they all say the same thing "flats into a tube amp, you've got the right idea kid, thanks"

 

[mistergoats]

It seems that the demand for Tubes is dwindling each year.

MORE TUBES FOR THE TUBE EATERS!

 

[nysbob]

There's definitely a future for my 40 year old tube amps, because I'm not going to quit using them on the gig until they don't work anymore, and they're showing no signs of that. And to whoever asked, I don't overdrive them...I have pedals that do that. That's probably part of the reason these amps are so friggin' reliable...they aren't really stressed.

 

[pauljude]

Class D amps have such a nice tube like sound...or..many companies have the pre amp 2ax7 or whatever its called in there. My Mark Bass has this and it sounds so much like a full tube amp....But....the all tube head will always be around, believe me.

 

[beans-on-toast]

There's definitely a future for my 40 year old tube amps, because I'm not going to quit using them on the gig until they don't work anymore, and they're showing no signs of that. And to whoever asked, I don't overdrive them...I have pedals that do that. That's probably part of the reason these amps are so friggin' reliable...they aren't really stressed.

And with less stress comes longer tube life.

 

[Mugre]

Double Bass? There's craftsmen still making viola de gambas. The original 5 string!

 

[Weberman]

Thanks for confirming my comment.

I love my Swart STR-Tremolo and I did considerable research before buying it.

I've tried a lot of emulations where the sound was as dead-on as my ears allow me to discern (guitar, mind you). In actually playing them, however, I quickly discovered that there is great difficulty in replicating the entire tube "experience". I have never found an emulation that actually responded the same way as a tube amp into a cabinet. The system, as a whole, has a way of "gluing" things together in a way that is difficult to replicate with absolute precision (in my experience). Think of the way that applying light compression to a bus makes things come together.

I'm sure parity will happen quite soon. Musical luddites love anachronisms, though. Tube amps will stick around for the foreseeable future.

Tubes are like the new Coke - they'll be around forever.

 

[Jeff Scott]

The 300B tube, developed so long ago, is still milestone in audio that audiophiles hold in awe..

Yes, and the more it costs the more in awe they are.

 

[JimmyM]

it doesn't matter. the manufacturers don't make products for pros now, they make them for the people who buy them who are mostly hobbyest musicians. no problem or judgement there, just they are making 15000 dollar coffee table basses of which 5% of bass players who are pros use. the doctors, lawyers, accountants, etc who make more than most can afford these. road dogs making 25k or less a year touring and playing in bands cannot.

If only pros bought instruments, nobody could afford to stay in business.

 

[beans-on-toast]

Yes, and the more it costs the more in awe they are.

I can only imagine how a pair would sound in a bass amp with a super efficient speaker cab. Might take a B15 to the next level.

 

[zombie1965]

Class D amps have such a nice tube like sound...or..many companies have the pre amp 2ax7 or whatever its called in there. My Mark Bass has this and it sounds so much like a full tube amp....But....the all tube head will always be around, believe me.

I really, really don't get it when people say "My Mark Bass has this and it sounds so much like a full tube amp" or the person last week who I replied to on another thread claiming the same about his Fender Rumble ALL class D . I have never heard ether of these two Amps put out anything remotely tube sounding. The mark bass heads with tube sound very class D to me, the tube doesn't really add anything. OK they have the benefits of being loud, light and clean sounding (If you like that kinda thing), but that's just it, they sound sterile to me, characterless!

I would love to use an all tube rig all of the time, and indeed own a SVT all tube head, (its broken right now. its also 26 years old) but the expense puts them a bit out of reach for me. I also settle for a hybrid, its a compromise! Not as sterile as a Class D, but definitely not a full fat tube amp.

I demo all sorts of kit for people in my local music shop, I get to extensively test and even record with many amps in the back room of the shop, and trust me not all tube amps sound alike, but they all have a character, even if its just the pre to a degree. Its a colour to the richness of the sound.... SS amps just don't have this!

I think you should go try some full tubes and see what I mean.

To all the class D mini amp queens.....
Are we all getting that lazy that lugging a heavy amp a few feet from the van to the venue and back to the van is an issue?

I laugh at The Li'l tiny overtone free and harmonically lacking class D's. They are just toys!

 

[scotch]

I think the "future of tube amps" is about the same as the "future of online threads about the future of tube amps".

We're not getting rid of either anytime soon! ;-)

 

[SanDiegoHarry]

It appears that newer SS circuits are doing a great job of providing tone, and few folks want to schlep a tube power amp... so yes - fewer tube amps. But I suspect that there will always be folks who want a tube amp. I, for one, am not one of them.

 

[nostatic]

forward into the past

 

[Mastermold]

It has already happened, and it will never happen.

What I mean is, there are people who are already satisfied with their tone when using solid state gear, even those who feel that they can satisfactorily capture the essence of tube sound.

And there are those who will never be satisfied unless it's all tubes. It's really up to the personal satisfaction of each player.

Gaining a consensus on this issue is insurmountable, but at the same time, I don't see the diversity of gear choices and opinions as harmful.

I usually use one of my SVT-CLs but this weekend used my Genz Benz Streamliner--great amp, doesn't sound like an SVT but sounds great in its own right.

 

[zombie1965]

forward into the past

I build small rigs like this, but 30-50w with a tube pre and power amp, with an integrated DI after the power amp side of the tubes, you can then run it into the PA or a class D power amp to boost further, my builds can be run without a cab as long as there is a lead plugged into the Direct out.