I’ve been looking at buying an upton mittenwald and I was wondering if a fully carved was worth 1,500 dollars more. Any advice?
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Double Bass Is there a huge difference between hybrids and fully carved?
- Thread starter Bassplayer1836
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I think you'd have to answer that question by trying each one side by side. Basses tend to be individualistic and so do players. In general, fully carved means a more professional instrument, but hybrids can be very useful professionally as travel basses, being more durable. Of course the sound of either has to be there to make either worthwhile.
Haven't been able to compare basses before now since never had them side by side when shopping.
But I've played the same model classical guitar with solid back/sides vs ply. It was night and day. Fuller, louder, more sonorous sound from the solid wood every time.
But yes, I know a lot of players who leave their carved instruments at home and take the ply to outdoor or iffy gigs.
But I've played the same model classical guitar with solid back/sides vs ply. It was night and day. Fuller, louder, more sonorous sound from the solid wood every time.
But yes, I know a lot of players who leave their carved instruments at home and take the ply to outdoor or iffy gigs.
It was for me... I played a brand new ply, and hybrid (both Shen), and a fully carved (older, beat up, Eastern European) next to each other, over an hour or so, switching back and forth between them. Even though the carved was out of my budget, I bought it anyway. It just sounded that much better to my ears!
I own a hybrid and an old carved bass feel a pretty big difference in sound and ease of playing - the aspect plywood owners generally don't take into account. A carved bass is going to better in general, however, a well set up hybrid will not hold you back for arco or jazz pizz player.
- Mar 19, 2002
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Knowing we make & sell them, and that I obviously have a "dog in the hunt" here, IMO a laminated flatback and a solid wood flat back get dangerously close to each other tone wise in pizz, but the gap widens dramatically under the bow. The reason for the closeness is bracing and mechanics.
can you elaborate on this? I know how much a difference my last setup made to the way my bass felt in my hands (I can almost 'feel' if I am in tune), and thus the playability...is this what you mean?
When you play a nicely set up fully carved bass once you get it moving every sound is easier to make until you stop, it is play being able to ride momentum, but, it is vibration. This is arco or pizz as well as amplified, which is why it is still better to have a carved instrument when you use an amp.
It happens to a point with a hybrid, which is why you loose the nasal or scratchy-ness at the bow change, but less. A plywood bass shuts down the vibration faster and is more laborious to play, the individual notes can sound good, but, you are working harder for each one.
It happens to a point with a hybrid, which is why you loose the nasal or scratchy-ness at the bow change, but less. A plywood bass shuts down the vibration faster and is more laborious to play, the individual notes can sound good, but, you are working harder for each one.
i've played many hybrids, but i do not own one.
but i've never thought of a laminate (or hybrid) at all as "more work to play." the dynamic range is without a doubt smaller. the tone on a nice old kay, or any quality laminate, can be really pleasant. as Eric said, the gap widens under the bow. especially in the hands of a good orchestral player, listening from 10 feet in front of the bass, i feel the difference is generally really significant - but i've definitely complimented someones tone before only to learn their bass is a laminate.
but i've never thought of a laminate (or hybrid) at all as "more work to play." the dynamic range is without a doubt smaller. the tone on a nice old kay, or any quality laminate, can be really pleasant. as Eric said, the gap widens under the bow. especially in the hands of a good orchestral player, listening from 10 feet in front of the bass, i feel the difference is generally really significant - but i've definitely complimented someones tone before only to learn their bass is a laminate.
Gearheads spend a lot of time trying to turn small and even nonexistent differences into giant divides.
This is not one of those. There are verifiable, significant differences. But even so there are nuances to consider.
I think of ply, semi-ply and solid as three overlapping circles of sound quality. There are great-sounding plys and semi-plys and there are solid-wood, luthier-built instruments that sound worse than the crates they ship in.
In other words, each category has a bell-curve. Overall, one out of a hundred plys is in the top one percent sonically for plys. (Hey now!) But only one out of a gazillion plys sounds as good as a tippity-top luthier-built solid bass.
But there's another important consideration, and that is what you're doing with the bass. If you travel the globe playing solo recitals or doing recording sessions, most of the time most of your audience is going to really be able to hear the sonic quality of your instrument. If you spend your musical time playing through a pickup and an amp underneath a drum-kit you can tell you're playing a great bass. The people in the second balcony can't hear any difference between Kai Arvi and Kay Manufacturing.
So for a lot of us, the question is, 'How much are you willing to invest in your own satisfaction?'
This is not one of those. There are verifiable, significant differences. But even so there are nuances to consider.
I think of ply, semi-ply and solid as three overlapping circles of sound quality. There are great-sounding plys and semi-plys and there are solid-wood, luthier-built instruments that sound worse than the crates they ship in.
In other words, each category has a bell-curve. Overall, one out of a hundred plys is in the top one percent sonically for plys. (Hey now!) But only one out of a gazillion plys sounds as good as a tippity-top luthier-built solid bass.
But there's another important consideration, and that is what you're doing with the bass. If you travel the globe playing solo recitals or doing recording sessions, most of the time most of your audience is going to really be able to hear the sonic quality of your instrument. If you spend your musical time playing through a pickup and an amp underneath a drum-kit you can tell you're playing a great bass. The people in the second balcony can't hear any difference between Kai Arvi and Kay Manufacturing.
So for a lot of us, the question is, 'How much are you willing to invest in your own satisfaction?'
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The tricky part is to not fall into the "if I only had a better bass (or bow, strings, shoelaces, etc), I would be better" trap.
That said, the more I use the bow (basically ALL my practice, none of my gigs!), the more I am tempted by a carved bass...and I can't think of anyone better I should be satisfying with the music I make (and the money I spend!).
Exactly, it isn't that ply or hybrid basses sound bad across the board - many have a great tone, it is how they react. I get a great sound out of my travel bass (a hybrid) after a tour coming home to my real bass it is almost effortless to play.
Plywood is never going to vibrate as freely as a solid piece of wood in the same conditions, it is basic physics.
