I think if you're seething with rage after 15 minutes of sight reading you've got bigger bass-related problems than finding a new teacher
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Issues with my bass teacher
- Thread starter Smedz
- Start date
wow.....sounds like your teacher is giving you what you need,and since you are fairly early in the game you should listen.....until you know the stuff you need to know you won't be making the music you want to.....there are hundreds of working pro's on here and i doubt if any if them would suggest that you don't need sight reading skills....even the guys that don't read wish they did....learn to read,you'll "preform" better
I'm not necessarily looking to be a solo bassist or a "pro". i'm more along a Punk/Jazz band that's looking to make influential music and add pop elements to it for the hooks. That's why I'm more interested in the basic melody and harmony of music so I can create off that you get what I'm saying?
If you want to learn about music, what you really need is to study songwriting & music composition theory, more than bass lessons. Either on your own or with a songwriter / composer. On the bass, learn how and why a particular bass part works in a song, and what other bass parts could be swapped out.
In either case, you need to know your basics to grow and do your own thing, but don't wait to learn, to write. Write, and learn from what you write, good or bad. Read about Irving Berlin, one of America's greatest composers. He never studied theory he could not read or write music, but he made a point of writing one song a day.
If you want to learn about music, what you really need is to study songwriting & music composition theory, more than bass lessons. Either on your own or with a songwriter / composer. On the bass, learn how and why a particular bass part works in a song, and what other bass parts could be swapped out.
In either case, you need to know your basics to grow and do your own thing, but don't wait to learn, to write. Write, and learn from what you write, good or bad. Read about Irving Berlin, one of America's greatest composers. He never studied theory he could not read or write music, but he made a point of writing one song a day.
- Apr 19, 2004
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I agree that you need to vary your practice, hit your sight reading, theory, ear training every day, and also have FUN, but let me add somthing.
Out of all the composers in the world, Irving Berlin was one guy. For every one guy who couldnt read or didnt know theory, theres a thousand composers who did, who wrote just as good if not better stuff.
Learn to Read, and have fun playing music.
Oh, and if you want to get a good intro to songwriting, learn how to play a good old fashioned blues, chords, scales and all. It doesnt require reading and it teaches you basic music concepts. If you need more help PM me.
Out of all the composers in the world, Irving Berlin was one guy. For every one guy who couldnt read or didnt know theory, theres a thousand composers who did, who wrote just as good if not better stuff.
Learn to Read, and have fun playing music.
Oh, and if you want to get a good intro to songwriting, learn how to play a good old fashioned blues, chords, scales and all. It doesnt require reading and it teaches you basic music concepts. If you need more help PM me.
agreed. this teacher sounds like a very good teacher and you're dumping all over him because you're a hothead. you're trying to run before you can crawl, and your teacher is trying to give you the tools you need to make ear training a lot easier.
this typifies a problem with young musicians these days...they hear their heroes talking about not knowing how to read music or caring about theory and they think they can do it, too. but not everyone can do it. those who can do it are what are known as "flukes." in fact, the vast majority of people who try to play an instrument without knowing the technical nuts and bolts end up quitting in frustration.
and that is exactly where you're headed. remember that if you knew enough about playing to write the lesson plan, you'd be the teacher, not the student. and get some damn patience, for crying out loud! if i were your teacher, i'd have dropped you as a student for being a lazy hothead. your teacher must be a saint to put up with it, or else he really needs the money.
so you have three choices...grow up and do what he tells you, or go get one of those feel-good mall teachers who teaches you what you think you should be learning while leaving you with nothing of value that can be used in a band context, or you can quit.
Think on it this way. In this thread there are 29 posts including mine so do you learn about them by having someone else read them to you and you commit them to memory for future reference or do you read them?
More importantly by being able to read them you get the information first hand and correct as it is written....no
miss-understanding or mistakes about what is required of you.
That is the freedom sight reading gives you in one aspect, it frees you from the hours and hours of committing songs to memory, time better spent on other things later in life.
I personally think you have a great teacher, so speak to him about your problems, he is a music teacher not a mind reader.
More importantly by being able to read them you get the information first hand and correct as it is written....no
miss-understanding or mistakes about what is required of you.
That is the freedom sight reading gives you in one aspect, it frees you from the hours and hours of committing songs to memory, time better spent on other things later in life.
I personally think you have a great teacher, so speak to him about your problems, he is a music teacher not a mind reader.
just follow the teacher and take what u learn outside.
lucky for me, my teacher is a really cool dude. after letting him install my strings i wanted him to be my teacher. its really pressuring, he tests what u know and lets u start from there, then, he teaches me rhythm, and some challenging finger exercises. then teaches me scales to learn solos. and sometimes we go out from formal lessons to teach me a song i want to play, or some slapping even though thats for a more advanced class. ive had a couple teachers and this guy is the best.
i had teachers before who stuck to formal lessons like music sheets and notes. i didnt like it. anyways just tell ur teacher what u want to learn, maybe he will let u
lucky for me, my teacher is a really cool dude. after letting him install my strings i wanted him to be my teacher. its really pressuring, he tests what u know and lets u start from there, then, he teaches me rhythm, and some challenging finger exercises. then teaches me scales to learn solos. and sometimes we go out from formal lessons to teach me a song i want to play, or some slapping even though thats for a more advanced class. ive had a couple teachers and this guy is the best.
i had teachers before who stuck to formal lessons like music sheets and notes. i didnt like it. anyways just tell ur teacher what u want to learn, maybe he will let u
At your next lesson, talk to your teacher about this. Calmly and clearly. Let him know, without breaking things, please
He's right about pushing you. It's his job to push you to your limit. And he's pushing you in the right direction. But after six months, a different approach may be warranted. A good teacher should have more than one way to do things in his bag o' tricks. No student is the same. Not saying that it'll be easy any other way - if it is, he's not pushing you, and you're not pushing yourself. But maybe there's some way to strengthen your chordal/harmonic theory that'll ease your efforts in reading.
Being able to read/write at a functional level is so incredibly helpful for composition. It makes it so that anywhere, at anytime, all you need is a pencil. It gives you a visual avenue to approach with. It's essential for rhythmic theory. You can not claim to study melodic theory without it. It helps you understand WHY things work, which will help you put what you hear and think instantly into practice. It makes you less dependent on your instrument, which is what makes you a musician, not just a bassist.
He's right about pushing you. It's his job to push you to your limit. And he's pushing you in the right direction. But after six months, a different approach may be warranted. A good teacher should have more than one way to do things in his bag o' tricks. No student is the same. Not saying that it'll be easy any other way - if it is, he's not pushing you, and you're not pushing yourself. But maybe there's some way to strengthen your chordal/harmonic theory that'll ease your efforts in reading.
Being able to read/write at a functional level is so incredibly helpful for composition. It makes it so that anywhere, at anytime, all you need is a pencil. It gives you a visual avenue to approach with. It's essential for rhythmic theory. You can not claim to study melodic theory without it. It helps you understand WHY things work, which will help you put what you hear and think instantly into practice. It makes you less dependent on your instrument, which is what makes you a musician, not just a bassist.
First off I've never mentioned that I didnt think theory was important to creating good music. Most of my "Music heroes" are extremely knowledgable in theory and only make me want to learn it even more. I'm NOT becoming infuriated mid-lesson and throwing things and acting immature, I do it when nobody is around. It's a self-control issue and there is no reason for you to be so cruel on me about this.
At your next lesson, talk to your teacher about this. Calmly and clearly. Let him know, without breaking things, please
He's right about pushing you. It's his job to push you to your limit. And he's pushing you in the right direction. But after six months, a different approach may be warranted. A good teacher should have more than one way to do things in his bag o' tricks. No student is the same. Not saying that it'll be easy any other way - if it is, he's not pushing you, and you're not pushing yourself. But maybe there's some way to strengthen your chordal/harmonic theory that'll ease your efforts in reading.
Being able to read/write at a functional level is so incredibly helpful for composition. It makes it so that anywhere, at anytime, all you need is a pencil. It gives you a visual avenue to approach with. It's essential for rhythmic theory. You can not claim to study melodic theory without it. It helps you understand WHY things work, which will help you put what you hear and think instantly into practice. It makes you less dependent on your instrument, which is what makes you a musician, not just a bassist.
+1 thank you.
One thing you did not mention is your age. It is important. Right now you are into Punk/Jazz. Where will you be in 5 years or 10. What skill set will you need then? I teach all my younger students to read both notes and charts. My adult students, with already established careers, I allow to dictate more towards their interests
That being said, anytime that a particular exercise causes frustration, you are NOT learning anything. You should take the lessons and break them up into manageable time slots. If you can practice reading for 5 minutes without getting frustrated, then practice for only 5 minutes and then move on to some free improv, scales or working on some of your bands material. Come back to the reading later. Your teacher needs to understand that. If he/she does not -that is a real problem. Knowing a students learning style and adapting teaching techniques to fit that style is, absolutely, the most important skill a teacher must have.
You do not need to know how to read to be a great player. You do need to know how to read if you want make yourself available for any gig, any time. Reading, like any other technique could be thought of as one more tool in your toolbox.
Mike Dimin
That being said, anytime that a particular exercise causes frustration, you are NOT learning anything. You should take the lessons and break them up into manageable time slots. If you can practice reading for 5 minutes without getting frustrated, then practice for only 5 minutes and then move on to some free improv, scales or working on some of your bands material. Come back to the reading later. Your teacher needs to understand that. If he/she does not -that is a real problem. Knowing a students learning style and adapting teaching techniques to fit that style is, absolutely, the most important skill a teacher must have.
You do not need to know how to read to be a great player. You do need to know how to read if you want make yourself available for any gig, any time. Reading, like any other technique could be thought of as one more tool in your toolbox.
Mike Dimin
Ric5
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- Jan 29, 2008
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If you don't like your bass teacher then quit going. Maybe you need to just play more with bands.
i completely disagree. it all depends on what you mean by "professional". sure, you can get gigs without reading/theory, but i doubt you could make a living. without reading, you eliminate yourself from being considered for any studio work, subbing gigs, teaching, etc. which is how most professionals make a livable income.
maybe you dont have to read to be in a top 40 bar band, but you certainly need to read/know theory to be a professional musician. and if playing bars is what you're content with, by all means skip reading, but if you want to go beyond that theory/reading will only improve your odds.
What you think is cruel, is actualy called tough love.
Alot of the guys on this forum are professional, extremely talented and knowledgable muscians. Jimmy is one of them.
I would listen.
np bud!
Doh. Yeah! Dead on. I totally spaced that. Tattoo this backwards on your forehead. Trust me. The girls will just think you're more hardcore \../
And everything else he said
Absolutely. I'd love to get there just for my own sake as a musician. But, comfort with it for writing is a great tool in your bag. Mind you, I'm a functional illiterate, but it is something, in retrospect, that I -really- wish I had focused on. And that I'm in the process of adding to my arsenal, for all the above reasons.
Doh. Yeah! Dead on. I totally spaced that. Tattoo this backwards on your forehead. Trust me. The girls will just think you're more hardcore \../
And everything else he said
Absolutely. I'd love to get there just for my own sake as a musician. But, comfort with it for writing is a great tool in your bag. Mind you, I'm a functional illiterate, but it is something, in retrospect, that I -really- wish I had focused on. And that I'm in the process of adding to my arsenal, for all the above reasons.
