Double Bass Joining a bluegrass band. Get me up to speed.

[krfoss]

I’ve played bass for 20 years and have messed around with some bluegrass bands and songs with moderate success. But, I want to make this a good experience for me and everyone else.

What advice would you give to someone just stating in bluegrass with an upright? Songs to listen to for a solid understanding of the role of the upright.

Also, am I thinking too hard? Do I just hit the 1s and 5s as hard as I can?

 

[Neon Scribe]

i haven't played very much bluegrass, but the requirements are very similar to gypsy jazz. Number one is keep good time. Lock in with the rhythm instruments and keep it steady. Number two is keep it simple. You are there to let the other musicians feel the pulse and feel the harmonic foundation. If you do nothing but hit the root and fifth on 1 and 3 and keep it steady, you'll be welcome in most settings. (Don't forget to avoid the fifth if the chord is about to change to that root. Play the root twice in that measure unless you're feeling daring and want to play the third instead.) You can walk up or walk down at chord changes, but don't do that on every change. Save it for moving from the verse to the chorus or vice versa, or some other clear transition point in a song. You don't have to do it at all. Less is more!

If you don't have a lot of songs memorized and you don't want or don't have charts, learn to recognize guitar chord shapes. This will help immensely. Bluegrass players use a few open chords almost exclusively, so this isn't hard. It gets tricky because they also rely on the capo, so also learn to transpose those chord shapes.

 

[krfoss]

i haven't played very much bluegrass, but the requirements are very similar to gypsy jazz. Number one is keep good time. Lock in with the rhythm instruments and keep it steady. Number two is keep it simple. You are there to let the other musicians feel the pulse and feel the harmonic foundation. If you do nothing but hit the root and fifth on 1 and 3 and keep it steady, you'll be welcome in most settings. (Don't forget to avoid the fifth if the chord is about to change to that root. Play the root twice in that measure unless you're feeling daring and want to play the third instead.) You can walk up or walk down at chord changes, but don't do that on every change. Save it for moving from the verse to the chorus or vice versa, or some other clear transition point in a song. You don't have to do it at all. Less is more!

If you don't have a lot of songs memorized and you don't want or don't have charts, learn to recognize guitar chord shapes. This will help immensely. Bluegrass players use a few open chords almost exclusively, so this isn't hard. It gets tricky because they also rely on the capo, so also learn to transpose those chord shapes.

I really appreciate this. The advice to play the root twice if the 5th of the current chord is the root of the next. The note on transitions is also well taken. Thank you.

We are mainly playing originals, so we will be making it up as we go along (in a sense). Working on serving the song, but also keeping it rooted in the bluegrass tradition is helpful for me to keep in mind.

 

[Lee Moses]

Yep--roots and 5ths, keep your ears open, and lay down solid time. Expect 60% of tunes to be in D, 30% in G, 5% in A, and 5% in something else.

 

[BobKay]

I've been playing bluegrass bass for approx 45 years. The advice mentioned above is good. Keep it simple; but that doesn't mean just "root - five" and nothing else. While your first job is to make a bed for the lead instruments to play on, you should also try to add some musicality where appropriate. Varying where you play the root is one way; playing the fifth above the root, instead of below, is another. Passing tones and leading notes is another. And sometimes it is appropriate to pedal the root, especially on minor key songs.

Depending on your bandmates, Lee's suggestions on keys may not be totally accurate. If very traditional players, you may find yourself in Bb, B, A, more than D. G is very common. If you have a female singer, you may play tunes in E or F. It's really no different than other music - learn the fingerboard and you'll be fine.

I like the playing of Barry Bales (Alison Krause); the late Jason Moore; and Missy Raines is exceptional, in my opinion.

 

[BobKay]

I also should have mentioned Edgar Meyer. His playing on some of the acoustic projects he's been on is outstanding. Not traditional bluegrass, but informative none the less.
And I forgot Mike Bub, who plays with lots of people. He is a great one to listen to.

 

[marcox]

Pray that you have a solid mandolin player and, if you do, lock in with their chop. The two of you are the kick and snare of the collective rhythm section that is a bluegrass band.

Lots of 1 and 5, of course, but there's plenty variety to be found within those confines. There are also opportunities to (judiciously) add thirds and sevenths, walk up/down into transitions, etc.

My current favorite album is "Bluegrass Vacation" from Robbie Folks. Top-drawer playing by an all-star cast, from a songwriter who respects tradition but isn't bound by it.

Paul Kowert and Byron House are two (of many) bluegrass bass players who inspire me.

• Kowert talks about his influences (and includes a bunch of steal-able licks) in this video:
  
  
• House tears it up in this one:
  

Have fun!

 

[Lo-E]

Let’s not forget Roy “Junior” Huskey and our own @Jason Sypher when we mention great bluegrass players.

 

[krfoss]

I also should have mentioned Edgar Meyer. His playing on some of the acoustic projects he's been on is outstanding. Not traditional bluegrass, but informative none the less.
And I forgot Mike Bub, who plays with lots of people. He is a great one to listen to.

I do love Edgar Meyer. I've watched him a bunch with Bela Fleck. This is a future problem too because my buddy wants me to bow the bass for a song (which I dont really know how to do...) so I'll be barking up TB's tree to ask for advice there too. meyer is a beast!

 

[Root56]

I'd start off by listening to Bill Monroe and Flatt & Scruggs to get a good foundation in the genre. Their bassists - Howard Watts, Jody Rainwater, and Jake Tullock - were the pioneers of early bluegrass bass playing and provided solid bass lines the will give you a good understanding of the upright's role in bluegrass. I'd also look at Barry Bales' "My Approach to Bluegrass Bass" on Discover Double Bass and Mark Schatz's Bluegrass Bass CDs for further instruction.

When I started playing bluegrass years ago I kept things simple - roots and 5ths serve the music well but can get monotonous after a while. Once you feel comfortable you can add approach notes and walking bass lines to spice things up. Most importantly - have fun! It's great music to play.

 

[Jason Sypher]

Let’s not forget Roy “Junior” Huskey and our own @Jason Sypher when we mention great bluegrass players.

Oh I simply can’t be put in a sentence with that genius. I play bass, any style I can sink my teeth into but there’s only one Roy Husky Junior and I’d be honored to shine his boots!

 

[turf3]

Here ya go: go thou and do likewise.

 

[krfoss]

Pray that you have a solid mandolin player and, if you do, lock in with their chop. The two of you are the kick and snare of the collective rhythm section that is a bluegrass band.

Lots of 1 and 5, of course, but there's plenty variety to be found within those confines. There are also opportunities to (judiciously) add thirds and sevenths, walk up/down into transitions, etc.

My current favorite album is "Bluegrass Vacation" from Robbie Folks. Top-drawer playing by an all-star cast, from a songwriter who respects tradition but isn't bound by it.

Paul Kowert and Byron House are two (of many) bluegrass bass players who inspire me.

• Kowert talks about his influences (and includes a bunch of steal-able licks) in this video:
  
  
• House tears it up in this one:
  

Have fun!

These videos are great. Definitely reinforcing my current playing style and giving me some good ideas.

 

[GlenParks]

I want to second the idea of playing upper and lower octave roots. I'll move from one to the other between A and B parts within a fiddle tune with some passing notes. Length of the note held is an important piece to the puzzle. Learning to work around 'crooked' tunes where there isn't a straight place for 1-5 is another thing you might run into. Enjoy yourself and hold good space.

 

[Ed S]

...Do I just hit the 1s and 5s as hard as I can?

I'm sure you mean this at least somewhat tongue in cheek, but you don't need to overplay to drive the beat. Keep it simple, and then keep it even simpler still. Remember, it isn't about you. If you want to show off, choose another genre. In BG, your job is to make the others sound good. The more you listen, the better you'll play.

Please tell us you've got a solid mando picker. IMO, playing doesn't get much better than that!

 

[Dr. Love]

Do I just hit the 1s and 5s as hard as I can?

Only if you want to have a short and injury filled career. Bluegrass bass does have a reputation for a big round sound, but in my experience playing hard usually works against that. Focus on a good feel with consistent tone and give the soloists a solid, predictable foundation to work off of and I think most people will be happy with that.

 

[brianrost]

Also, am I thinking too hard? Do I just hit the 1s and 5s as hard as I can?

That’s a good start. Add a few walkups here and there and you’re good for the traditional repertoire. Walking bass as in country music works on some tunes, especially waltzes (rare in bluegrass).

If the players are adventurous and into modern repertoire descended from the Newgrass/Dawg Music revolution of the late 1970s (Chris Thile, Molly Tuttle, Tony Rice, Bela Fleck, Billy Strings, etc.) then the sky is the limit.

It really depends on what the rest of the players want to play. I once auditioned for a bluegrass band that was doing Thelonious Monk covers I didn't get the gig, though...

 

[Ron Lacey]

Keeping time is the most essential role for the bass in bluegrass. A wrong note in time can sneak through, especially if you dampen it quickly, but the right note at the wrong time is just wrong. I think I have pretty good time after 50+ years of playing various instruments and I still like to use a metronome or play-along to check myself and fine tune my rhythm sense.

I’ve found that some of the older recorded material is not tuned to a 440=A so keys can be harder to discern. I find newer recordings easier to play along with as they are usually set to concert pitch. Familiarity with Flatt & Scruggs will take you a long way.

I agree with BobKay that keys can vary beyond G, A, C, and D. Bluegrass is primarily songs and the singer determines the key. Diehards may stick to the original recorded key but your group may vary. Most songs are of the I, IV, V variety but some throw in a vi (or VI) chord. Don’t overlook Old Home Place which has a III and a II chord in addition to I, IV, and V. Plus songs like Little Maggie which has I, V, and a flatted VII (typically G, D, and F). Fiddle tunes are typically in D or A and progressions can be dead simple (Soldier’s Joy) or tricky (BlackBerry Blossom). If you can get away with it, the iReal Book on a tablet can be a handy tool for the first few jams if you don’t know what songs are typically called. There are several Bluegrass collections available for iReal Book.

Finally, a good mandolin player helps if they can lock in with the bass, but having a guitar player that knows the chords and sits where you can see them is more important to me. If they play only cowboy chords even better, so they may not be the hottest picker, but they can really help you find your place if you get lost. Be familiar with the use of the capo on guitar. I think of the basic shapes of G, C, & D as I, IV, V so if the guitar is capoed at the second fret the I,IV, V chords are A, D, & E even though the guitarist is forming G, C, & D chords. I like the advice of the late, great John Hartford who said if you get lost go back to the I chord and eventually everyone will come back to you.

 

[neddyrow]

One thing I do that hasn’t been mentioned is when the song goes I to V, is play the root twice before going to the V. If not you are playing IV - V. The chord change doesn’t sound as pronounced when you are in that situation.

 

[Don Hergert]

...
What advice would you give to someone just stating in bluegrass with an upright? Songs to listen to for a solid understanding of the role of the upright.
...

The best advise I can offer is get out there and jam regularly with a variety of bluegrass jams. They really are the "school" for potential bluegrass band members. The more jams you can participate in, the faster you'll learn.

Best of luck with all this!