• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Double Bass Kay S-51 replacement fingerboard

T

tommycheese

May 3, 2022
10
8
#1
Hello,

I'm repairing a 1940 Kay S-51 that has been set up as a four string and is missing the fingerboard. I'm on the fence about switching it back to 5 strings and I can't seem to find a descent replacement fingerboard that fits for 4 strings: 3.25" long 1.50" at the nut 3.75" at the bottom of the fingerboard or one that is wider and overhangs the neck like the original S-51 fingerboard would. I'm also not sure what the 5 string fingerboard dimensions should be.

Who would you contact and which way would you go, 4 or 5 strings?
 
#3
I generally prefer to see the instrument restored, so I'd use a five-string fingerboard, and the spec for the S-1 is ebony. Finished dimensions for the fiver fingerboard are 33-1/4" x a shade less than 1-7/8" at the nut and 4" at the apron, and no less than 1.25" thick at the apron before setup.

It's common with conversions that the tuning machines or tailpiece have been compromised, are you all right there?
 
  • Like
Reactions: tommycheese
#4
Can't help with "whom to contact."

What you haven't said is : Who owns the bass. The owner should decide.
If it's your bass, and you want five strings, go for it!

For purposes of reselling:
You may have trouble breaking even. If this were a wonderful carved bass, AND I thought I could find a buyer for a 5-string, I'd go with five. But five strings will limit the universe of buyers, Kay or otherwise. The low B on a Kay might sound okay bowed ... but it's a plywood bass, and an arco player is not likely to want one.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tommycheese
#5
AGCurry said:
The low B on a Kay might sound okay bowed ... but it's a plywood bass, and an arco player is not likely to want one.
Click to expand...

The standard spec for a Kay fiver is a high C rather than low B, and it was originally marketed to jazz players. I can testify that it's quite useful that way, and I have two. My S-51 came to me from the Cincinnati Symphony.
 
  • Like
Reactions: marcox, Keith Rawlings and AGCurry
#6
Steven Ayres said:
The standard spec for a Kay fiver is a high C rather than low B, and it was originally marketed to jazz players. I can testify that it's quite useful that way, and I have two. My S-51 came to me from the Cincinnati Symphony.
Click to expand...

My mistake! I like the idea of a high C on a Kay much better than a low B.
 
#8
Kay 5 string necks with the overhanging fingerboard on a basically 4 string spec neck are a bit of an odd bird. I've replaced many of them, most of the time building a new fingerboard from a big blank of ebony to the individual customer's specs. I've worked on and played probably 30-50 over the years, but never once thought I needed to own one for regular use.

I find there to be a constant demand in my region for old 5 string Kays with little trouble selling them for a reasonable price. They tend to be advertised for as much as $5k, but realistically sell for around $3500 in good condition with no neck breaks or issues. Figure 50% depreciation for an average refinish and a 35-50% drop for broken necks. Just because you can play it in first position does not mean that it has value of an excellent condition, original finish instrument.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tommycheese and AGCurry
#10
KUNGfuSHERIFF said:
Metropolitan Music or International Violin.
Click to expand...
Steven Ayres said:
I generally prefer to see the instrument restored, so I'd use a five-string fingerboard, and the spec for the S-1 is ebony. Finished dimensions for the fiver fingerboard are 33-1/4" x a shade less than 1-7/8" at the nut and 4" at the apron, and no less than 1.25" thick at the apron before setup.

It's common with conversions that the tuning machines or tailpiece have been compromised, are you all right there?
Click to expand...
Amazing! Thank you so much.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Keyser Soze and KUNGfuSHERIFF
#11
james condino said:
Kay 5 string necks with the overhanging fingerboard on a basically 4 string spec neck are a bit of an odd bird. I've replaced many of them, most of the time building a new fingerboard from a big blank of ebony to the individual customer's specs. I've worked on and played probably 30-50 over the years, but never once thought I needed to own one for regular use.

I find there to be a constant demand in my region for old 5 string Kays with little trouble selling them for a reasonable price. They tend to be advertised for as much as $5k, but realistically sell for around $3500 in good condition with no neck breaks or issues. Figure 50% depreciation for an average refinish and a 35-50% drop for broken necks. Just because you can play it in first position does not mean that it has value of an excellent condition, original finish instrument.
Click to expand...
Excellent! I really appreciate your insight.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Keyser Soze
#12
AGCurry said:
Can't help with "whom to contact."

What you haven't said is : Who owns the bass. The owner should decide.
If it's your bass, and you want five strings, go for it!

For purposes of reselling:
You may have trouble breaking even. If this were a wonderful carved bass, AND I thought I could find a buyer for a 5-string, I'd go with five. But five strings will limit the universe of buyers, Kay or otherwise. The low B on a Kay might sound okay bowed ... but it's a plywood bass, and an arco player is not likely to want one.
Click to expand...
I found the bass on marketplace advertised as a cello for $300 with lots of extras. I plan to restore it (leaning toward 5 strings) and sell it. I love the old kays and have owned and played many. I don't need or want a 5 string, and I've found that I don't want to bring old or expensive basses to my gigs. I'm quite happy with my cheap beater Englehardt. It's in pretty good shape from what I can see and still has the 5 string tail piece. I just need the fingerboard and to clean it up. Looks like there's dirt clods inside or an old wasps nest. The scroll has been broken off and it has a dowel and theirs glue from a previous repair there. The scroll is intact and just needs to be re-glued. I may just take it to Jeff Sahs and have him restore it, but I feel like it would be a good project that I could do myself. Anyways, feels like I won the lottery. Wish me luck!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Keyser Soze, KUNGfuSHERIFF, Keith Rawlings and 1 other person
#14
crd said:
Out of curiosity, do you have any photos of the bass?
Click to expand...
I'm a little concerned that the neck is warped forward since the strings were left on without the fingerboard. I would think that the fingerboard would help support the pull of the strings, but the action sure looks high the way it is now.
IMG_4114.jpeg
IMG_4116.jpeg
IMG_4099.jpeg
IMG_4096.jpeg
IMG_4104.jpeg
IMG_4117.jpeg
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back