Laptops and Desktops

[jschulman]

I just built a PC in January for similar purposes - music production with possible video capabilities in the future. It's way easier than you'd think and far more cost effective than building a pre-built computer. Here are a few things to consider:
- Use pcpartpicker to choose your parts and ensure compatibility.
- You want an i7 if you're doing video production, not an i5. If you're just recording audio an i5 is probably fine.
- Get lots of RAM. 32gb or more. Plugins suck up a lot of processing power.
- Find the quietest cooling that works with your motherboard.
- Get a fast NVMe SSD for your OS and your DAW. Get a large, 7200rpm HDD for your files (two if you want a backup drive).
- You probably don't need the fastest, most current graphics card. Don't worry if it's a few generations old. If you don't do video editing or gaming then you don't need a graphics card at all, but in that case your CPU will need integrated graphics.
- Get a good audio interface. Preamps matter. I like Audient but there are lots of great options out there (SSL, Focusrite, Universal Audio).

 

[WG Plum]

I use a Focusrite 18i8, it does the job.

 

[logdrum]

I think that gaming laptops are really good options even if you do video. Buy as much memory and SSD space as you can afford. If you can get a clean install of Windows that would be better.

There is actually another class of laptops, workstation laptops. That's what I use for work and it is fully decked, high end mobile i9, 2TB on 2 SSDs, 64 GB RAM with an RTX class NVIDIA. The BIOS is also pretty open so you can overclock this thing. I used to do pre-silicon simulation and I was upgraded this i9 laptop even though I probably can do with 16GB and i5 because of a job change. I have a 43 4-K (not a TV) 44 inch ultra wide (like 2 24 inch side by side) and a touch 21. (I own the 43 and 44) and this thing has room to run another big screen at full tilt. Unfortunately cannot install non work apps. Machine is a beast when I still did some simulation work. It can do the work and more where I previously had to have a Xeon equipped workstation. My point is there are laptops out there that can do serious workloads and no need for a tower

I bought some cheap mini desktop HP G2s from Amazon for 180 and they came with 32GB and 500GB SSD and i7. I used those as VST host server, meaning instead of running the VST off the Mac, they run off the cheapo micro PCs. These older generation i7s are really good, ample power and would be great for audio work

Th only "tower" we have is an Intel NUC that can fit a fully functional RTX NVIDIA. Son uses that for gaming and his video stuff. It is extremely fast and has 2 RTX cards. I am getting anther one for some CUDA work. I am done with towers at this point.

You really just need a good interface. Most modern laptops can support a lot of IO. My small MacBook (2015 i7) can interface with my Antelope Audio Zen tour which has 8 preamp in and 16 more channels via ADAT . I was able to record a band live with it last year with 8 + 8 via ADAT using an Audient EVO and tracked just fine at 48 KHz , 24 bit. Simultaneous tracking 16 channels using the thunderbolt interface. I was really surprised. I have upgraded to a used 2019 i9 MacBook. That one, a new Mac Mini, one of the cheap HP G2s are all I need for music , DAW work.

 

[brianrost]

People still buy desktops?

Sure...laptops need docks, external monitors and keyboards, etc. You know, the stuff you already have lying around if you always used desktops!

I use the M1 MacBook I'm typing on right now for recording. It replaced a 2010 MacBook and 2011 iMac that both reached end of life for software updates a few years ago. I had to spend about $600 for SSDs and a Thunderbolt hub just to match the storage and USB ports of the iMac and I no longer have a dedicated machine for music and photographic work.

Too bad I use Logic, in the Windows world, $600 would buy me a new desktop A new Mac Mini is about $1200.

 

[el murdoque]

I'm using both a Dell XPS laptop and a desktop system. The desktop I built myself from components, starting off an old server that I bought off ebay and upgraded with modern stuff.
The desktop, including the 42" display (which is great for audio stuff, because lots of room), has lots of advantages. It was cheaper and has an upgrade path.

 

[40Hz]

Can Windows 11 run on i7 4th gen?

It can, but Microsoft has made it harder than it need be for pre Gen-8 Intel CPUs. Basically, any hardware that can run Win10 has sufficient resources to run Win11.

So the issue is less about the CPU per se and more as to whether or not your PC supports “secure boot,” and has a TPM (trusted platform) module. Any 1Ghz dual core or greater CPU will work but won’t be “supported.” And there’s workarounds for all of that.

However, the biggest issue for me - as a former IT professional and Microsoft Partner - is that Microsoft will insist on a Microsoft account sign-in after the first Win11 major update, which is something I find completely unacceptable. In a small business environment it might make some sense. But it’s a ridiculous requirement for a home/private user running music software. There will eventually be ways to sidestep that requirement. But there’s no rest for those who don’t want the performance hit from Microsoft’s online telemetry or corporate prying eyes into what’s supposed to be your personal machine. Local accounts are still the best way to go.

But here’s the thing…

When it comes to music software, most if not all of which doesn’t need the latest and greatest OS, the issue of needing Windows 11 is somewhat moot if you’re running a dedicated music/recording PC. If your apps are running smoothly there’s no need to to do anything with your operating systems. Nor leave them connected to the Internet unless they absolutely have to be. I know several musicians who are happily running older versions of music software on Windows 7 and getting pro caliber results.

I treat my music PCs as appliances. Glorified toasters if you will. I configure and set them up, load the software, and run them until something fails. I don’t upgrade the OS unless I absolutely have to. And since they’re not wide area network connected I don’t require anti malware or security updates. Which is the bulk of what makes up most OS updates these days.

At the end of the day it all comes down to what makes the most sense for the individual however. In my case it makes the most sense to get a couple of inexpensive but still very powerful machines and use them exclusively for music rather than trick out an expensive new machine and use that for everything. But that’s me. I’m an IT tech who’s comfortable going under the hood if I need to. Most of my career involved working with enterprise and network rather than desktop systems. Others will have different requirements and skill sets so my approach and reasoning won’t necessarily apply to everyone.

 

[WG Plum]

Yeah, I'm decidedly non-technical, so the less I have to futz with the happier I'm going to be. One machine to do it all is pretty much my spec.

 

[40Hz]

27479443[/URL], member: 379563"]Yeah, I'm decidedly non-technical, so the less I have to futz with the happier I'm going to be. One machine to do it all is pretty much my spec.

Fair enough. But it also depends on what “do it all means.” Not every application is going to play nicely with others. And there’s a number of programs and background services running on a standard machine that have the potential to interfere with something like a DAW which doesn’t appreciate competing with other apps for the CPU’s attention. And troubleshooting in an environment like that can get very technical. So one machine to do it all isn’t necessarily the least technically challenging environment I can think of. I know from experience it can make things much harder at times.

But again, maybe that’s just me?

 

[WG Plum]

I wouldn't begin to know, honestly. I think reaching out to a place like AVA Direct and working with a knowledgeable rep is probably going to be my best path forward. I'm a total knuckledragger when it comes to computers.

 

[marchone]

MacBook Pro m1 16 gig. It’s incredible how powerful it is and I just go to the studio and plug it in to the interface via thunderbolt adapter.

latency is 32ms with the right interface as well. My desktop days are personally over.

That’ll do it. I just priced a MacBook M2 fully loaded. It comes out around the price of a boutique bass. Almost $6K.

 

[mikewalker]

It can, but Microsoft has made it harder than it need be for pre Gen-8 Intel CPUs. Basically, any hardware that can run Win10 has sufficient resources to run Win11.

So the issue is less about the CPU per se and more as to whether or not your PC supports “secure boot,” and has a TPM (trusted platform) module. Any 1Ghz dual core or greater CPU will work but won’t be “supported.” And there’s workarounds for all of that....

Trying the "three registry hacks" unsupported win11 install workaround right now... And I just prior converted its MBT partition to GPT (smoothly and painlessly, yay!) in order to get that going thru (after a couple of misfires). About ten minutes left in the upgrade to see if it'll come up OK. ( I do have a recent Veeam image backup, in case it goes sideways...)

 

[WG Plum]

I have no idea what any of that means.

 

[mikewalker]

I have no idea what any of that means.

Then you're probably going to want to get a fresh new 'certified-Win11' machine (or MacOS, perhaps). I would run Linux on all my machines if I wasn't tied to a few legacy Windows apps that are not (and never will be!) running natively under Linux.


And for the record, my 'unsupported' upgrade to Win11 on an Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-6700 CPU @ 3.40GHz (2016 vintage!) machine has gone swimmingly (I'm typing in it now).

Of course this is just an office machine running Oracle and some coding tools... the real test will be on my current DAW (2013 vintage i7) with all of it's legacy audio drivers!

 

[Fynn]

I have no idea what any of that means.

This might be getting a bit too deep now.
I would just recommend you check out some deals for good hardware, and build a PC yourself. Someone mentioned pcpartpicker already, which you can use, but you can also post potential parts here, when you want to buy something. We can all check for compatibility and such.

 

[seamonkey]

I buy from Costco
They have the best return policies. Buy online, return local.

Some things have changed recently in that some apps like Tonex and NAM can take advantage of GPU power. I suspect there will be more apps in the future, and good GPUs it tends to be a lot cheaper and easier to upgrade in a desktop.

 

[40Hz]

Some things have changed recently in that some apps like Tonex and NAM can take advantage of GPU power. I suspect there will be more apps in the future, and good GPUs it tends to be a lot cheaper and easier to upgrade in a desktop.

Using the GPU as a general purpose coprocessor is an idea that was long overdue. Makes sense to use the most powerful processor in your computer for more than just video tasks. Some years back a university computer department linked up four high end video cards (Nvidia IIRC) with some clever programming and created a supercomputer with them.

 

[40Hz]

27479696[/URL], member: 312353"]And for the record, my 'unsupported' upgrade to Win11 on an Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-6700 CPU @ 3.40GHz (2016 vintage!) machine has gone swimmingly

​

Good man!

My experimental upgrade went equally well when I tried the hack on an i7 equipped refurbished Dell.

FWIW I didn’t find anything overly compelling about this iteration of Windows 11 that made me want to abandon Win 10 just yet. Hopefully they’ll continue improving it and do some more tweaking. I didn’t find any dealbreaker issues with it. Overall it’s an ok release. But nothing eye opening or pleasantly surprising like Windows 7 and especially Win2K were.

I guess I’m ambivalent about it at this point. Either way, I’ll be sticking to Linux as my daily driver and continue to keep a Windows machine around for when I can’t avoid it. I also plan to start virtualizing more of my home environment, either by running more of it under Proxmox on my VM server, or up in the cloud with Linode since I have a few things running with those folks already.

One thing for sure. We’re certainly spoilt for choices these days.

 

[AngelCrusher]

That’ll do it. I just priced a MacBook M2 fully loaded. It comes out around the price of a boutique bass. Almost $6K.

You can get mine for $2500. Still boutique bass price but life changing for me since I produce a lot of music. Incredible power in terms of running plugins, latency, reliability,.etc.

 

[pfschim]

I'm getting along fine with a 3 year old Dell XPS 15 7590. i7 CPU (Intel 9750 6 cores @ 2.6Ghz) 16gb RAM running Win11 2H22. I have tweaked it a bit with the Process Lasso app to help keep the DPC latency down to a minimum.

I would also point the OP to the DPC ranking web site. These folks rate a huge number of devices on their (un tweaked) DPC latency factors. Pretty useful when looking for a machine specifically for media creation (audio or video) where DPC latency is a meaningful issue.
DPC Latency Ranking - Which laptops and Windows tablets offer the lowest latency - NotebookCheck.net Tech

good news is that there are tons of machines that will work great.

good luck!