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Looking for sub upgrade advise for PA use

slap-a-da-bass

slap-a-da-bass

Sep 28, 2009
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#1
I currently have some passive Fender 18" subs from the mid 90's, 900w program/1800 peak, they just plain suck. So I'm in the market for some subs. I'd likely want powered, but some good passive's that will match with my amps would be an option also. My amps are Crown XLS1500's (2), each giving 1050 watts @ 8ohms. My tops are active RCF Art312a's 350w. Our typical show would be up to 100/200 people, indoors. Any outdoor gigs, we've had so far has been moderate volume.

Here's my list. Under 100lbs would be nice too.

What do you think?

Top end for me

QSC KW181 - I like that it includes the pole & has wheels.
JBL PRX618s-xlf - Another $115 for each sub/sat pole

Mid point

Yamaha DSR118w
Mackie HD1801

Lowest pricing

EV ELX118p
Mackie SRM1801

I've been talking with Sweetwater & they really like the Yamaha at the under $1000. Also wondering how much more output the KW181 has over the Yamaha DSR118w? Any experience?

What's out there for Passive? What would match well with my amps? Any good comments on Carvin Subs? I've used some BRX neo bass cabs that have been very good.
 
#2
Actives. Kw181 have more thump and volume than any other powered compact sub listed and the wheels, cover and poles that come with them is a nice feature.

Passive I would check out the new JBL
Prx418's. Very light......
You would need a bigger amp that would bridge at 4 ohms with 3200-3600 watts to run mono.

You would spend about the same amount of money either way.
 
#3
If you are a DIYer you could try some BFM subs. http://billfitzmaurice.net/

Two or four Titan 39's would be a perfect upgrade. They are more efficient then most subs on the market and less expensive as well. Also, they are under your 100 lbs limit. Your crown xls1500 would be a close match for them as well. (iirc)

Even if you don't want to DIY, there are a bunch of very knowledgable folks there that can help you with almost any sound reinforcement question.
 
#6
We are using the JBL xlf and it is a great sounding sub. The lows are huge and its been dependable so far, about 15 shows worth. Its pretty light too, its one of those subs one guy could lift easily IF he can get his arms around it.
 
#9
Ksub with my old band was as loud as the drummer. I'd think you'd want it louder than natural. Then again, he was a very loud drummer. I've heard good things about that sub, and the tops were nice, but I wasn't in charge of the PA and I wasn't impressed with the way the KSub worked in that band.
 
#12
i work for a production company and have used both. and personally i would reccommend the JBL PRX618XLF

my reason is that the jbl have a much smoother sound. and at 1000w and 60pounds are incredible. i really like them

the QSC also have a great sound. however they brickwall the the signal too quickly so if you wanted to push the subs they just wont get louder, and they did this so the dumb ass must see red lights DJ's don't blow up the speakers. however they still are a good buy for the price. they are a little tighter sounding than the JBL, but if i were to pick i would go JBL
 
#18
Floyd Eye said:
3db boost by clustering the subs. I do this at venues where it is possible to center cluster them. Otherwise, I put the mains on sticks coming out of the subs, one per side.
Click to expand...

i would agree as a center stack. but you said to put it on one side? however even still you would get a much better fill coverage and overall sound one per side. so wouldn't you be better off this way? i don't wanna sound like a dick but just interested to see if there is something to learn...
 
#19
Floyd Eye said:
Totally true in most cases. Not all though.
Click to expand...

I'm not debating this claim but am genuinely curious: what circumstance would benefit from not clustering the subs? Wouldn't the low-end comb filtering from a spaced pair be a universal justification for a single sub cluster?

EDIT: I should put this question in context referring to small to medium scale systems as used by most bands and houses of worship. Install systems and touring systems would obviously allow for a greater degree of sophistication in terms of sub placement and calibration.
 
#20
Big_Daws said:
i would agree as a center stack. but you said to put it on one side? however even still you would get a much better fill coverage and overall sound one per side. so wouldn't you be better off this way? i don't wanna sound like a dick but just interested to see if there is something to learn...
Click to expand...

Because frequencies below ~150Hz are omnidirectional, you can put the sub stack wherever it needs to go: center, either side, doesn't matter.
However, splitting them one per side causes way more problems than it solves.
 

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