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low output from Mixwizard aux sends
- Thread starter NickFromNY
- Start date
Like I said earlier, I haven't had any problems. I could mix monitors in my sleep at my church. It's pretty effortless. I never have feedback in the monitors, never have any complaints of singers having to push. What I'm doing now is working great, I see no reason to change it.
I don't have an external compressor. It's built in to the console.
The signal chain for this console goes Preamp ->A/D Converter->High Pass Filter->Gate->Compressor->EQ->Fader
I can set the AUX sends as post-fader, pre-fader, or pre-eq, but not pre-dynamics.
so you're just running compression as a parallel "effect"?
i'm not clear on the point; if both channels are up, you just hear the louder one, which is to say the peaks of the uncompressed channel.
(unless you're just using the second, comped channel for out front and the first, dry channel only for monitor sends. at that point it's no different than the Y-split method, except now your FOH vocal is getting piped in series through two channel preamps, an aux bus and maybe even two sets of EQ.)
Yea the Y split method is changing impedance therefore changing the tone of the mic.
The parellel channel is FOH, no mon send.
Summing 2 channels = +6db gain on vocals.
Now I can dial back the Pre amp on the vocal uncompressed channel to have more headroom in the channel pre for loud peaks without distortion.
Parellel compression track is set at same vol as uncompressed track, both in FOH mix=6 db gain over one channel.
Both Tracks PFL'D so input is same. without pushing the input trim or fader volume very hard the vocals stay out front. Only uneffected track sent to Mon send.
Read up on Parellel comp...............its done all the time in Studio mixing on Drums too.
The parellel channel is FOH, no mon send.
Summing 2 channels = +6db gain on vocals.
Now I can dial back the Pre amp on the vocal uncompressed channel to have more headroom in the channel pre for loud peaks without distortion.
Parellel compression track is set at same vol as uncompressed track, both in FOH mix=6 db gain over one channel.
Both Tracks PFL'D so input is same. without pushing the input trim or fader volume very hard the vocals stay out front. Only uneffected track sent to Mon send.
Read up on Parellel comp...............its done all the time in Studio mixing on Drums too.
You can still get parellel comp by turning off the comps on the vox tracks, prefader send out to 1 channel line in.
use the built in comp on the return channel but not on the input channel. Works the same way if you have the extra channel of course.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_compression
i would have thought a typical low impedance mic signal could stand up to a split or two before any significant tone change or loss.
aha.
i suppose the peaks that do jump out over the level of the parallel comped signal (thus no longer getting the dB boost from the doubling) would then be less prominent in relation to the "normal" level, too? very interesting.
(that all this trickery is routinely used just goes to reinforce the point that you do whatever it takes to not compress monitors.)
I understand what parallel compression is. What you don't understand is that it's not possible for me to use parallel compression without using multiple channels for each microphone, and I simply don't have the extra channels for that.
If you use a very high ratio/heavy comp on effected track with a fairly high threshold.............the parts below the threshold are 6 db louder, but will not go much louder above the threshold. Its called upward compression as well.
You could use a limiter to do this as well.
Parallel compression, also known as New York compression, is a dynamic range compression technique used in sound recording and mixing. Parallel compression, a form of upward compression, is achieved by mixing an unprocessed 'dry', or lightly compressed signal with a heavily compressed version of the same signal. Rather than bringing down the highest peaks for the purpose of dynamic range reduction, it reduces the dynamic range by bringing up the softest sounds, adding audible detail.[1] It is most often used on stereo percussion buses in recording and mixdown, on electric bass, and on vocals in recording mixes and live concert mixes.[2]
HistoryThe internal circuitry of Dolby A noise reduction, introduced in 1965, contained parallel buses with heavy compression on one of them, the two mixed in a flexible ratio.[2] In October 1977, an article by Mike Bevelle was published in Studio Sound magazine, describing the technique as applied to studio recordings.[2] Bevelle called it "side-chain" compression, though that term made for confusion with the side-chain compression technique which uses an external "key" or "side chain" signal to determine compression on a target signal. Bevelle's article, entitled "Compressors and Limiters", was reprinted in the same magazine in June 1988.[3] Bob Katz coined the term "parallel compression",[2] and has described it as an implementation of "upward compression", the increase in audibility of softer passages.[3] Studio engineers in New York City became known for reliance on the technique, and it picked up the name "New York compression".[2]
UseThe human ear is sensitive to loud sounds being suddenly reduced in volume, but less so to soft sounds being increased in volumeparallel compression takes advantage of this difference.[2][3] Unlike normal limiting and downward compression, fast transients in music are retained in parallel compression, preserving the "feel" and immediacy of a live performance. Because the method is less audible to the human ear, the compressor can be set aggressively, with high ratios for strong effect.[2]
In an audio mix using an analog mixing console and analog compressors, parallel compression is achieved by sending a monophonic or stereo signal two or more directions and then summing the multiple pathways, mixing them together by ear to achieve the desired effect. One pathway is straight to the summing mixer, other pathways go through mono or stereo compressors, set aggressively for high-ratio gain reduction. The compressed signals are brought back to the summing mixer and blended in with the straight signal.[2]
You could use a limiter to do this as well.
Parallel compression, also known as New York compression, is a dynamic range compression technique used in sound recording and mixing. Parallel compression, a form of upward compression, is achieved by mixing an unprocessed 'dry', or lightly compressed signal with a heavily compressed version of the same signal. Rather than bringing down the highest peaks for the purpose of dynamic range reduction, it reduces the dynamic range by bringing up the softest sounds, adding audible detail.[1] It is most often used on stereo percussion buses in recording and mixdown, on electric bass, and on vocals in recording mixes and live concert mixes.[2]
HistoryThe internal circuitry of Dolby A noise reduction, introduced in 1965, contained parallel buses with heavy compression on one of them, the two mixed in a flexible ratio.[2] In October 1977, an article by Mike Bevelle was published in Studio Sound magazine, describing the technique as applied to studio recordings.[2] Bevelle called it "side-chain" compression, though that term made for confusion with the side-chain compression technique which uses an external "key" or "side chain" signal to determine compression on a target signal. Bevelle's article, entitled "Compressors and Limiters", was reprinted in the same magazine in June 1988.[3] Bob Katz coined the term "parallel compression",[2] and has described it as an implementation of "upward compression", the increase in audibility of softer passages.[3] Studio engineers in New York City became known for reliance on the technique, and it picked up the name "New York compression".[2]
UseThe human ear is sensitive to loud sounds being suddenly reduced in volume, but less so to soft sounds being increased in volumeparallel compression takes advantage of this difference.[2][3] Unlike normal limiting and downward compression, fast transients in music are retained in parallel compression, preserving the "feel" and immediacy of a live performance. Because the method is less audible to the human ear, the compressor can be set aggressively, with high ratios for strong effect.[2]
In an audio mix using an analog mixing console and analog compressors, parallel compression is achieved by sending a monophonic or stereo signal two or more directions and then summing the multiple pathways, mixing them together by ear to achieve the desired effect. One pathway is straight to the summing mixer, other pathways go through mono or stereo compressors, set aggressively for high-ratio gain reduction. The compressed signals are brought back to the summing mixer and blended in with the straight signal.[2]
I send 5 vocals to 1 comp, route it back into 1 channel or even a sub group or aux return.
I understand completely. It can be done with no extra channels. I just prefer using a channel fader
instead of a rotary pot thats less handy to adjust. (and if I pull fadersd down I gotta remember to turn the return down too otherwise the mic's are coming in the aux return pre fader.
My mixer doesn't have that capability unless I go out and buy an external compressor, send all the vocals to an AUX (since I have no sub-groups) and then send that AUX to the mains, meanwhile also sending the uncompressed vocals to another AUX for the monitors. Not worth spending money on.
even more nifty!
so one aux return could serve as the vocal "fattener", boosting the lower levels of all the vocals and resulting in effective compression of their total range.
sorry kingrazor, now you have to go out and get a better board so you can do all these tricks we're talking about
Yep, time to get a Soundcraft Vi 4.
