Double Bass Maintaining Correct Humidity?

[iAsh]

Do you have experience with a humidifier/dehumidifier with a built in hygrometer that will automatically maintain a relative humidity of 45-50? I don’t imagine such a thing is inexpensive but it’s got to be cheaper than fixing cracks. Twice in the last few weeks the RH has gone from 30 to 90 over a couple of days which isn’t normal in the PacNW. I’ve been running a separate humidifier and dehumidifier which would be fine for most people but I’m regularly gone 15+ hours and getting home to a 25 RH with a dehumidifier running freaks me out. No new cracks so far or old ones opening up but at this rate it’s only a matter of time.

I’ve got a good long term solution but can’t implement it until spring. Grateful for any ideas on getting through until then.

 

[Chris Fitzgerald]

I've been told to shoot for between 30-70. The humidifier on the house heating covers the low end of that, and the AC covers the high end. I'd be more worried about too little humidity than too much, though. Much as I hate playing soggy basses, I've not known that to be as dangerous to the wood as getting too dry.

 

[Greg Clinkingbeard]

We have a humidifier on the furnace but temps have dropped into single digits and because the heat is running constantly, the humidity level is only around 30%. I run a small unit in the music room which keeps it closer to 40%.
I recommend this unit and a small digital gauge.
https://www.amazon.com/AIRCARE-8310...hvlocphy=&hvtargid=pla-4584207590298516&psc=1

 

[iAsh]

Between 30% and 70% RH? I have been operating on the premise that 40-55% was the optimum range. Too little RH is for sure more immediately damaging than too much but if 70% is acceptable I’ve been worrying more than necessary about dehumidifying.

Greg, that looks like a good humidifier. My living quarters are less than 400sf so it might be edging towards overkill but better to be looking at it than for it. I will be installing a modern high efficiency wood stove this spring which should take dehumidifying out of the equation.

Moving out of the city to a place that is not terribly well insulated and a year of unprecedented wild fluctuations in weather has had me adjusting my bridge more than ever before. It is a small lightly built bass that reflects RH changes quickly. I also had a finish check pretty badly on a guitar this summer. With no gigs there has been plenty of extra time to work myself into a minor tizzy over it all.

/Woody Allen panic behaviour.

Thank you for your help fellas.

 

[Greg Clinkingbeard]

Between 30% and 70% RH? I have been operating on the premise that 40-55% was the optimum range. Too little RH is for sure more immediately damaging than too much but if 70% is acceptable I’ve been worrying more than necessary about dehumidifying.

Greg, that looks like a good humidifier. My living quarters are less than 400sf so it might be edging towards overkill but better to be looking at it than for it. I will be installing a modern high efficiency wood stove this spring which should take dehumidifying out of the equation.

Moving out of the city to a place that is not terribly well insulated and a year of unprecedented wild fluctuations in weather has had me adjusting my bridge more than ever before. It is a small lightly built bass that reflects RH changes quickly. I also had a finish check pretty badly on a guitar this summer. With no gigs there has been plenty of extra time to work myself into a minor tizzy over it all.

/Woody Allen panic behaviour.

Thank you for your help fellas.

I strive for 40% and have never had more than a minor popped seam on any of my personal basses. Basses that crack or come off the blocks are ALWAYS due to their owner’s not maintaining proper humidity.

Is that humidifier too big for 400 square feet? It depends, probably on how often the air exchanges with outside air. My shop is almost exactly 400 square feet and it has a large picture window along the front, as well as a door that doesn’t seal well. It’s a retail space. During a severe cold snap I have to fill the humidifier almost daily. It’s convenient in that it takes a 5 gallon bucket right through the front. I don’t like the type that has refillable tanks. Most humidifiers has a variable speed fan and crude adjustment for humidity which requires a gauge; I don’t mind. I also have a smaller unit with a digital control.

 

[quickfix]

I run two rather large console humidifiers up here in the frozen wastelands.
One humidifier is in the music room. The other is in the living room. It's a two story with full basement. About 3,000 sq ft.
Both are set at 50%, but have trouble staying above 39% on very cold days when the forced hot air furnace is running a lot.
Very cold ambient air is dry by virtue of it being...well, cold. The furnace doesn't really help the humidity much either.

One very large humidifier was never enough, but two going continuously keeps the humidity reasonable for delicate instruments.
It also keeps our skin from getting too dry.

I'll go through about three gallons/24 hours between the two units.

 

[Wasnex]

Very cold ambient air is dry by virtue of it being...well, cold. The furnace doesn't really help the humidity much either.

AFAIK the way this works is air's ability to hold moisture decreases with temperature. If you start with cold air with 60% relative humidity (RH) and heat it up, the actual moisture content remains the same, but since air can hold more moisture at a higher temperature, the RH goes down.

My house has a bypass humidifier on the heat pump air handler. Unfortunately, it only increases the humidity a few percentage points. I believe this is because heat pumps work with a rather small temperature differential. So, in the coldest months of the harshest winters the RH often drops down into the teens for weeks at a time. However, despite the low RH, I get significant condensation on the windows, even though they all have double panes.

While 40% RH is the low end of the comfort zone, I think sustaining this level of humidity throughout the coldest months could result in mold and other damage related to condensation. At some point it probably makes more sense to keep the bass in its bag with a case humidifier, rather than put your house and living environment at risk.

 

[quickfix]

AFAIK the way this works is air's ability to hold moisture decreases with temperature. If you start with cold air with 60% relative humidity (RH) and heat it up, the actual moisture content remains the same, but since air can hold more moisture at a higher temperature, the RH goes down.

My house has a bypass humidifier on the heat pump air handler. Unfortunately, it only increases the humidity a few percentage points. I believe this is because heat pumps work with a rather small temperature differential. So, in the coldest months of the harshest winters the RH often drops down into the teens for weeks at a time. However, despite the low RH, I get significant condensation on the windows, even though they all have double panes.

While 40% RH is the low end of the comfort zone, I think sustaining this level of humidity throughout the coldest months could result in mold and other damage related to condensation. At some point it probably makes more sense to keep the bass in its bag with a case humidifier, rather than put your house and living environment at risk.

There's no excess condensation in this house during the coldest months of the year.
Occasionally there'll be a bit on the bottom inch or so of a window. That's a very healthy condition, not only for the instruments, but also for human health, furniture and household effects. I've been living in this house for almost 30 years now. There's never been any signs of mold. The house is 69 years old.
A very healthy house indeed.

 

[s0707]

... However, despite the low RH, I get significant condensation on the windows, even though they all have double panes.
...

I would say your condensation might point to air leakage near the windows. Say you have air inside the house at 68 F at 40% RH. The dew point of that air is 43 F, so once that air is cooled to 46 F or so (90% RH) condensation will start happening. Somehow internal air is getting out near the windows.

I run a humidifier and get RH 40 - 45% at 68 F, and don't have condensation, though my house was built 20 years ago.

 

[Wasnex]

I would say your condensation might point to air leakage near the windows. Say you have air inside the house at 68 F at 40% RH. The dew point of that air is 43 F, so once that air is cooled to 46 F or so (90% RH) condensation will start happening. Somehow internal air is getting out near the windows.

I run a humidifier and get RH 40 - 45% at 68 F, and don't have condensation, though my house was built 20 years ago.

My house is quite a bit older and probably allows more air exchange with the outdoors. Otherwise, I suspect I would be able to keep the humidity a bit higher in the winter...and also lower in the summer. There is sometimes a bit of a draft near one of the windows when it is windy, but not all of them.

My believe: Cold glass in a warm room equals condensation, even at 75 degrees with RH of 16%. This only occurs when it's super cold outside. I don't remember ever noticing frost inside the house, so the glass gets pretty darn cold but not freezing.

 

[Mark_T]

I just got one of these and it's been really great: https://levoit.com/products/classic-300s-smart-ultrasonic-top-fill-cool-mist-humidifier

Previously I had a dumb humidifier that required constant monitoring and if I wasn't careful, I'd way overhumidify if I closed the door to the room. This one has been keeping my bass room right where I want it. I also use Boveda packs in the case, and I keep my bass in its case as a buffer.

I also have a dehumidifier for summertime.

 

[Dave Hill]

Is it temp or humidity that is more important? I haven’t been heating the basement so it gets down to 50*, but I have humidifier in the room which keeps it right around 50%. I recently brought the basses upstairs, where it’s a stable 70*, but the humidity isn’t as stable with the heat cycling on/off and the humidifier bouncing off it’s upper and lower limits.

Just posted this in another thread…

 

[longfinger]

I just got one of these and it's been really great: https://levoit.com/products/classic-300s-smart-ultrasonic-top-fill-cool-mist-humidifier

Previously I had a dumb humidifier that required constant monitoring and if I wasn't careful, I'd way overhumidify if I closed the door to the room. This one has been keeping my bass room right where I want it. I also use Boveda packs in the case, and I keep my bass in its case as a buffer.

I also have a dehumidifier for summertime.

This.

I have a similar product from Sunbeam. It takes care of itself, and if you leave your bass in a regular sized room with the door closed, a unit like this can maintain a set RH % for a few days per tank fill.

Not expensive at all.

For some reason, the ones with built in meters are not as common as they were a decade ago. Very weird. Now most of the ones I see in stores are "dumb continuous" models.

 

[s0707]

This.
...
For some reason, the ones with built in meters are not as common as they were a decade ago. Very weird. Now most of the ones I see in stores are "dumb continuous" models.

I got one of these in Amazon: https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B00B5U8GL4/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 -- it does have a humidity sensor that cycles it on and off, though you can think of it "needing calibration". If I set the humidifier to 55% RH, it produces about 40 - 45% RH around the house... it's just that the sensor is right there on the output of the air stream; once the air is distributed around the house the resulting humidity is a bit lower... but it works fine. I have the humidifier by the intake of the heating/AC furnace/evaporator to get the humidified air distributed around the house.