Making simple bass parts more exciting

[MrVentures]

I'm playing with a rag-tag crew of musically proficient work colleagues and students to raise money for a local charity. The setlist of cover songs was provided to us by the concert organizer (head of the charity), and the songs are all fairly simple pop tunes. Two examples: You've Got the Love by Florence + The Machine (A♭m > G♭ > D♭), and What About Us by Pink as performed by the One Voice Children's Choir (Fm > D♭ > A♭). We have the freedom to make the songs our own, though without the ability to get everyone together to practice regularly, we are sticking structurally to the originals.

All that said, when you are playing a song that is written with very simple bass parts, what is your approach to making them more exciting or interesting as the song builds, with respect to the rest of the band? In the two songs listed above, the bass part is essentially root notes, and the songs are composed of three chords nearly the entire way through. There is a key change in "What About Us", but it follows the exact same structure that came before.

In theory, I know I can use the classic roots+5ths+octaves that always seem to work, but this can be overdone or get a bit boring. I know about chord tones and scale tones, but sometimes these just don't seem to fit (maybe I am placing them on the wrong beats? Is that a thing?). On the other hand, I have heard amazing bassists make simple progressions sound impressive while not sticking to just roots and 5ths so I guess I'm curious how to start making this happen.

Any advice or resources to check out on how to make simple songs more dynamic? Alternatively, should I just be content to play something easy while helping to raise money for a good cause?

 

[JonathanPDX]

There's really no end to this topic, no matter how much you know, there is a deeper level to explore. A few ideas to explore:

How deep is your bag of tricks when it comes to fills? Having some interesting ideas to spice things up can be a great way to add your own flavor to the part without trying to recreate the bass line itself. You might find artists you like and spend some time learning their fills, especially in songs that have similar progressions to the ones you are playing.

Learning all the parts of the song can also give you clues on what to incorporate into your bass part. Learn the piano lines, and whatever other little background embellishments are in the song (harp, horns, vocal melodies, synth pads, etc.) Learn the entire melody and you can compare it to each chord, which will inform you to which chord tones (or non chord tones) it's built around, and those are probably going to be safe to put into your bass line.

Find other arrangements and you might get inspired or hear some new ideas to experiment with. For example, this arrangement of You've Got the Love is totally different in style, so obviously you can't just borrow the entire bass groove, but there are lots of cool ideas here, not only in the bass part but in the horns and keys, too:



I like to find live arrangements, too, and sometimes you hear cool ideas the musicians had but they didn't make it onto the record, or you hear their own evolution of how the song expanded between the simple recorded parts to their live interpretation. Maybe you find a break or dynamic change to bring to the group, even if it comes from a very different arrangement of the song.

These are also pretty common chord progressions, so learning more songs with the same changes will give you lots of ideas you can swap from one song to another.

 

[Zooberwerx]

I'm the worst to give advice in this regard but, I too, am always looking for bass parts that "sweeten" the chord progression. Here's a simple example: Wynonna Judd's "Tell Me Why" (intro) which I charted in D for the sake of simplicity.

*Chords: D - G - D - A

*Bass: D - E (Em) - G - A

Huh?!? Why does this work? A roadmap:

D - I chord (derp)

Em - relative minor to the G major chord

G - head-scratcher but essentially an Em pentatonic walk-up (E-F#-G-A) or G/D passing chord.

A - V chord

I have the tendency to "abuse" the relative major & minor chords but it can add some pleasing texture to any arrangement.

Riis

 

[Aloe]

I know about chord tones and scale tones, but sometimes these just don't seem to fit (maybe I am placing them on the wrong beats? Is that a thing?)

yeah, it is. simply speaking, sometimes the harmony changes before the next bar, so a fill belongs to next chord, not to previous.

if the song is boring to play, it's not only the notes, it's the rhythm as well. in fact, for some styles not overplaying is crucial.

so, basically, every note has not only the beginning, but the end as well, articulating the end (and making it in right place) is a way to rhythmically enhance the song. if what you're playing is silence, try accentuating 16ths (or whatever drummer's playing with his hat) by using ghost notes.

sometimes when you play a one big root note, you can substitute it with several root notes (like rock bassists do). don't do it every time in pop songs, but when the dynamic calls for it.

another story is articulation. if you play little notes, make them sound beautiful and defined and it won't be boring.

 

[buldog5151bass]

Listen to the original. Are there parts (keys, extra guitar) not being covered by your lineup?

 

[Nebadon2000]

Just be restrained and pick your spots carefully Be tasteful

For me there is nothing more annoying than a over busy bass player as a listener

One night on Gig I got bored and when playing Tom Petty Breakdown and following Drummer added riffs and licks sounded good to us

But when got off stage(was last song of set) a young women came up to me and said "You just ruined a Great song"

 

[mambo4]

All that said, when you are playing a song that is written with very simple bass parts, what is your approach to making them more exciting or interesting as the song builds, with respect to the rest of the band?

I listen.
I play the simple bass line and listen to everyone else.
I pay as much attention to when my notes stop as when they start.
I use silence to frame the other instruments and song sections.
I try not to fill any space that someone else is filling, or a space that wants to be there
I vary my plucking position and attack , and my fretting choices, to create timbral and dynamic differences in the sound of the plucked note
I explore ways to create more intensity without adding notes, speeding up, or getting louder.
I look around at the band, or the audience, and make eye contact
I move my body to the music,

In a musical performance there is so much more going on worth my attention
( and so many more ways to respond ) than how many notes I can play.
I love simple parts because they give my attention the space to explore that place.

I find that if I focus on the music in this way, the right places for adding notes kind of jump out
The song tells me what it needs, but only if I listen well enough.
Otherwise I'm not playing notes to serve the music but myself - which is fun, but I'm not certain it yields the best result.

I know about chord tones and scale tones, but sometimes these just don't seem to fit (maybe I am placing them on the wrong beats? Is that a thing?). On the other hand, I have heard amazing bassists make simple progressions sound impressive while not sticking to just roots and 5ths so I guess I'm curious how to start making this happen.

My guess is that those bassist have a deep and experienced stylistic vocabulary. They integrated so many phrases from the style into their toolbox that they can simply pull them out in the moment when their ear tells them it would fit nicely. Each style has its own response to making 8 bars if C major more exciting or interesting. Each style has its own "those chords could also be these chords" options. Learning these stylist vocabularies is why repertoire and analysis is important to our practice.

 

[UpperBout]

With many pop songs, often the best answer I have found is: Just play the part. Don't try to make simple bass parts more exciting. This isn't a universal absolute 100% every time thing, but it often is. Sometimes the essence of a song is the interplay of spare individual parts. Getting too busy with the bass just removes the space that listeners need to 'hear' the song. And sometimes the role of the bass is to be a simple, sparse, but essential anchor point.

 

[TeaTime]

Playing with musicians of mixed skill levels, without the benefit of group rehearsals? I'd be cautious with adding too much. Vocalist/Guitarist/Horns/Whatever will have worked to learn thier parts over the original recording and may assume that the particular foundation of bass and drums will be there. Some of the less knowledgeable musicians (looking at you, singers) may even be relying on bass transitions to cue their lines.

It's not glamorous or stimulating, but sometimes the job is to be the guy who holds it all together, especially in a one-off project.

 

[oldcatfish]

There's really no end to this topic, no matter how much you know, there is a deeper level to explore. A few ideas to explore:

How deep is your bag of tricks when it comes to fills? Having some interesting ideas to spice things up can be a great way to add your own flavor to the part without trying to recreate the bass line itself. You might find artists you like and spend some time learning their fills, especially in songs that have similar progressions to the ones you are playing.

Learning all the parts of the song can also give you clues on what to incorporate into your bass part. Learn the piano lines, and whatever other little background embellishments are in the song (harp, horns, vocal melodies, synth pads, etc.) Learn the entire melody and you can compare it to each chord, which will inform you to which chord tones (or non chord tones) it's built around, and those are probably going to be safe to put into your bass line.

Find other arrangements and you might get inspired or hear some new ideas to experiment with. For example, this arrangement of You've Got the Love is totally different in style, so obviously you can't just borrow the entire bass groove, but there are lots of cool ideas here, not only in the bass part but in the horns and keys, too:



I like to find live arrangements, too, and sometimes you hear cool ideas the musicians had but they didn't make it onto the record, or you hear their own evolution of how the song expanded between the simple recorded parts to their live interpretation. Maybe you find a break or dynamic change to bring to the group, even if it comes from a very different arrangement of the song.

These are also pretty common chord progressions, so learning more songs with the same changes will give you lots of ideas you can swap from one song to another.

So, as a long time church bass player, I often ran into this exact situation. Very SPARINGLY add some fills when changing sections of a song, or “approach notes” when changing chords. Too much and the overplaying will be noticeable and you’ll lose the feel of the song.

If you’re more of an audio learner than anything, look up some of the work Adam Nitti did for the Christian band Casting Crowns. His playing is so masterful that non-musicians don’t even notice all of the embellishments that he uses to add intensity and interest to songs as they progress. A great example would be the song “Prodigal.” In it, Adam starts off simply, but does some really cool variations of things as the song builds…but listen closely with headphones, so you don’t miss them. Adam Nitti is an EXTREMELY underrated player.

 

[FullumMusic]

In all earnestness, is making the bass lines more exciting for you to play actually making the song more exciting to listen to? Or is it just something you want to do as the bassist to amuse yourself as you play?

My technique for dealing with making simple bass-lines more interesting is to leave them the way they are while i listen to and enjoy the song as a whole and appreciate why the simplicity works for the song and is often more powerful musically than adding complexity and excitement. You don't have to change them to make them more exciting. You can make them more exciting my changing your perspective on them.

If you as a band are going to make the songs your own, then everyone needs to come together and recontextualize them with a clear musical vision and goal that incorporates the exciting instrumental lines you want to add. Otherwise it's just kinda adding notes for the sake of adding notes. Especially in such cathartic vocal performance pieces. Adding to other instruments could take away from the vocal impact.

I recently subbed a gig where they covered Wu Tang's C.R.E.A.M. It's one note all song long and it was still fun and exciting because the song is fun to listen to.

 

[Hurricane Jimmie]

So Anyway, I played a Corporate Battle Of The Bands to raise money for United Way. We even won.
It was a one & done with one set of music and limited rehearsal time. I kept my playing as solid and simple as I could. The audience wanted to dance, and I locked in with the drummer to provide that groove. Any attention on stage went to the singer.

Have some fun and don't overthink the room.

 

[Guitalia]

With YouTube littered with bassists playing stupefyingly fast, complex lines these days, the temptation to play hey-look-at-me! bass is understandable. I went through a phase like that. Then I figured out that the fancier the part I play, the less people grooved to the music.

Other than signature bass parts, I try to simplify rather than complicate. The less you play, the more power you have, over the band and the crowd.


I'm remembering a block party where a thrown-together band I was recruited for followed a rock band with a show-off bass player. The band was pretty decent for what it was, but they were mostly ignored.

Then we got on stage and played a bunch of rock and r'n'b. Someone from the neighborhood came up to us and asked if we could play some Motown. A guy in his '70's who'd been a Motown session singer in the '60's was in attendance, and people were hoping to talk him into getting on stage.

So we launched into Soul Man, and he did get up and grab the mic.A little way into the song, he started turning around and looking at me. I wondered what I was doing wrong.

Then he pointed at me and called out to the crowd, "That man groovin'!"

The best was when he said, "That's my bass player! You can't have him!"

 

[HolmeBass]

Just be restrained and pick your spots carefully Be tasteful

For me there is nothing more annoying than a over busy bass player as a listener

One night on Gig I got bored and when playing Tom Petty Breakdown and following Drummer added riffs and licks sounded good to us

But when got off stage(was last song of set) a young women came up to me and said "You just ruined a Great song"

Yeah, well, that’s just, like, her opinion, man!

 

[MrVentures]

Thanks for all of the advice, folks! "Making a bass line more interesting" can go very deep, as @JonathanPDX started his response with, so I appreciate the general tips. I did find this YouTube playlist on the topic, which seems helpful, but I also wanted to hear from the TBers with battle-tested experience.

Playing with musicians of mixed skill levels, without the benefit of group rehearsals?

Funnily enough, it's quite a strong group. While the majority of us instrumentalists and all vocalists—except the student choir—are educators, some of them are music teachers while others have played music professionally in former lives. I'm primarily an 'intermediate' bedroom player, though my teens were spent rocking small stages as a guitarist (with age came wisdom and with wisdom came bass) so we are fairly comfortable playing together.

is making the bass lines more exciting for you to play actually making the song more exciting to listen to? Or is it just something you want to do as the bassist to amuse yourself as you play?

Hmm...Likely what is driving this comes from my own fear of not meeting the standard of the more advanced musicians in the band and wanting to impress them and the audience, so they all know I am more than just 'that guy who knows about computers'. But it's a good point to consider. While I am not trying to do anything crazy that would annoy @Nebadon2000, I also feel a need to prove myself in the band. Not sure why, but there is probably a different forum for that!


Key takeaways from the current advice:

• Seek out live versions or covers that might shed some light on how it could be played outside the studio
  • Also learn stylistic vocabulary from other players to expand your options
    • Note: Just connecting this to reading/hearing about bassists learning Charlie Parker solos
• Learn all the parts to song to provide some inspiration for fills
• Especially learn the harmony to know whether a fill should outline the current chord or lead into the next chord
• Rhythm and articulation play a role here too
• Actively listen to try to understand where bass fits in with the other instruments
• Keeping it simple isn't a bad thing, especially if that's what the song calls for
  • And if playing it simple, take the opportunity to enjoy what's going on around you
• Sometimes the bassist is the rug that ties the room together, man, and others may be relying on that to stay on track
• Groove > complexity

 

[Bass4ThePublic]

I used to do this but band leaders kept yelling at me to play less. Now on simple songs I do a chromatic walk up to the 1 or maybe I add a 5. Serve the song, not yourself. Record your band and listen back.

 

[JonathanPDX]

Hmm...Likely what is driving this comes from my own fear of not meeting the standard of the more advanced musicians in the band and wanting to impress them and the audience, so they all know I am more than just 'that guy who knows about computers'. But it's a good point to consider. While I am not trying to do anything crazy that would annoy @Nebadon2000, I also feel a need to prove myself in the band. Not sure why, but there is probably a different forum for that!

This is totally fine, don't let anyone tell you that a bass player is only allowed to play 2 notes or you're some kind of all-flash "look at me" showboat. Every great bass player has had songs and moments where they played a more up front role, even the guys that most people refer to as being support-focused players rather than soloists. And even the greatest soloists, like Victor Wooten and Stanley Clarke, will absolutely support everyone else and play very solid bass parts until it's their turn to step up into the spotlight, and then they get an equal opportunity to shine and have everyone support them in return.

Given the context of the gig, it's perfectly reasonable to carve that space out for yourself. You could select a section of a song and have other instruments lay back so the bass is filling most of the space, even if you aren't playing a solo. That gives you more room to explore and drop some busier parts in without trying to fit them around everyone else.

You can ask for a solo, and tell them where you want to take it and, if you do this, give very clear instructions on how you want them to support you. For example: "Keep the form and play the chords, but bring your dynamics and volume way down to make room for the bass. I'll move to an upper register, so playing lower-register chords with the root in the bass will help keep everyone on the same page."

It might be picking a certain song as well and talking to them about your intention to play a busier part, or that you found an arrangement you like where the bass is taking a bigger role. Whatever you decide to do, just communicate it clearly and talk through what you have in mind.

 

[HueyFreeman]

Slippery slope. Have you asked your band mates how they feel about you making these simple arrangements more exciting? It's their opinion that really counts. Not ours.

 

[MrVentures]

Slippery slope. Have you asked your band mates how they feel about you making these simple arrangements more exciting? It's their opinion that really counts. Not ours.

Good question - I have not talked with them about it. We have spent some time rehearsing, but there haven't been any complaints or suggestions either way (for anyone, except when someone isn't following the structure). Could be they like what I'm doing now—it's a very supportive group, being mainly teachers —and this is on me. I'll try that talking thing.

 

[funkinbottom]

Many times there is a good reason those parts are simple and seemingly unexciting.