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Maple or Rosewood??
- Thread starter tat2clod
- Start date
Alrod - I'm not calling anyone a liar, I've said all along that people believe that they hear things. See what this guy says, and he's built a lot of guitars.
http://www.guitarnation.com/articles/calkin.htm
There are also quite a few people on this thread who've done what I've done and got two necks for the same bass, and find no discernable difference, so I'm not the only heretic.
And calling me arrogant is pretty rich from the guy who's judgement on the article was "This article .. should have been called "The deaf man's guide to alternative luthery woods..... The article is rubbish. It's also full of contradictions" I mean, the guy's only been building accoustic instruments (much more likely to be influenced by wood choice) for 30 years or so, so what does he know?
Now THAT'S arrogance!
http://www.guitarnation.com/articles/calkin.htm
There are also quite a few people on this thread who've done what I've done and got two necks for the same bass, and find no discernable difference, so I'm not the only heretic.
And calling me arrogant is pretty rich from the guy who's judgement on the article was "This article .. should have been called "The deaf man's guide to alternative luthery woods..... The article is rubbish. It's also full of contradictions" I mean, the guy's only been building accoustic instruments (much more likely to be influenced by wood choice) for 30 years or so, so what does he know?
Now THAT'S arrogance!
No question they do!
Think Marcus Miller's slap tone would sound the same on an Alder body / Rosewood board???
NOPE!
I contend the differences would be negligible.
grendle said:
Yeah, and the Nazi's used scientific claims to back up the idea of a master race too.
I still say just playing bass lines on a digital keyboard solves the problem. Plus it takes care of the tone wood problem as well.
And the science part can be discounted since the keyboard is superior to instruments susceptible to fret buzz, poor neck relief, maxed truss rods twisted necks, inconsistent scale lengths and string gauges.
And the science part can be discounted since the keyboard is superior to instruments susceptible to fret buzz, poor neck relief, maxed truss rods twisted necks, inconsistent scale lengths and string gauges.
ash yields a scooped tone vs. alder (especialy heavy ash) - please don't get me started on how density and weight of a species of wood effects tone as well...
attack of his fingers would be slighly subdued by rosewood (maple helps his technique shine)
i draw the line where people say tonewood doesn't make a difference
BillMason said:
Click on the compairs to wood link. It's really common sense and just a little thought. Materials of different densities either attenuate or amplify vibrations applied to them. The density of the wood effects the vibrations produced by the string, which is picked up by the pickup. It's not rocket science.
For every one of these articles there are 100's of others that state the opposite. So again what you are saying is that this one person is the final authority and everyone else (the majority) is wrong. Sorry but one opinion is not enough to sway my thinking. Also, isn't this the guy that you said builds 3000 guitars a year? That would be 8 guitars a day at 365 days a year. I would call that an assembly line worker.
Also, look at your sarcasm "I've said all along that people believe that they hear things." You are still implying that they don't hear a difference, but that they think they do. Why do you even bother posting on threads dealing with tone if you can't even hear the difference?!? What value are you adding? You are not helping that's for sure.
After reading this debate for days, I'm convinced that some people are able to hear the difference and I'm not one. Maybe in an unplugged setting, but body woods color that sound also.
I've always been able to hear John Bonham's squeaky Speed King pedal on the first four albums, but none of my friends can.
I've always been able to hear John Bonham's squeaky Speed King pedal on the first four albums, but none of my friends can.
Here is one take on the rosewood vs. maple thing. I have four Fender Deluxe Ash Stratocasters. One is put away for my old age in mint condition (maple fretboard). My comparison is with the other three identical Strats.
Strat #1: Maple fretboard
Strat #2: Maple fretboard
Strat #3: Rosewood fretboard
When I run #1 or #2 through my system, they are absolutely interchangable. The sound identical enough so I use them on stage. I start with either one and the other will be my backup for the night. If I run Strat #3 into the same system, I have to re-EQ several things to get the sound I am used to. It is absolutely different, tonewise! All four are Fender Deluxe Ash Stratocasters and I like them all. My rosewood one stays set up at home and I play it all the time. I can hear a big difference between maple and rosewood on identical electric guitars.
There is nothing scientific about my above statements; just my experience with Fender electric guitars. A bass is a different instrument altogether. I don't own two Precisions; only one. Mine is sunburst with rosewood. Why??.....Because I like the way it looks....
Strat #1: Maple fretboard
Strat #2: Maple fretboard
Strat #3: Rosewood fretboard
When I run #1 or #2 through my system, they are absolutely interchangable. The sound identical enough so I use them on stage. I start with either one and the other will be my backup for the night. If I run Strat #3 into the same system, I have to re-EQ several things to get the sound I am used to. It is absolutely different, tonewise! All four are Fender Deluxe Ash Stratocasters and I like them all. My rosewood one stays set up at home and I play it all the time. I can hear a big difference between maple and rosewood on identical electric guitars.
There is nothing scientific about my above statements; just my experience with Fender electric guitars. A bass is a different instrument altogether. I don't own two Precisions; only one. Mine is sunburst with rosewood. Why??.....Because I like the way it looks....
Sounds like you have good ears. Can you also hear the stick clicks when he is counting the band in during the different parts of Black Dog?
In a sense, you kind of hit the nail on the head. Once you know what to listen for, it makes sense. In other words, someone may never have heard Bonhams kick pedal squeaks or his stick click during Black Dog. But now that folks know what to listen for, they will more than likely hear it. It doesn't mean that the sound was never there, but rather, now you know what to listen for. Make sense?
grendle said:
I haven't been saying that wood makes no difference - or that I'm unable to hear a difference - I've been saying that I'm unable to hear a substantial difference, nor am I convinced that it's attributable to fretboard material, and that the difference in appearance was more substantial than the differences in tone when it comes to fretboard. To me, every two P basses sound different, every two J basses sound different, etc. Not that there's no difference in tone. My advice to the OP was just to pick whichever bass he or she liked and play it.
But the website you posted with its "science" is just marketing masquerading as science to give it more rational weight to those easily swayed by numbers, charts, graphs, and statistics. Almost any position can be backed up by "scientific evidence," from body de-toxes to the existence of Sasquatch and UFOs. Doesn't make it science. And certainly not rocket science.
BillMason said:
I agree that the difference between. Rosewood and maple isn't huge, but its there if you know what your listening for. From your other thread post , you haven't owned too many basses, and mostly fenders . You need to play more basses, wood and construction Definatly matters and changes the voice of the instrument pretty drastically. But if you can't hear it play plywood , hell why not. Just don't discredit things you can't hear that others can.
grendle said:
Ok well when I start discrediting things I can't hear and others can, let me know, ok? Because I haven't.
grendle said:
By the way - I've been playing since 1982. Not forever, granted, but my experience is enough, and I've met plenty of other guys with similar experience who share my POV, as this thread attests to.
I ain't saying people who care about fretboard differences in tone are wrong - read my lips, I CAN HEAR A DIFFERENCE WHEN I PLAY TWO BASSES THAT HAVE DIFFERENT FRETBOARD MATERIALS. Ok? I'm saying that IMHO the difference is not as substantial as appearance since every two basses sound different anyway. Ok? I'm also saying that I have no idea what people mean when they say warm, mellow, bright, snappy, etc with respect to fretboard wood as to me those differences come moreso from amp, right hand technique, strings, and EQ than anything else.
Also, just because certain individuals cannot hear it, does not mean that the sound doesnt exist. No matter how hard they try to argue it. Make sense?
I agree with you Bill. Every bass sounds different to me, but it's impossible for me to specify where a certain tonal characteristic is coming from. A difference in the pickups, setup, pickup height, string type/age, neck/body construction or how I feel when I play the bass and expect it to sound are all things to consider before I jump to fretboard material.
