Maple vs. Rosewood Boards, What’s the Real Difference to You?

[turf3]

The "real difference" is that I like maple and don't like rosewood.
...

If I blindfolded you, would you be able to tell the difference?

 

[Iridescentone]

Can’t believe 4 pages in people don’t know this is a troll thread.

In my opinion, he justifies his prices by convincing people he’s got some kind of mystery ingredient in his instruments. What he has is variances from the standard (Fender). Convincing people there’s a $ignificant tonal difference between one fretboard wood and another assists with creating that mystique. It simply doesn’t match my own experience, so I can’t buy the point of view.

I'm waiting for Roger (or anyone else) to account for the "standard deviation" between fretboard slabs of the same wood types, even between fretboards cut from the same tree, or even the same board. Because there can be. Which would seem to make Janka ratings almost meaningless.

 

[58kites]

I'm waiting for Roger (or anyone else) to account for the "standard deviation" between fretboard slabs of the same wood types, even between fretboards cut from the same tree, or even the same board. Because there can be. Which would seem to make Janka ratings almost meaningless.

Janka harness ratings are done to have a standard basic measure and they do specify all the various geographic locations that a given wood comes from and rate each one. Rosewood has nine different types listed in the The Wood Database website.
It is a useful source of information for everyone who works with wood.
You are for sure not going to find a piece of Hard Maple (Sugar Maple/ Rock Maple) that is nearly as hard as Brazilian Rosewood.

 

[Gervais Cote]

As a "general" note, when someone tells me he doesn’t hear any difference between two basses, I just tell him to take the cheapest one and don’t bother. Nothing wrong with that.

 

[bass12]

Hang on… Roger entered the room when someone *else* brought him up to refute *my* opinion… I’m not here making some kind of cynical career out of invalidating Roger Sadowsky, I’m pointing out that bringing him up as if it somehow makes a valid point that “rosewood is warm and maple is bright” is a straw man argument and therefore invalid. If people don’t want to hear my opinion about Roger Sadowsky, stop bringing him into the conversation, and I haven’t insulted anyone. Unlike the insulting comments made to me about me. Maybe ask why his comments keep coming up in these conversations, and pay attention to who brings them up. Straw man arguments are invalid arguments. My opinion matters - to me - much more so than Roger Sadowsky’s and that’s all I’ve said about him.

I’m sure he makes fantastic basses, and I’m sure he has a great ear for quality materials. Broad sweeping statements about how wood species sound as fretboards do not make that point, however, for me they undermine it.

To whit - all rosewood necks aren’t known for sounding more warm than maple necks with a rosewood fretboard. They should, though…? For some reason, we’re not having this debate over roasted maple necks, or maple necks that are quarter sawn vs flat sawn, and I’m sure their grains being so different *must* have an impact. It’s easy for a manufacturer to make every neck quarter sawn - more expensive due to the waste, but they’ll still get a lot of necks out of one log. Or one piece versus two piece necks. Or three piece necks. Or necks with mahogany strips. Does Sadowsky make any of those types of necks? It seems we only have this debate over fretboard woods, not necks. Why is that? A fretboard is a pretty slim piece of wood.

In my opinion the reason why is that Fender’s “golden years” are the early sixties, pre-CBS, when new Fender fretboards were very dark Brazilian rosewood and all basses sounded “warm”. Sadowsky is tapping into that sentiment and capitalizing on it - nothing wrong with that, just recognize it - and it’s just not consistent with my own experience so I can’t agree.

You suggested that, "Roger would have a difficult time getting people to pay the prices he’s asking if he told people there’s no sound difference between poplar and ash". You then extended that argument to include maple and rosewood. You're insinuating that he is deliberately manipulating people by attempting to create a "mystique" surrounding the properties of wood. That sounds pretty insulting to me. But hey, if that makes you feel better. What I find bizarre is the suggestion that claims regarding the materials that EVERYONE in the bass manufacturing business uses should help convince people to buy a Sadowsky bass. How does that work? You can buy Squiers with maple or rosewood boards, or with ash bodies. What mystique is RS helping to create here? If anything it would seem the opposite - that ol' Rog is just using the same old boring wood formulae that have been used for decades by countless manufacturers. Not much mystique there.

 

[urkel3000]

The only real difference between maple and rosewood (besides the color) concerns the feel. And this difference is very small. The type of wood has virtually no influence on the sound of an electric instrument.

My ATK 600 (alder/rosewood) is identical to an ATK300(ash/maple) except for the woods. It sounds quite a bit different from a 300

 

[Nebadon2000]

I'm waiting for Roger (or anyone else) to account for the "standard deviation" between fretboard slabs of the same wood types, even between fretboards cut from the same tree, or even the same board. Because there can be. Which would seem to make Janka ratings almost meaningless.

@Sadowsky is a member here you can DM him and ask your question; I know for sure I can't answer that and suspect no one here also

Your question seems valid to me; I don't have a Horse in this race and never considered tonewood nuance;

when choosing a Bass I consider overall playability and comfort, have Tone I find appealing and aesthetics; all things fairly equal I prefer Ash Body and Maple fretboard aesthetically; being a layman when it comes to Bass and Amp design I am interested in Designers insider thoughts that may have contributed to my choices; Having Mesa Amp I find @agedhorse [Andy] insight here on TB valuable as I do Video's below

 

[newwavefrank]

There may be a slight difference. I just like the different looks

 

[turf3]

Still waiting for the blind test data...

 

[ra0ulduke]

Everyone is entitled to their own hearing. When I took acid as a teenager, I heard some truly wonderful things too.

However: There is scientific evidence that the type of wood has only a marginal influence on the sound of an electric (!) instrument. Anyone who claims otherwise is abandoning the realm of serious debate.

 

[bass12]

Everyone is entitled to their own hearing. When I took acid as a teenager, I heard some truly wonderful things too.

However: There is scientific evidence that the type of wood has only a marginal influence on the sound of an electric (!) instrument. Anyone who claims otherwise is abandoning the realm of serious debate.

So how would you account for two instruments with identical specs sounding noticeably different from one another - or would that just be someone's imagination? What about graphite? Does that sound the same as wood? What about dead spots or sections of a neck that don't resonate as they "should"? Was I just imagining that all of my basses by brand x sounded significantly different, despite their being identical in every way save for the wood?

 

[jivetkr]

You can totally hear the difference between fingerboard woods. I’ve got 2 stingray specials and the maple board is brighter and clearer. This is 100% true at home in your bedroom.

However, in a mix good luck telling the difference. The differences disappear as soon as the band starts. At that point it’s abt looks.

 

[Swamp_Ronin]

Imagine how good Jameson, Jaco, and John Paul Jones could have been if they had only harnessed the knowledge of janka hardness. But those fools spent their time with chord tones and melodies other colossal wastes of time.

 

[MtManiac]

Didn't think you kept your word

You suggested that, "Roger would have a difficult time getting people to pay the prices he’s asking if he told people there’s no sound difference between poplar and ash". You then extended that argument to include maple and rosewood. You're insinuating that he is deliberately manipulating people by attempting to create a "mystique" surrounding the properties of wood. That sounds pretty insulting to me. But hey, if that makes you feel better. What I find bizarre is the suggestion that claims regarding the materials that EVERYONE in the bass manufacturing business uses should help convince people to buy a Sadowsky bass. How does that work? You can buy Squiers with maple or rosewood boards, or with ash bodies. What mystique is RS helping to create here? If anything it would seem the opposite - that ol' Rog is just using the same old boring wood formulae that have been used for decades by countless manufacturers. Not much mystique there.

Manipulating? It’s called marketing. Again, your word, not mine. Don’t put words in my mouth and then tell me I’m being insulting.

 

[MtManiac]

Didn't think you kept your word

You’re literally trolling now, and I see likely have been all along. Disingenuous at best, but harassment either way, and I’ve reported you to the mods.

 

[bass12]

Manipulating? It’s called marketing. Again, your word, not mine. Don’t put words in my mouth and then tell me I’m being insulting.

So, since "marketing" is your word, what kind of marketing exactly are you talking about? Because some marketing is clearly manipulative while some marketing is not. Is RS using the manipulative kind or is he merely presenting information about his product as he sees it, based on his experience as a builder? Is he being honest or is he making things up to make a buck?

 

[Major Seven]

Everyone is entitled to their own hearing. When I took acid as a teenager, I heard some truly wonderful things too.

However: There is scientific evidence that the type of wood has only a marginal influence on the sound of an electric (!) instrument. Anyone who claims otherwise is abandoning the realm of serious debate.

I had forgotten about when on acid as a teenager we took a gratefull dead jam on reel to reel, rolled it up on a takeup reel so we could then play
it backwards. It sounded exactly the same as it did forwards.

 

[MtManiac]

So, since "marketing" is your word, what kind of marketing exactly are you talking about? Because some marketing is clearly manipulative while some marketing is not. Is RS using the manipulative kind or is he merely presenting information about his product as he sees it, based on his experience as a builder? Is he being honest or is he making things up to make a buck?

I’m sure he’s being honest with his entirely subjective, individual and personal opinion. I can truly only attribute the use of that opinion to justify buying Sadowsky’s to his customers on Talkbass. Neither he nor the Talkbass users referencing his comments use tonal descriptors that are consistent with my experience.

What is it that you’re looking for from me? It can’t be winning an argument, because I’m not giving you one. It seems like you just want to put words in my mouth so you can justify being offended by my lack of agreement with you.

 

[Ric Vice]

Having experimented in this area myself at one time my take is that if you put the player behind a screen with the EQ set at basically the same and changed out the necks, You probably wouldn't get any usefull. Tactile feeling is a different between those fingerboards. I'm more comfortable with Rosewood or Ebony. The only Maple fingerboard that feels right to me is the Oval C neck/fingerboard on a 1959 Fender Precision bass with the smaller frets they used back then.

 

[bass12]

I’m sure he’s being honest with his entirely subjective, individual and personal opinion. I can truly only attribute the use of that opinion to justify buying Sadowsky’s to his customers on Talkbass.

I'm failing to see how RS's comments regarding wood would encourage people to buy Sadowskys any more than it would encourage them to buy any of the other countless basses that have been made with the same kinds of wood. How exactly does it benefit him in particular to state that maple sounds brighter than rosewood?