Mesa Subway D-350!

[DirkP]

Oh boy...where's the popcorn? I'm going to sit back and watch the storm that's about to unfold...

I could withstand the storm with a made in China US flag!

 

[Anachronism]

I have a lot of respect for Mesa and their products, but in all honesty, I would never pay 1.500,- Euros for a bass amp. And I have a very decent paid job and no other expensive "hobbies" and can afford gear. Thomann doesn't offer the 800+ at all and they only offer the 800 on demand. That says something. A lot of player consider the Markbass gear expensive and kind of snobbish. But a Markbass 500 Watt amp is 550,-, an 800 Watt amp is 640,-.
My LMII works flawlessly since 15 years and I never felt tempted to buy another amp. The only amp that appealed to me is the Trace Elliot Elf, because of the size.
I'm sure the Mesa gear is worth its price, but for me it is too expensive. For me a bass amp is mostly a stage monitor. If I want to record, I use outboard gear. I have paid 800,- for a compressor and I own expensive DIs and preamps, even the small SSL SiX mixer. But for a bass amp? No way.
Most stages aren't ideal and what is true for monitor speakers is true for bass amplifying too: the room is more important than the speakers. Cheap speakers sound much much better in a treated room than the most expensive speakers in a bathroom. The PA is more important anyway.
I think there is only a small group of bass players that are willing to pay that much money for an amp: the real pros and old school rockers with a lot of money for whom amps are still like Harleys or cars.

I could be tempted by a Mesa amp as small as the ELF with 300 watts at least and a very good preamp and DI for 5-600,-.
Or Mesa should be the first company that offers active speakers for bass players that can be used as PA speakers or monitors too. Lightweight, easy to transport with no compromise in sound. I think this is the future of bass amplifying anyway.
This is just my single opinion in all honesty.

Troll off

 

[dbsfgyd1]

It's more or less a older one-off concept piece that got out into the wild...

So, do you guys have any thoughts or comments?

Depends on the price point. I could be very interested. Coupled to a reasonably efficient 4 ohm 410 speaker enclosure would be a pretty formidable rig.

 

[pigpen1]

Might be ideal for people who never need the power of the 800w versions. But the D-800 is so affordable I’d buy a second 800 before the 350. Folks might think 800w is overkill but both of my cabs are 8ohm and I like
That have that extra oomph especially when using a single cab.

Hey, its easier to turn a big amp down right?

But after thinking it over I'd probably buy this amp at a low enough price. It would be the perfect gig bag amp to take to backlined places when you only want to carry one thing.

 

[Frankie Fender]

Not to derail the thread, but here is a Mesa question and I didn’t know where else to ask it other than starting my own thread. BTW Mesa support is closed Fridays.

Can someone who owns a Subway 115 or 112 tell me the size of the Mesa Engineering logo, measured end to end horizontally? I think they are the same size.

The 215 logo is too big for my liking and I may order a smaller one for it. Thanks!

Here’s what I’m talking about.

 

[agedhorse]

Maybe just the D-350 could be made overseas to lower the pricepoint again.



AND NOBODY LIKED THAT.

That's pretty much a non-option at this point, this is something the company has stood tall on and it's also something that supports our local economy.

I don't care if gear is made in China or in the evil empire of America When it comes to high tech products I have more trust in chinese manufacturing than in the US in general. Made in the USA like made in Germany is nostalgia.

There is good and bad manufacturing in all countries, but on the average I would suggest that overall the quality of the average product made in Germany or the US is likely better. I know that when it comes to food products and pharmaceuticals, China doesn't have the most stellar record. Maybe this will change in the next 10 years, but when I audit parts from China, I tend to find more issues than just about any country (other than India).

I studied a good deal of engineering for manufacturing when I was in University, my specialization was industrial/process controls and power systems. Because of this, it saddens me even more to see our manufacturing leaving, but perhaps those who never knew the manufacturing capabilities of the US and Europe don't have the same feelings or memories.

 

[Daniel Piper]

That's pretty much a non-option at this point, this is something the company has stood tall on and it's also something that supports our local economy.

Yip - MESA's standing is well known at this point, which is why I thought it would be a safe spot to put a tongue-in-cheek post on it here. Amazing company that we all love.

I live in a country where local MESA pricing is brutal. But we pay because the quality of tone, product and philosophy is so strong.

 

[Plastalmonus]

Small, no fan, wattage that would be adequate for pretty much every gig I play...

Bonus is that it's a mini amp that is made by Mesa who has a fantastic reputation, so instantly beats out most of the other small mid-wattage heads...

Yeah I'd probably get one

 

[bucephylus]

FWIW, I use a similarly powered Demeter amp, the Bass400J. Could be the same 125ASX module?

Anyhow, I like the little Demeter a lot. I use it mainly as an excellent preamp / DI for Ampless gigs; but, it also drives cabs pretty hard. I used it on top of a Berg 212 for my NYE gig in a very big room, and it killed. More than enough power.

As I said, FWIW. IME, this size / power of an amp can be pretty useful, depending on features.

 

[DJ Bebop]

That's pretty much a non-option at this point, this is something the company has stood tall on and it's also something that supports our local economy.

Yep!
Just think of it for a moment. Mesa has a stellar reputation from the inception of the company of high quilty,
high end, no-failure, high quilty controlled products.
Decides to make a small inexpensive amp offshore. And in the run, some amps ship that are faulty.

What happens to that reputation now?
Think Ampeg or any amp manufacturers that have gone that route?
Think of the reason you went to Mesa in the first place.

No my friends, while this may sound good in the short run, as some have done, exercise short-sightedness.

It can be detrimental to all we hold dear!

 

[Wfrance3]

Yes. That and a 30 Lb. 110 cab.

 

[bdplaid]

That's pretty much a non-option at this point, this is something the company has stood tall on and it's also something that supports our local economy.



There is good and bad manufacturing in all countries, but on the average I would suggest that overall the quality of the average product made in Germany or the US is likely better. I know that when it comes to food products and pharmaceuticals, China doesn't have the most stellar record. Maybe this will change in the next 10 years, but when I audit parts from China, I tend to find more issues than just about any country (other than India).

I studied a good deal of engineering for manufacturing when I was in University, my specialization was industrial/process controls and power systems. Because of this, it saddens me even more to see our manufacturing leaving, but perhaps those who never knew the manufacturing capabilities of the US and Europe don't have the same feelings or memories.

Huge +1

 

[bdplaid]

Yep!
Just think of it for a moment. Mesa has a stellar reputation from the inception of the company of high quilty,
high end, no-failure, high quilty controlled products.
Decides to make a small inexpensive amp offshore. And in the run, some amps ship that are faulty.

What happens to that reputation now?
Think Ampeg or any amp manufacturers that have gone that route?
Think of the reason you went to Mesa in the first place.

No my friends, while this may sound good in the short run, as some have done, exercise short-sightedness.

It can be detrimental to all we hold dear!

I was thinking ampeg before you even said it. I liked the PF series until mine bellied-up about 30 minutes into it's first use. No more PF for me.

 

[daveman50]

Yes. That and a 30 Lb. 110 cab.

Not to derail, but why so heavy? Another maker all over this site has a "One 10" at 15 lbs.

PS, I love the idea of a lower-priced Mesa head. I would be in.

 

[DJ Bebop]

Yep!
Just think of it for a moment. Mesa has a stellar reputation from the inception of the company of high quilty,
high end, no-failure, high quilty controlled products.
Decides to make a small inexpensive amp offshore. And in the run, some amps ship that are faulty.

What happens to that reputation now?
Think Ampeg or any amp manufacturers that have gone that route?
Think of the reason you went to Mesa in the first place.

No my friends, while this may sound good in the short run, as some have done, exercise short-sightedness.

It can be detrimental to all we hold dear!

Having said that, and I admit I know nothing about this kind of thing. They might, might be able to pull this off if, they set up in house here, a QC shop that checked every offshore amp that comes in. That sounds like it could be just as expensive as building them here, to begin with.

agedhorse?

 

[duncmill]

I don't think anything we could ever design and actually build in California would ever be "cheap", but there's a big difference (IMO) between "cheap" and having value.

Regarding entry level, there's a significant difference here as well I think. If cost is not the most important feature, and players looking at an "entry level" bass amp are willing to pay a bit of a premium for a US built product with a more advanced feature set than is typically found on "entry level" amps, then there might be possibilities. Of course, we would also expect there to be a MUCH higher resale value to such a product compared with a typical "entry level" product because of the "value" aspect.

We are aware that the 800 watt platform is more than many players need. In fact several players here mentioned that their cabinets are nowhere near capable of safely handling 400 watts (RMS) at 8 ohms and 800 watts (RMS) at 4 ohms, so perhaps to some players 800 watts may not be needed... or even wanted.

I am listening, as this is an area that seems to have some interesting perspectives. Thoughts???

The two features of the WD-800 that really appeal to me are the variable high pass filter and the power amp damping control. These and the amp being made in the US and are worth paying a premium for.

 

[Anachronism]

My Mesa guitar amp was made the year I was born. I'm in my mid 30s. Not only does it still sound amazing, I believe that if I send it back to Mesa for service it may be worked on by some of the same people who originally designed and built it. That quality, continuity and institutional knowledge is worth more than saving a few bucks from offshoring.

 

[_Some Dude]

One of the perks of only offering an 800w version is that there’s no arguing about whether 350w is enough or not.

 

[DJ Bebop]

One of the perks of only offering an 800w version is that there’s no arguing about whether 350w is enough or not.

Plus do we all know that if you put the Mesa D, D+, WDs in 2-ohm mode into an 8-ohm load, you get 300 watts?

 

[Downunderwonder]

What I don't get is how the reliability of Mesa's stuff can't leverage a decent selling price offshore. Mesa could hold the warranties and tell the distributors what to charge same as as at home?