Mexican or American(Fender)...Your preference?

[alfredpunkjazz]

Plus, you must remind that technology in Japan and EU, are almost as good, and I think I wouldn't be wrong saying that most of that technology came to México with Fender... Its just that they found a cheap way to do guitars over here...

:scowl:

 

[KayCee]

Just because you do agree doesn't mean it's not a syndrome.

The point here is that with all flag in your face aside, being american made does not mean that it is automatically better, or worse. Last time I was in the states, and of all places, KC, it was a constant "as long as it's american it's good". If you don't want to give a biast perception, it's better not to portray it.

There's a real difference between being loyal and patriotic to your country and being blind biast. Loyalty is a very great thing IMO. Looking out for your fellow people and keeping jobs happening, absolutley pure and commendable. Saying that other countries build quality is poor without justification is too me a sign of lacking confidence and weakness.

Over time, time will tell what the mass of market will decide. If MIM and MIJ are as good, if not better potentially they will sell more and more as the reputation builds. Slander and cheap talk only lasts a while.

The one thing I do love about American stuff is the style. Be it, it may not be hi tech, that era when Fenders kicked in has an undeniable style that is awsome. 50's Chevs, 60's mustangs, Fenders, Harleys etc etc. But are they built better than foriegn makers, not allways. In this case it could just be the vibe and patriots that saves their *ss.

I never said that I felt that the build quality of Mexican Fenders was poor. I like some of them very well. I also never said that a bass made in America was automatically better. I didn't comment on the American job market. And I didn't wave the American flag.

Go back to my initial post. I simply gave a one-word answer to the thread's question with my preference. I prefer the American Fender basses. This is largely due to the fact that the model that I like the best, the American Deluxe Precision V, hasn't been made anywhere else. I wish it WAS, because now they've discontinued the model.

I totally agree that putting down products of other countries without justification is a sign of low confidence and weakness. It's also unfair to jump on every American that responds to this poll with a preference for US Fenders with a bunch of baggage they don't deserve.

My amp is a Glockenklang. And no, I don't think there's a "syndrome" where all German amps are better, either.

 

[mlowe]

That's cool, I in no way intended to imply that you did and completley agree with what you said.

Most of my comments were generalizations which I understand can be taken the wrong way and my post didn't seperate my initial comment to the rest. My comments are not an meant to be an attack on americans just the biast attitude that only some have on this forum.

If a group of Australians did it I would say exactly the same. I'm sure we are just as guilty of it at times. Like knocking american cars etc.

I drive a fords, have a taste for Harleys, mustangs and fenders. I'm not a US hater... Believe it or not, here at least many of those items of US origen are considered second rate in quality. Escpecially automotive of any kind. (yes, i don't agree, not allways) I'd be interested in the americans opinion of the GTO over there now as it's made in Australia.
Just mentioned that as perceptions of quality change a lot depending on were your'e looking from.

I just find when less experienced players or people ask what bass to get there shouldn't be an automatic MIA only cause the rest is second rate and you'd be compromising on quality (just an opinion).

If the MIA has a better trait, absolutly tell the world about it but there's no need to put down others or those who choose to play them.

And for the record, the one thing that absolutly gets bagged here is american beer. When I was in KC I drank a lot of Boulevard which was IMO one of the best I've had. We have a lot of really good beers here.

 

[mlowe]

Plus, you must remind that technology in Japan and EU, are almost as good, and I think I wouldn't be wrong saying that most of that technology came to México with Fender... Its just that they found a cheap way to do guitars over here...

:scowl:

That's a fair point. Japan also has technology and quality that the rest of the world would strive for. Cameras for example. They are simply "one" of the best. Electronics in a bass is also highly subjective to taste. A preamp isn't a new or major scientific secret for many decades. It's probably more about shaping and/or allowing the shaping for the common taste of players. Consider where almost all of the components to make those electronics are made!!! It kind of sounds funny, US electronics made of japanese and chinese components....

 

[KayCee]

And for the record, the one thing that absolutly gets bagged here is american beer. When I was in KC I drank a lot of Boulevard which was IMO one of the best I've had. We have a lot of really good beers here.

Maybe it's time to fly back for our upcoming GTG!

 

[mlowe]

I forgot the RIBS. * me they were good. And the chic I was hanging with said they were average and said sorry. As well as the people, they are things I loved about the states. Intentionally traveled through mid west to get it. Is this GTC thing for real?

 

[alfredpunkjazz]

That's a fair point. Japan also has technology and quality that the rest of the world would strive for. Cameras for example. They are simply "one" of the best. Electronics in a bass is also highly subjective to taste. A preamp isn't a new or major scientific secret for many decades. It's probably more about shaping and/or allowing the shaping for the common taste of players. Consider where almost all of the components to make those electronics are made!!! It kind of sounds funny, US electronics made of japanese and chinese components....

Exactly.

May I compliment by saying that even if the bodies and parts of the 3 different jazz basses are not exactly the same, they are done in a very standard way. That's maybe the magic of Fender, that you can have a very decent instrument for not so much money, or you can have, like mlowe said, the sould and extra quality of an American fender.

Eventhough, and I don't want to poison this thread, I've heard that many MANY things that are sold as American are done in México... Maybe not the final touches, or the assembly, but a big part of it... Don't really know if that's true, maybe just that someone wanted revenge for loosing his job at the factory at Ensenada, who knows! LOL

 

[pyrohr]

Take the Fender Factory tour.
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

 

[mlowe]

Take the Fender Factory tour.
[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

Thanks for puting that up, very rare and interesting thing to get to see.

Cheers,

 

[pyrohr]

Thanks for puting that up, very rare and interesting thing to get to see.

Cheers,

I had a friend that took the tour at Corona and told me all he saw, It shed new light on the diffences and how they use certain bodies for MIA basses and others for MIM basses. The assembly process amongst other things. That being said I would take a MIA bass anytime over a MIM bass. Not that MIM basses are bad basses but MIA basses are made with better parts ansd attention to detail. I own a bunch of MIA basses and three MIM basses (all modded) and I say if you can't hear the difference buy an Ibanez, If you can't feel the difference than buy a Squire! In the short term of playing a MIM bass solely they do feel great but if you go back and forth over time you will notice what you pay that extra money for!. If you took a new MIA bass and a new MIM bass a/b'd them by putting both vol and tone on full and playing open strings then fretted notes you will hear a clear difference. The MIM bass will sound "thin" in comparison.

 

[markjazzbassist]

american. hence why i still have my MIA '75 RI Jazz and i don't have my standard jazz fretless.

 

[mlowe]

american. hence why i still have my MIA '75 RI Jazz and i don't have my standard jazz fretless.

Your bass bass wants to migrate to Australia and live in my rack....

 

[mlowe]

I had a friend that took the tour at Corona and told me all he saw, It shed new light on the diffences and how they use certain bodies for MIA basses and others for MIM basses. The assembly process amongst other things. That being said I would take a MIA bass anytime over a MIM bass. Not that MIM basses are bad basses but MIA basses are made with better parts ansd attention to detail. I own a bunch of MIA basses and three MIM basses (all modded) and I say if you can't hear the difference buy an Ibanez, If you can't feel the difference than buy a Squire! In the short term of playing a MIM bass solely they do feel great but if you go back and forth over time you will notice what you pay that extra money for!. If you took a new MIA bass and a new MIM bass a/b'd them by putting both vol and tone on full and playing open strings then fretted notes you will hear a clear difference. The MIM bass will sound "thin" in comparison.

It's this type of information from poeple who have seen it first hand that counts. When you can say, I've been there, spoken to the people who work there and this is how it works.
A simple MIA is better cause it's MIA simply doesn't cut it.

In isolation the one thing I'll allways agree on about the mia but can't say it's any different on the mim is that the playability (to me) couldn't get better. The tone also killer but the build was a bit down considering the decades Fender have had to get QC right. Maybe it's just the volume they produce that prevents them doing so. With one of my newer ones It is suggesting their timbers are not dried enough or sealed from solvents before the nitro is applied. I know ash is pourous but the contraction on the body is like i now play a uke. That doesnt sit to well around the neck cavity. In saying that the playability and tone, which to me are the most important of all are spot on.

As for the squire thing, my daughter (3) has a squire and the neck finish (coating) is better than my 3K mia jazz. Why do the use any form of gloss on a neck????? arrh...

The photos and observations have substance and explain WHY mia can be better. The body timber work is a real fundamental to building a good bass IMO so that was a key peice of info. It was also interesting how work on both mim and mia was done in one factory too.

Is the thinner tone of the mim electronics differences? As many buy mias and upgrade electronics, an mim with the same may bring the tone much closer, even undetectable by ear? Didn't the info say that mims were built mainly with alder too?

Thanks to this info the thread is finally getting somewhere meaningful.

Cheers,

 

[12stringbassist]

There are GOOD Mex's out there.

What I worry about with the Mex is the pickups.
Too weak by far (though the 60th anniversary P has US pickups, but I ended buying a USA model P bass).

I had a Mex Jazz 5 and sold it as the pickups were feeble.
Perhaps I should have swapped them out....

 

[pyrohr]

Yes the MIM bodies are alder but they are five pieces laminated body with alder veneer, Usually MIA bodies are two pieces with no veneer. I'm sure the MIM basses have different pup windings which makes the MIM basses sound slightly thinner than it's MIA counterparts. The entire chemistry and the sum of all parts involved give the MIM and the MIA bass there distinct sound. Those are some of the differences. MIM basses get you in the door with playable and readily upgradable instrument for an affordable price.

 

[roger winkler]

Wasn't the "California" series basically a MIA bass that was painted in the Mexico and assembled in the USA thus the "California" series monika? I seem to remember that's how they got away with calling it a MIA made bass! The parts as far as I remember were upgraded MIM parts but not the same as it's MIA counterparts. Was this bass even made using pure MIA bass parts? Someone correct me if i'm wrong please!

Well, now I'm confused . When I first acquired the MIA I called Fender in California, gave them the serial numbers to make sure it was the real deal. They told me it was all USA made, components, everything. So, you think maybe, they weren't quite telling the truth? Or, they might have stretched the truth a bit on the construction and the components by not being all USA or MIM, or a little bit of both? At this point it doesn't matter because it's still a great player, sounds really good, and is in mint condition for being 10 years old. I really don't know of any other way to research the history on this particular bass. So, someone chime in here if they can help.

 

[mlowe]

Another thing on these points is how long have fender been doing this, these practices will most likely change over periods of time. eg. The body construction may be due to changes in availability of single of two piece ash.

 

[pyrohr]

Well, now I'm confused . When I first acquired the MIA I called Fender in California, gave them the serial numbers to make sure it was the real deal. They told me it was all USA made, components, everything. So, you think maybe, they weren't quite telling the truth? Or, they might have stretched the truth a bit on the construction and the components by not being all USA or MIM, or a little bit of both? At this point it doesn't matter because it's still a great player, sounds really good, and is in mint condition for being 10 years old. I really don't know of any other way to research the history on this particular bass. So, someone chime in here if they can help.

Being a great player and it sounds good is all that matters! That bass was painted in Mexico and then assembled, I'm not sure where but they did use parts made in the USA. I can't remember the reason behind the short run but from what I remember it had to do with the true country of origin of this bass. We know MIM basses start out in California then are painted and assembled in Mexico while all MIA basses are made and assembled here, that bass is painted in Meixco and sent back the the USA. Whether it's assembled when it gets back I don't know, As far the part I believe they are all MIA. as for the quality or if they are the ones used on their MIA counterparts I don't know. Question, does you bass string through the body like other MIA basses?
Iv'e just read some reviews on harmony central about this bass, It's painted (laquer) in Mexico due to inviornmental restrictions here but allowed in Mexico, It has different tuners than it's MIA counterpart, No stb like all MIA basses ( MIA standard series at the time) most likely different pups but being all the parts originated in the USA it's called a MIA bass, it also came in a gig bag not a case like MIA basses. All the prices i've seen it's definately a less expensive bass then the MIA bass.

 

[pyrohr]

Another thing on these points is how long have fender been doing this, these practices will most likely change over periods of time. eg. The body construction may be due to changes in availability of single of two piece ash.

This I think is the reason they have discontinued Natural bodies on MIA series basses since 2001. Fender up until 1997 used "caps" on their sunburst and translucent finishes because of the multiple pieces of wood used to make MIA bodies! By doing this it would look like one maybe two pieces instead of three to five! This is the very practice you see used in the bodies for MIM basses at the Fender tour site I posted.

 

[nellie48]

You get what you pay for.