Hi all i have an ongoing problem i would like to share and hopefully someone can help. I have a music man stingray hh and a markbass 2x10 combo, iam happy with the amp just not the bass. Dont get me wrong i love this bass but me and my guitar player argue constantly about the way i set it.. I turn all four knobs up and use the bridge pickup only. I change my hand position when neccesary but not the pickup. he always says it sounds like a guitar with no low end....... onstage it does sound a little thin but i konow there is bass going out in the house. Ive had sound men tell me not to worry and set it where i want, that they will add the bass in.... i wouldnt mind changing pickups but they all sound muddy [ except for slapping] it adds low end when i change pickups but the notes arent clear and i cant stand not articulating notes... so what do i do,, should i change onboard eq settings, should i ignore jealous guitar players, should i trade the bass in for a single humbucker, or do i keep doing what iam doing..... i want people to know what notes im playing even if they cant tell .... please help ..... thank you so much!!!!
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Musicman Live sound help!!!!!!
- Thread starter Birdland11
- Start date
how about using what your guitarist said as constructive criticism. it couldn't hurt to play around with different sounds and experiment with different EQ positions on your bass and your amp. maybe actually ask him what he thinks should be different and say, ok let me try it, not that u need to stick with it, but be the bigger person and at least cooperate in a band setting maybe? maybe roll off the treble just a little and roll back the mids on either your amp or your bass slightly?
your gear is good man, i dont think you need to change either, just maybe experiment a little instead of having everything full on!
svtb15
Inactive
- Mar 22, 2004
- 13,004
- 4,741
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- I play it all. Whatever works for the gig. Q+
Well the first thing i would do is not dime all the controls on the bass.. I would leave them in their center click area... Nat sound weird to you at first but by doing what you are currently doing with all knobs at 10 and boosting everything, you are creating huge holes in the sound spectrum of the bass..
Try center click position.. and see how that goes
Try center click position.. and see how that goes
Oh iam a team player im not bitching and i always try what he says , i just cant get it to work right.....
It can be a hard thing to get a tone that compliments your bandmates. Personally, from hearing your youtube vid's, I do not think your tone "sucks".
However, you may want to introduce a little more low mids to your tone to get some more "punch" and "kick". (It's really hard to judge camcorder vids for sound.)
I guess my best advice would be to just work with your bandmates and try and find common ground.
I'll agree with the poster above that you should not boost all your controls.
However, you may want to introduce a little more low mids to your tone to get some more "punch" and "kick". (It's really hard to judge camcorder vids for sound.)
I guess my best advice would be to just work with your bandmates and try and find common ground.
I'll agree with the poster above that you should not boost all your controls.
I agree with what svtb15 said. Don't have all the knobs turned all the way up!!! That is a recipe for disaster!
Start at the centre click. I found with my Stingray that to get a good sound I was often either just cutting the treble a little, or boosting the mids or bass depending on the venue. I run the EQ on my amp fairly flat unless I need to get rid of something in a certain room.
Just play around with it, but don't got to extremes - the stingray doesn't need that for most applications. Try adding the front pup and see what happens.
As for the sound guys - if you weren't hitting them with so much high end, then they wouldn't have to add in anything.
Listen to your guitarist - and remember what works in your bedroom will most likely not work in the band situation. It took me 12 years to even consider buying a stingray as I never liked their tone solo - as much as i knew i liked them in a band situation. I don't own one currently but have one on the way (as I regretted selling my other one!!)
Start at the centre click. I found with my Stingray that to get a good sound I was often either just cutting the treble a little, or boosting the mids or bass depending on the venue. I run the EQ on my amp fairly flat unless I need to get rid of something in a certain room.
Just play around with it, but don't got to extremes - the stingray doesn't need that for most applications. Try adding the front pup and see what happens.
As for the sound guys - if you weren't hitting them with so much high end, then they wouldn't have to add in anything.
Listen to your guitarist - and remember what works in your bedroom will most likely not work in the band situation. It took me 12 years to even consider buying a stingray as I never liked their tone solo - as much as i knew i liked them in a band situation. I don't own one currently but have one on the way (as I regretted selling my other one!!)
I think your describing the Stingray tone and its pervailing issues. No they are not bad basses and can sound really good however Ive never found one to sound solid in a mix . Almost brittle at times. Ive owned 3 and traded/sold them all for this very issue. Ive personally found you have to EQ away from the bass quite a bit. The onboard stuff is ok...but as others have said it really detracts from the overall sound. Its sounds like you may be scooping to sound a bit or the sound is scooped however you want to look at it...something Ive had issues with in the past. Def. bump the low mids (250-400) if possible.
Go watch one of Ed Friedland's demo video's of Musicmans on youtube. Almost always you'll hear him say "I'm boosting bass, and mids just a bit, and cutting treble just a bit, or leaving treble flat.
I could never imaging running a stingray with everything maxed. Also... what's your amp, and how do you have it set? The combination of amp settings and maxed MM setting could be mutilating your tone.
IMHO.
.
I could never imaging running a stingray with everything maxed. Also... what's your amp, and how do you have it set? The combination of amp settings and maxed MM setting could be mutilating your tone.
IMHO.
.
I dont have a MM bass (I have G&Ls) but it took me a long time to let go of the fact that it makes the band sound better when I have a fuller tone rather than just me having every note articulated. If I just run the bridge pickup on the G&Ls, there is almost no low end, let alone through a 2x10. I had to really go against my natural instinct to find what works for the band mix. I think the others have offered some really good advice so far.
The low end from your stage amp is almost not certainly getting out into the room - but if you have PA support it probably does not matter. Just experience gained from years of using a wireless.
It sounds like the tone you "Hear in Your Head" is very trebly. If that is the sound you want then you need find band mates that want that also. Don't get mad if some of them dial in muddy tones though.
Its not the bass - it is you. For better or worse.
One thing to avoid is thinking thta you have "The Tone" and always stay with it. Try changing just to grow.
It sounds like the tone you "Hear in Your Head" is very trebly. If that is the sound you want then you need find band mates that want that also. Don't get mad if some of them dial in muddy tones though.
Its not the bass - it is you. For better or worse.
One thing to avoid is thinking thta you have "The Tone" and always stay with it. Try changing just to grow.
Set you tone at the amp,use the onboard eq for minor tweaks. A little goes a long way with the Music Man eq.
+ a bunch to not diming all the knobs. that's like turning all the knobs on your home stereo all the way up then wondering why it sounds like ass.
start with the EQ knobs flat. maybe kick in a pinch of lows, maybe a pinch of mids.
start with the EQ knobs flat. maybe kick in a pinch of lows, maybe a pinch of mids.
I need to noodle with one of those basses the next time I see one, just to see what sort of personality it has. The thing is, I've got a '79 MM Sabre which has a HH layout and although I'd prefer a fader knob for the pickups, it simply has a 3-position selector switch along with boost-only bass/treble knobs.
When I solo the bridge pu, I like to turn up my on-board bass control by about 30-40%. Without the extra low end, it's sharp and burpy, but a little thin. With both pu's running, the tone is rather scooped without a whole lot of mid definition, but when the neck pu is pitching in, the low end is gi-normous. My bass control is only at about 10%.
I agree with the gang in that you need to stop the madness and try settting your on-board preamp controls flat. I'll bet that you might get the low end and the bite in your sound that you want if you run both pu's together, but you might need to cut just a bit of low end and nudge your mids up just a little.
Even if that soloed bridge pu makes your favorite tone, you might enjoy having some room with your preamp so that you can tweak on the fly. Try to find a tone where nothing on your bass or your amp is pegged all the way up.
When I solo the bridge pu, I like to turn up my on-board bass control by about 30-40%. Without the extra low end, it's sharp and burpy, but a little thin. With both pu's running, the tone is rather scooped without a whole lot of mid definition, but when the neck pu is pitching in, the low end is gi-normous. My bass control is only at about 10%.
I agree with the gang in that you need to stop the madness and try settting your on-board preamp controls flat. I'll bet that you might get the low end and the bite in your sound that you want if you run both pu's together, but you might need to cut just a bit of low end and nudge your mids up just a little.
Even if that soloed bridge pu makes your favorite tone, you might enjoy having some room with your preamp so that you can tweak on the fly. Try to find a tone where nothing on your bass or your amp is pegged all the way up.
I don't have an HH, but I do have a standard Stingray. I usually leave the onboard EQ flat, and I take care of the real tone shaping on the amp (slight boost to high mids, slight cut to bass). Occasionally, I might use the onboard EQ cut a little bit of treble or boost the mids a tad.
I've never had issues live with the Stingray's tone. Both my bandmates and the sound guys seem to love it.
I've never had issues live with the Stingray's tone. Both my bandmates and the sound guys seem to love it.
-Set your preamp knobs back to flat
-Boost bass/low mids on amp
-Try flatwound strings
-Get more speakers
all solutions, but the first 3 are easiest
-Boost bass/low mids on amp
-Try flatwound strings
-Get more speakers
all solutions, but the first 3 are easiest
Despite nonsense posts about "pervailing problems" with Stingrays in a mix, I have to say from my own experience (and that of many, many other professional bassists) that a Stingray can sit better in a mix than most basses if you know what you're doing. I've seen Peter Gabriel live three times, and Tony Levin has never, ever sounded bad in the mix.
Do NOT max out the tone controls! Bad plan, for all of the reasons described above.
In most new rooms that I play, I start with everything flat (amp and bass). With my Sterling 5 HH, 9 times out of 10 I end up boosting the low frequencies just off the center detent, cutting the highs just off the center detent, and then using the mid EQ as my "snarl" control (boosted a bit for rockers, cut a bit for ballads). In really lively rooms I may have to add just a bit of low-mid boost at the amp, but this is the exception rather than the rule.
The two sweet toggle positions on an HH are 2 and 4... I find the bridge or neck soloed virtually useless (bridge too thin, neck too tubby), and position 3 only appropriate when you want to conjure up a "boom of doom" tone.
Try the "start at flat" approach and resist the temptation to try and make it sound like a tyrannosaurus in heat, and I think you and your guitarist and the sound guy will all be happy.
Do NOT max out the tone controls! Bad plan, for all of the reasons described above.
In most new rooms that I play, I start with everything flat (amp and bass). With my Sterling 5 HH, 9 times out of 10 I end up boosting the low frequencies just off the center detent, cutting the highs just off the center detent, and then using the mid EQ as my "snarl" control (boosted a bit for rockers, cut a bit for ballads). In really lively rooms I may have to add just a bit of low-mid boost at the amp, but this is the exception rather than the rule.
The two sweet toggle positions on an HH are 2 and 4... I find the bridge or neck soloed virtually useless (bridge too thin, neck too tubby), and position 3 only appropriate when you want to conjure up a "boom of doom" tone.
Try the "start at flat" approach and resist the temptation to try and make it sound like a tyrannosaurus in heat, and I think you and your guitarist and the sound guy will all be happy.
Get a lonog cord or wireless.. work with your guitar guy to set tone from mid house.
Sounds like you're being slightly self focused for a good band spectrum.
Tim
Sounds like you're being slightly self focused for a good band spectrum.
Tim
I agree with a lot of folks. Working with the band is a must...something Im coming to grips with.
Def. doesnt change my past experiences and the brittle high end. I will say I play in a converted warehouse that has been finished into a sanctuary ...so tons of treatment is needed.
Def. doesnt change my past experiences and the brittle high end. I will say I play in a converted warehouse that has been finished into a sanctuary ...so tons of treatment is needed.
