I think if one of my guitarists came in with a 7-string guitar I'd say, "well since it appears you want to be the bass guitarist in this band I guess I'll be leaving now."
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My guitard has a new 7-string axe
- Thread starter p4toda
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I guess this would be the wrong thread to bring up 8 string guitars (F♯-B-E-A-D-G-B-E) in then...
This thread reminds me of the thread in 'Basses' about the guy wanting a 6 string bass, but his band saying no. It's the same but the bass player is doing it to the guitar player. To me it seems like a double standard in music. We can have 5, 6, 7+ string basses, but god forbid a 7 string guitar. Yeah they are going lower. yeah they might be going into our 'territory,' but so what? We're still an octave lower. If they add a metric crap ton of bass to their tone, then yeah there might be a problem. If they have a 7 string and you have a 5 string, then it's a perfect match. You just gotta watch the over all tones.
I used to have a 10 string bass (5 string double course) and I played it a few times. I stopped, not because the guitars said it was in their territory, but because I didn't like the way it sounded, and it had such bad neck dive it was too hard to play. Nothing beats physically holding the neck up and trying to fret at the same time.
If he wants a 7 string let him have it. It's his money, it's his instrument of choice. Like I said, and another post said, just watch the overall tone of the bass and guitar in the band and you'll be fine. Just because HE likes Fieldy doesn't mean you have to klack away too.
I used to have a 10 string bass (5 string double course) and I played it a few times. I stopped, not because the guitars said it was in their territory, but because I didn't like the way it sounded, and it had such bad neck dive it was too hard to play. Nothing beats physically holding the neck up and trying to fret at the same time.
If he wants a 7 string let him have it. It's his money, it's his instrument of choice. Like I said, and another post said, just watch the overall tone of the bass and guitar in the band and you'll be fine. Just because HE likes Fieldy doesn't mean you have to klack away too.
The 5-string bass (in the configuration most of us know it, i.e., with a low B string), came about because bassists wanted to get down to the lowest notes of a keyboard, often times because their bands didn't have one. OTOH you hardly ever have a case where you have a 7-string guitar and don't also have a bass, so then instead of one instrument covering for the other, you have a 2nd instrument reinforcing/fighting the 1st in a frequency range that already consumes a ton of sonic bandwidth with just one instrument.
Of course being a bassist I'm going to be biased toward my instrument but something about a 7th string on a guitar seems a lot more "wrong" than a 5th string on a bass.
And God help the soundman assigned to a band with a 5-string bass, 7-string guitar AND a keyboard. Mud City.
Of course being a bassist I'm going to be biased toward my instrument but something about a 7th string on a guitar seems a lot more "wrong" than a 5th string on a bass.
And God help the soundman assigned to a band with a 5-string bass, 7-string guitar AND a keyboard. Mud City.
I guess this would be the wrong thread to bring up 8 string guitars (F♯-B-E-A-D-G-B-E) in then...
meshuggah ftw and to see how a 7 is capable of sitting in the mix, nevermore is worth checkin out as jeff loomis shreds it up... outworld too if your into the rusty cooley kinda deal
Well, I have had my run around with a 7-string guitar (my brother and I are in a band and hes one) and I would tune my normal 5 string down to drop A. We would drop everything one whole step down, we only did little garage gigs, but when we got into sync and we had the amps all set up, its not necessarily mud city. He *thank to god* didn't feel it was necessary to get as much bass as needed because his highs would be terrible. (we were a metal band and he liked to solo and play higher up). I basically followed him on everything and we sounded really really tight.
Then only reason he got the 7 string was so he could go to drop A and still have that high string and also so it wouldn't be playing a spagetti string.
IMO i played a 4 string with regulars on it in dropped C standard, CGCF. Once you get good at playing with that, dropping down one step is nothing. The string tension is a little different but not bad, but you do have to readjust your neck if it gets bad. I never really did it with the five because the warwicks have huge necks that don't move, but my four i would have to when we wanted to practice.
Basically all I am saying is that, it is possible, and we made it sound good. It just is a matter of if you want adjust or not.
Then only reason he got the 7 string was so he could go to drop A and still have that high string and also so it wouldn't be playing a spagetti string.
IMO i played a 4 string with regulars on it in dropped C standard, CGCF. Once you get good at playing with that, dropping down one step is nothing. The string tension is a little different but not bad, but you do have to readjust your neck if it gets bad. I never really did it with the five because the warwicks have huge necks that don't move, but my four i would have to when we wanted to practice.
Basically all I am saying is that, it is possible, and we made it sound good. It just is a matter of if you want adjust or not.
+1
Use this as an opportunity to NOT play the same note an octave down from the guitar.
My current band played in D standard for the last 10 years. When i got a new guitarist in the band he played in B standard in his other band, so i was like what the heck, i'll give it a shot. I love it. Instead of having to play barre chords to cover notes below D we can just play them now. He has his rig set up so that the gain isn't totally ridiculous, and his low end is kept in check. If he played a mesa triple rec or 5150 i'm sure i'd be screwed lol. He plays a 6 string tuned down that far btw... and it works if set up properly.
I guess what i'm trying to say is have an open mind, give it a shot. Write a song or two and see how it sounds. don't try to play your old songs in a new tuning, it will NEVER sound right. And if you're having problems with his amp being muddy or sounding bad in the new tuning, give him some suggestions on how to fix it. he may not be open to it if you come out and say "we have to do something with your tone" but constructive criticism might get him to play with his settings a little.
I guess what i'm trying to say is have an open mind, give it a shot. Write a song or two and see how it sounds. don't try to play your old songs in a new tuning, it will NEVER sound right. And if you're having problems with his amp being muddy or sounding bad in the new tuning, give him some suggestions on how to fix it. he may not be open to it if you come out and say "we have to do something with your tone" but constructive criticism might get him to play with his settings a little.
The guitarist in my band has a 7 string (not his only guitar, though). Most of the time I play a 4-banger in standard. He's learned that if he's going to chug on the low B, I'm probably going to interpret that as my cue to take a solo.
One fortunate thing is that his tone is not saturated with low end. It's crunchy, but it doesn't interfere with my sound.
I would not be okay with tuning down to low A, though. That's just obscene, in my opinion, for anything faster than stoner doom. We play black metal, so almost all our stuff could be played on a six-string guitar in standard anyway.
My problem with a lot of bands that tune really low is that the bass gets buried in the mix, it seems. Note definition appears to become more and more of a problem the further one tunes down. I think this might be part of why I don't like a lot of death metal.
I have the feeling you've never played with guitarists who downtune and are going for a heavy rock sound, if you can't double their riffs an octave lower, it's really hard to get that heavy sound happening that can be heard on so many records. Doubling guitar riffs one octave lower is sort of a defining characteristic of that style.
By the way, my band's singer (my band's sort of his brainchild) wrote the songs that define our sound in drop C tuning but insists that it is essential for any guitarist who wants to play in a band to turn down that bass knob. I'm sure that if our guitar player decided to do the 7 string drop A thing, he'd still get a walloping if he decided to go all bass heavy and twiddle with his bass knob.
I'm not sure I see what the problem is...
Can't be much harder to cram a 7 string up his *** if he won't turn down compared to a 6.....
Randy
Can't be much harder to cram a 7 string up his *** if he won't turn down compared to a 6.....
Randy
Don't really understand all the hostility towards 7 strings, and drop tunings.
Don't assume that it's going to become muddy until you give it a chance. Anyways, Drop A isn't THAT low. Start getting into the low G-F range, then you have to start making some major changes to tone controls and stuff to keep everything tight sounding. For A, you might have to fiddle with settings a little bit, but it shouldn't be anything drastic. And, I just don't really see what the big deal is of tuning down a whole step... It's only one string and it won't affect tension that much.
Give it a shot at least.
Yes I will give it a shot at the rehearsal, i tried it earlier and i can say that I might need to consider a heavier guage of string, or a better rig.
I am also considering not to change my tuning and just play on the same octave as he is on our overlapping frequencies.
and to add, our guitar tuning was on drop c# before he got the 7-string and there was no need for me to change mine. He just started bitching that i should follow his tuning when he got the seven string.
for two fingers:
i have a friend who is a sound guy and also a retired drummer, i introduced him to my band just to know what are their thoughts on having a sound man. No one in the band supported the idea.
for olaff421
In my original post i mentioned that i have no problem of him having a seven string, the problem was when he insisted on me changing my tuning as i see there is no need.
and for the rest of the people that replied,Thank you. I am considering all opinions, insights and advices.
i have a friend who is a sound guy and also a retired drummer, i introduced him to my band just to know what are their thoughts on having a sound man. No one in the band supported the idea.
Great.
Someone(s) is/are always doing Sound, it's just a matter of how well they do it. "Set & forget" might work, but I'd suggest letting the person who voted "No Soundtech" loudest be responsible for Sound. Including receiving the complaints.
Less crankily, it might work to hire a Soundtech for a couple of gigs to get your sound set up & create a good mix. Then the job is just to "maintain" that.
Well, in my band we tune to drop a on a six-string guitar and a four-string bass (A-A-D-G) so it octaves the a string. Thankfully, my guitar player hates using the bass knob on his amp past maybe four. But, what i've found is that its very important to be in agreement on tunings in a band. You'd be surprised how cranky a guitar player gets when he dislikes the tuning.
- Feb 27, 2005
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As it happens, for a while I played a 7 string guitar in a hard rock band.
Here's the thing...do you trust your guitarist or not? Sure, when I first got it I spent ages chugging away on the low B. Then I tuned down to an A, and still chugged away. It was fun.
Then, I remembered I was in a band, and that I bought the guitar to be more versatile, not lower and louder, and started playing sensibly again.
Just wait 'til he's had some time to get his ya-ya's out, and help him come back to his senses, roll off the bass, and remember that there's six other strings on the thing to play with. The seven string worked out well and filled out the sound as soon as I started acting like a team player again; unless your guitarist is an obnoxious git then a little help will probably set him straight, too.
And don't let anyone tell you how to tune your bass, ever. Play what you need to, however you need to, whichever tuning makes you the most comfortable. My bassist in that band played a four banger, not detuned at all, and it worked well because he knew his job, and we trusted him to do it. He sounded great no matter what I did with a low A.
Here's the thing...do you trust your guitarist or not? Sure, when I first got it I spent ages chugging away on the low B. Then I tuned down to an A, and still chugged away. It was fun.
Then, I remembered I was in a band, and that I bought the guitar to be more versatile, not lower and louder, and started playing sensibly again.
Just wait 'til he's had some time to get his ya-ya's out, and help him come back to his senses, roll off the bass, and remember that there's six other strings on the thing to play with. The seven string worked out well and filled out the sound as soon as I started acting like a team player again; unless your guitarist is an obnoxious git then a little help will probably set him straight, too.
And don't let anyone tell you how to tune your bass, ever. Play what you need to, however you need to, whichever tuning makes you the most comfortable. My bassist in that band played a four banger, not detuned at all, and it worked well because he knew his job, and we trusted him to do it. He sounded great no matter what I did with a low A.
I'm 42 and My guitarist is 25, so he is from the dropped (insert note) era. I have been encouraging him to get a 7 string guitar so there is not all that re-tuning
This might be true in some genres, but I'd argue that in metal it's almost mandatory to be able to match the octave beneath the lowest note on the guitar, as it is going to be heavily used. Following the root note is often just going to be most effective path to take for a song.
I'd also say B or lower for the guitars bottom string is pretty much standard in contemporary "mainstream" heavy music. Think Mastodon (down to A I think), High on Fire, Amon Amarth, the majority of death metal and whatever-core bands, all that "Djent" and sludge/postmetal stuff. I'm hard pressed to think of popular "current" bands that don't.
edit: Just realised how old this thread is...
Zombie thread. Only hacks use 7 strings. Yes, sounds just as stupid when we judge, too.
No jugga jugga metal going on here.
No jugga jugga metal going on here.
