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NBD but is my neck twisted?

#21
Looking from the headstock down, line up the flares on the base of the headstock to the top of the body of the bass. It looks like there's a nice twist to me...toward the treble side. I've had 2 basses with similar twists and they played well and had perfect intonation, I just couldn't live with the knowledge that they were flawed and was concerned that the problem could get worse.
 
#22
I'm not sure, but it looks like the neck may be also sitting in the neck pocket a little off.
Perhaps a shim on one side could compensate for some of the effect of the twist.

If I were you, I's take the time to read the thread on untwisting a neck.
You might yet be able to return it, but it's always good to understand your options.
What else can you do about it on a Sunday evening when the store is closed? :laugh:
 
#24
OK, I checked the neck pocket and it seems all seated - It sounds like the store is going to take it back (whew) but to be safe I sent them these new pics which I marked up with Illustrator using 1px-thick marks. Only about a 2 degree twist, it turns out (I thought it looked like 5), but between that and the action being goofy high with the saddles just about bottomed out, I just think it needs more work than I can devote the time and energy to, even if they did give me a wad of cash back.

bassfront_withmarks.PNG

bassback_withmarks.PNG


I used the neck pocket edge and where the board meets the nut for the front shot marks, and the neckplate edge and widest point of the head for the back shot marks. Plus, the green line perpendicular to the yellow shows it's pulling to one side, too. Note the black rectangle shows true vertical and horizontal; I got the shots where the yellow is as close to true horizontal as possible by standing my phone on edge on the bass, but since it's not perfectly aligned, that's why I included both the yellow lines and the black rectangle.
 
#25
Side note: when I first played it, a couple months ago, it played better than it did yesterday when I finally bought it - and they had given it a setup in between! What the heck?
 
#26
I'll repeat what I said earlier: A twisted neck is less of a problem than a neck with a bad bow or a ski jump. You can work with the setup on this bass, adjusting the truss rod and action to get the G string's action as low as you can. Then see what the E string looks like. The twist means that the E string will always have more relief than the G. But so what? Is the E string's relief and action unacceptable?
 
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#27
I guess if it works on a Torzal Twist Bass, it will work on any bass? A little hard to wrap my head around, but I guess that makes sense. The string would have to maintain a consistent distance (ignoring relief) from nut to bridge, I assume that’s true on a Torzal, but is that how an unintentionally twisted neck will behave? Do the frets just “follow” the twist?
 
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#28
Bruce Johnson said:
I'll repeat what I said earlier: A twisted neck is less of a problem than a neck with a bad bow or a ski jump. You can work with the setup on this bass, adjusting the truss rod and action to get the G string's action as low as you can. Then see what the E string looks like. The twist means that the E string will always have more relief than the G. But so what? Is the E string's relief and action unacceptable?
Click to expand...

Once a neck has twisted like this, is it likely to get any worse under tension over another 10+ years? Or is it that the specific wood choice wasn’t that great in the first place and now it’s settled as is?
 
#29
Microbass said:
Once a neck has twisted like this, is it likely to get any worse under tension over another 10+ years? Or is it that the specific wood choice wasn’t that great in the first place and now it’s settled as is?
Click to expand...

After 10 years, it's probably done twisting, but there's no guarantees. String tension doesn't cause twisting, or really make it worse. And twisting isn't usually caused by an evil, bad, defective piece of neck wood. It's caused by poor layout of the neck on the board. If you look carefully, you'll probably see that the neck was cut so that there was a significant misalignment of the grain lines to the center axis of the neck. It's often called Runout. It's actually more of a problem on one-piece quartersawn necks, than flatsawn necks. As the wood slowly dries out, it twists because of the grain orientation, rather than just bending straight up or down. And the truss rod can't help it. So, twist is more of a manufacturing flaw than just a bad piece of wood.
 
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#31
OK well the store did take it back, but they were a little resistant. Every time one guy would say to another guy that I wanted to return it, they would say something like "the neck has a dip" or "it's bowed too much" they refused to actually say the word "twisted". The tech said "it's bowed too much and the truss is as tight as it goes" - and I'm like dude look at it. I know I like low-AF action and it won't get there without less relief, but don't ignore the actual situation...

Brad has a point, it probably wouldn't twist further, it's already 40 years old. He also has a point that this bass CAN be worked with (probably). I just didn't have the energy to deal with it.
 
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#33
Quick update because it's kind of amusing. Almost 2 years later and I found this bass is *still* for sale at Bill's in MD, and still the same $1300 price tag as before. Description mentions the truss being fully tightened "but a little dip in the fretboard". Sounds like people who do go play it may not be happy with the neck condition. It's too bad, it had amazing sound. Course at this point I'd want to just buy the loaded body and put a medium-scale neck on it anyhow.
 
#34
Truss rod fully tightened is the biggest issue for me with that bass, but I like my E a little higher anyway because it’s so thick. Unfortunately more often than not the grabber- series Basses I run into in the wild have had neck issues. Makes me wish I’d snapped up a working one when they’re were at a price I could justify.
 
#36
Bruce Johnson said:
I'll repeat what I said earlier: A twisted neck is less of a problem than a neck with a bad bow or a ski jump. You can work with the setup on this bass, adjusting the truss rod and action to get the G string's action as low as you can. Then see what the E string looks like. The twist means that the E string will always have more relief than the G. But so what? Is the E string's relief and action unacceptable?
Click to expand...

Agree. On a vintage instrument, this amount of twist wouldn't bug me. In fact, I played a jazz bass once with a twist in that direction and I think it actually felt a little better than a non twisted neck.

If it's irreplaceable and otherwise is your dream vintage bass, I'd keep it as-is and I'd dog that sucker every night.

I think there's a bass, or there was, that has an intentional twist in the neck to a much greater degree than this and it's done that way for playability reasons....

L
 

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