These things
Watershed Store - Stainless Insert Kit (Chrome) (Powered by CubeCart)
Good idea?
yeah or nay?
Watershed Store - Stainless Insert Kit (Chrome) (Powered by CubeCart)
Good idea?
yeah or nay?
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neck bolt inserts
- Thread starter Holliwood
- Start date
Depends. If you remove your necks frequently, they are a great option. If you never take the neck off, don't bother.
I tagged it a BIG ney. I have probably 30 basses and guitars and I can count on one hand the number of times I've taken the neck off of all of them total in the last 10 years. Unless you've got one of those stupid necks with the hidden trussrod screw that requires the neck to be removed to adjust relief, you don't need inserts.
I haven't run this test before but an interesting test to try would be to bolt two hard maple boards together using standard neck screws to represent a normal installation and right along side it use an insert/bolt arrangement. Then torque the crap out of both to the point of failure and measure the force that it took. I'd be interested if there's really much difference between the two and what kind of damage each one does to the body, bolt plate, neck and screw/bolt.
I haven't run this test before but an interesting test to try would be to bolt two hard maple boards together using standard neck screws to represent a normal installation and right along side it use an insert/bolt arrangement. Then torque the crap out of both to the point of failure and measure the force that it took. I'd be interested if there's really much difference between the two and what kind of damage each one does to the body, bolt plate, neck and screw/bolt.
A Yea or nay is too simplistic!
Points:
1. In my experience neck inserts can bring a cheap bass alive! Tests here in TB (with sound clips) proved beyond doubt that this is true. Even if it doesn't change the tone (and sometimes it doesn't) it definitely changes the FEEL of the bass in your hands. Really, really worth it on a cheap bass. My SX, Squire, OLP, MIM Fender, etc. basses all have inserts. They kill.
2. I've also found that with an expensive bass (say G&L with 6 bolts) doing this is a waste of time and effort unless you plan to take the neck on and off a lot. For example I have a bass with BOTH fretted and fretless necks for it. I don't swap necks a lot (once a year if that) but still inserts eliminate the risk of stripped screws etc.
3. In my experience it is a definite NAY on the parts shown. Those barrel-like inserts are NOT easy to install and hard to stabilize. you want THESE:
Amazon.com: 8-32 Int. Thd., .394 Lg., Flushed, E-Z Lok Hex Drive Knife Thread Inserts for Wood (1 Each): Industrial & Scientific
They install super easy. Work like a champ. and are dirt cheap.
I also STRONGLY recommend socket head screws that tighten with an Allen wrench so you can really torque the joint rather than the standard Philips. I use 8-32 flat head or button head screws. Some use heavier but I've found these totally adequate. I have used the chrome Philips oval head screws but prefer the Allen drive.
4. And lastly, when installing inserts I put a tiny dab of epoxy or Gorilla glue on the outside of the insert to lock it in place so it won't turn once you finish the job.
5. I also find that inserts are a good investment on any bass that has neck shims for proper setup. The added torque just eliminates any potential problems from the shims.
So it's not a certain Yea, but in my experience for your junker basses, neck inserts are the snizit.
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It's a maybe. I'd use them if the construction wasn't firm enough, or if I wasted a hole. I would then use bigger ones I suppose. Mounting bushes on the other side of the screws (head) are equally important if no mounting plate (like Fender) is available.
If it's a wood to wood joint between the neck and body, some people might not find much use for this.
But, if you do have a graphite neck, these are an absolute must have. And they're handy on ' standard ' wood necks too. Great product IMO.
But, if you do have a graphite neck, these are an absolute must have. And they're handy on ' standard ' wood necks too. Great product IMO.
It's not "yeah or nay."
It's not "yay or nay."
It's "yea or nay."
OK, now that we've got that cleared up, I'm all yea for them.
It's not "yay or nay."
It's "yea or nay."
OK, now that we've got that cleared up, I'm all yea for them.
I looked into these some time ago on the Luthier's Corner. The completely overwhelming opinion there is that they are entirely worth the effort to install, not because of making the neck easier to remove and put back on, but because of the marked increase in neck joint quality. I'll put them on every bolt-on I ever own. TB'er and luthier Rodent (who actually deserves to be called a luthier) recommended these:
McMaster-Carr
I'd use these plus stainless hex drive pan head bolts (or grade 8 if you're getting all crazy), say, from a local hardware store over that Amazon item, which appears a bit pricey for what you get.
McMaster-Carr
I'd use these plus stainless hex drive pan head bolts (or grade 8 if you're getting all crazy), say, from a local hardware store over that Amazon item, which appears a bit pricey for what you get.
I could swear these things were originally sold as a repair device for stripped screw holes.
Then when a marketing guy (like Billy Mays) got involved, they became a "sustain enhancer".
Pfffft.
Then when a marketing guy (like Billy Mays) got involved, they became a "sustain enhancer".
Pfffft.
- Jun 25, 2007
- 4,531
- 135
- 63
- Disclosures
- Artist:TC Electronic RH450 bass system (original test-pilot)
Actually, I think the builders (like Zon, Tobias, Wal) use them to create a stronger, more stable joint that's likely to suffer less wear-and-tear over the long haul, and also to help eliminate dead spots. And the LC guys (you know, the guys who put food on the table by building basses) like them too, and certainly not to tout some kind of enhanced sustain or tone or some other BS reason. OP, look up the threads on that sub-forum for a whole day's worth of reading.
I put them on one neck and decided I would never do it again! They seem like a good idea. However, if you don't get the holes lined up exactly between the neck and body then they are a total pain to use. With wood screws you have a little play room and forgiveness to get the screws through the body and in to the holes in the neck. With inserts you are putting metal in to metal and have zero tolerance for error.
+1 If those wood screws have a coarse thread they are at least as stable as the proposed inserts. If wood screws have to be put back into the existing holes, they should be carefully guided, so they pick up the old thread.
I have two basses that are identical in make, model and year of production. One has threaded inserts and one doesn't. There is a definite difference in sound and feel (for the better on the bass with the inserts ) between the two basses. I have installed them on two other basses I own and it is always an improvement. Fortunately for me I have access to a drill press which makes for an easy install.
