Double Bass Need a good amp for my upright

[Gearhead43]

No worries. I guess I'm just wondering if I am the only one who feels this way. I haven't read anyone that didn't flip over the AI stuff.

I'm still working on getting a good sound to the house. I've been using the XLR out from the GK . When I can spare the money, I think I'm going to do like Patitucci and send the AMT mic to the house and keep it low in the monitors.

Your not alone in thinking that piezo pickups tend to over-emphasize the nasal midrange frequencies. Alot of bassists prefer a gentle scoop of these frequencies, especially when using bridge-wing mounted piezo pickups.

I like the sound of my Underwood best thru Gallien Krueger amps, as the built-in mid scoop seems to offset some of the nasal quality. A moderate mid attenuation is not always a bad thing when dealing with piezo bass pickups, IMO, YMMV, etc.

 

[Jaromir]

This is interesting to me. I hear this often and my ear tends to disagree. I find that piezo pickups have an unnatural mid-range bump that is contrary to the acoustic sound of my bass. That's why I didn't like the flat frequency response of the Acoustic Image (I also found them to be boomy without engaging the LF shelf). I found that the AI amps amplified this rather undesirable characteristic of the pick up. I actually prefer the "scooped" sound of the GK and Markbass amps, provided you have a decent pre-amp for impedance matching (Fdeck/Fishman). I get way closer to the acoustic sound of my bass this way than I did with AI or the Phil Jones stuff.

Am I alone?

You are not, I feel exactly the same: the flat response of an amp is the LAST thing we need to get a reasonable "acoustic" sound out of a piezo pickup.

 

[Don Sibley]

I tried the new MB combos with the Neo Speakers. These amps are not meant to replace the MB150, completely different tone shaping and a crappy piezo tweeter. I cannot imagine anyone being happy with the sound of their UB through one of these (YMMV).:scowl:

 

[Marc Piane]

If it ain't broke. Guys have been using the MB150 thing for years.

 

[Gearhead43]

I tried the new MB combos with the Neo Speakers. These amps are not meant to replace the MB150, completely different tone shaping and a crappy piezo tweeter. I cannot imagine anyone being happy with the sound of their UB through one of these (YMMV).:scowl:

I have heard from a number of guys who like the sound of these new combos, alot. These are guys who are used to using "standard" GK bass amps for upright though. (Roots music guys, Gypsy Jazz, Western Swing, gut stringers, etc)

I have an MB112 on order, it was very economical choice for me, and has good power and a familiar GK tone section. I am a working musician without alot of bread, and needed a small combo for my Honky Tonk gigs. I will post my views on it after I have gigged with it.

I for one, never cared for the little metal box combos. They sound like puny practice amps to me. I don't play in small ultra-low-volume Jazz combos like so many other guys here, though, so maybe that's why I differ.

I did, however, really like the Markbass 1-12 combo I got to use. It had a nice warm tone and plenty of balls.

I think it's helpfull to give some brief info about yourself when posting about one's experiences with gear. I try to preface my "two cents" with this info when I give opinions here, as I realize my needs may differ from some guys here.

It is aften assumed that we all play one style of music here, and have the same amplification needs, and this is not often the case.

 

[uprightbass.com]

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It is aften assumed that we all play one style of music here, and have the same amplification needs, and this is not often the case.

Very true. As far as amplification, some people strive to get a good overall sound rather than trying to get as close replication of their bass' sound as possible. It's personal preference. People have produced good sound on stage doing either. Whatever does the trick for you and your genre and works for your budget.

 

[Don Sibley]

It is aften assumed that we all play one style of music here, and have the same amplification needs, and this is not often the case.

I guess I just assume that when a musician is planning to amplify their acoustic instrument, they want to hear that instrument, only louder.

I suppose some people might want to "electrify" the sound of their bass, but then I have to wonder: Why bother carrying around that huge beast? Why not just play EUB?

 

[Gearhead43]

I guess I just assume that when a musician is planning to amplify their acoustic instrument, they want to hear that instrument, only louder.

I suppose some people might want to "electrify" the sound of their bass, but then I have to wonder: Why bother carrying around that huge beast? Why not just play EUB?

Ugh. I wonder how many times I have heard that one? :scowl:

No amp, pickup, etc - on earth sounds like a double bass does acoustically - only a mic can do that, sort of, at extremely LOW stage volumes in a live performance - and this is all subject to personal opinions and debate.

The particular amplified sound(s) of a double bass works well for many styles of music. Some of which being music that was created originally on the double bass. (...and yes, music other than Jazz is commonly played on the double bass )

Besides, I don't friggin play EUB - I play the double bass.

For many of us, it isn't our goal to "electrify" our sound -it's a necessity, and I'm not about to toss out my instrument over it.

 

[shadygrove]

...For many of us, it isn't our goal to "electrify" our sound -it's a necessity, and I'm not about to toss out my instrument over it.

Amen, brother Gearhead.

As has been said here on TB many times before "the best amp is no amp". Why not just play an EUB? because I do 90% of my playing unplugged. No amplification except vocals allowed at old-time fiddler's association jams and you'd not be welcomed with open arms at most bluegrass jams either. Besides ever tried to dance with an EUB? I did once. That was enough to know she wasn't the girl for me.

When I'm playing with drums and electric guitars and need volume I do like to hear basically the instrument only louder, but when there is an electric guitar using effects pedals the ability to cut through without feedback becomes a higher priority than retaining a purity of acoustic tone. I rarely get above C on the G string for anything I'm playing in that environment, so no concerns about tone while soloing in thumb position

I'm one of those guys that likes the sound of the new GK combos. The MB 210 is working very well for me, thank you very much. I agree with you about the tweeter though Badong ...fortunately it can be turned off.

 

[desotoslo]

just thought I'd update the thread. I ended up going with a Doubler and Wizzy 112. Will have them both by next week. I've never used a high end amp before (period), so I have a feeling I'll be thrilled with the new amp setup for my upright.

I'll keep the GK Backline 112 around though b/c it sounds great for synths, believe it or not.

Thanks, everyone.

David

 

[uprightbass.com]

I guess I just assume that when a musician is planning to amplify their acoustic instrument, they want to hear that instrument, only louder.

I suppose some people might want to "electrify" the sound of their bass, but then I have to wonder: Why bother carrying around that huge beast? Why not just play EUB?

I believe that the ultimate goal is to make the instrument louder with as little alteration as possible. Being open minded, I do understand that it's expensive to get there, which means that beginners and people of modest means need some option.

Let's see. I spent $500 on a pickup, $300 on a microphone, and $2000 on the amps to get "the sound of my bass but louder". I have way more money in amplification equipment now than my first bass and amp cost me 20 years ago (inflation adjusted even). This is not counting the money lost in trying lots of pickups, mics and amps.

There's the thought that we know of fantastic players with fantastic sounds still using Underwoods and GK's. We know that this setup doesn't reproduce the bass well, but I can't deny that they still get a great upright sound. It's very functional, even though it's not the "honest" reproduction of the bass unamped.

I believe that the idea of altering the tone during amplification in my mind comes from a bass guitarist mentality where those guys rely on amplification gear as a big part of getting the sound that they want. This is me going out on a limb, but I will say that there are those that haven't taken the time to appreciate the innate tone and characteristics of an upright bass and have a tendency to make it have characteristics that they are accustomed to on their amped slab.

 

[uprightbass.com]

just thought I'd update the thread. I ended up going with a Doubler and Wizzy 112. Will have them both by next week. I've never used a high end amp before (period), so I have a feeling I'll be thrilled with the new amp setup for my upright.

I'll keep the GK Backline 112 around though b/c it sounds great for synths, believe it or not.

Thanks, everyone.

David

I'm surprised that you went with the doubler. Did I miss the part where you mention that you play slab too?

 

[Don Sibley]

Perhaps my arguments were somewhat antagonistic. I should be more careful about how I word my posts.

I guess I fundamentally disagree with the idea that "we all have different amplification needs." I am not suggesting that anyone actually switch to EUB. It was intended to illustrate the my point.

With the exception of those who are intentionally trying to electrify the sound of their bass, we all have the same amplification needs: Reproducing the sound of our acoustic instrument with as much fidelity and volume as possible without feedback. It's always going to be a compromise of one form or another (fidelity, volume, cost, complexity, portability).

My earlier post was intended to express my disappointment with the new GK neo combos. IMHO they move further from the goal of fidelity than the MB combos. Obviously they are less expensive, so that may be a compromise some are willing to accept. Hopefully, owners of these amps will be happy with their purchase.

I did not know that the horn could be switched off and would probably do a lot to help the sound of these amps for UB.

Finally, I have never been in a situation where my MB150 was not loud enough. Anytime I was in a venue that required that kind of volume, there was a PA for me to plug into, and the GK became my stage monitor. (including a 9 piece Son Cubano group, and a Hip-Hop group with a live DJ. (YMMV)

My 13 cents

 

[desotoslo]

I'm surprised that you went with the doubler. Did I miss the part where you mention that you play slab too?

Hi, Lawrence!

well, I went with the Doubler b/c I want to be able to blend a microphone and the Realist freely.

The other alternative for that would be a Clarus+ which would be considerably more coin. I decided not to go w/ the used Focus in the classifieds.

Have I made a misjudgment?

thanks, David.

 

[uprightbass.com]

Hi, Lawrence!

well, I went with the Doubler b/c I want to be able to blend a microphone and the Realist freely.

The other alternative for that would be a Clarus+ which would be considerably more coin. I decided not to go w/ the used Focus in the classifieds.

Is the Doubler not suited for acoustic upright? Have I made a misjudgment?

thanks, David.

If I recall right, it's marketed for people who double on the slab and upright, but it'll work great for people who want to blend mics and piezos that are on 1/4" inputs. I didn't realize that you were going to add a mic to your setup. I think that the only possible problem that you may have in the future is if you end up using a mic and piezo pickup or external preamp that also uses and XLR. Otherwise, I think you'll be very pleased with the improvement in sound that you'll get from an amp that is designed with the double bass in mind. It's nice to see a company raising the bar in terms of making an amp for the double bass more affordable.

For the amount you've decided to spend, is there a reason you didn't go with a Coda+ combo instead of the Doubler + Wizzy separate components? A combo does make life easier as a double bassist (can carry all of the gear in one trip). I'm not criticizing your choice, just curious.

 

[desotoslo]

Cool, dude. I feel really good about the decision, and even more so now. I cannot wait.

Cheers!

 

[uprightbass.com]

You're getting the Wizzy 12M not just the 12 right?

 

[desotoslo]

For the amount you've decided to spend, is there a reason you didn't go with a Coda+ combo instead of the Doubler + Wizzy separate components? A combo does make life easier as a double bassist (can carry all of the gear in one trip). I'm not criticizing your choice, just curious.

Wow, now that you mention it, I did not do enough research, as for a couple bills more the Coda+ looks incredible...

You're getting the Wizzy 12M not just the 12 right?

Just the 12. It was on sale in the classifieds. I know I'll be missing the extra bass response, but I figure it'll be better than a wizzy 10 re: bass. Actually, I did research the 12 a good amount, and it seems some people even favor the original 12 over the M, or the difference is not quite so large.

++

well, in the end, I'm glad I have a 12 inch speaker coming rather than 10 inch, as I am playing stuff that does tend to rock a bit. though the Coda+ really looks great and I am actually considering changing things up now

 

[anonymous02282011]

The Acoustic Image stuff and the Euphonic Audio stuff is all very good for upright. For me, my bass, and my tastes I prefer EA. It's really difficult to know what you will like until you've spent some time with the gear.

Coming from what you were using I don't think you will be disappointed with the Doubler. Again, with my set up and my hands, etc, I feel it's a meatier than the Acoustic Image stuff.

 

[uprightbass.com]

Wow, now that you mention it, I did not do enough research, as for a couple bills more the Coda+ looks incredible...




Just the 12. It was on sale in the classifieds. I know I'll be missing the extra bass response, but I figure it'll be better than a wizzy 10 re: bass. Actually, I did research the 12 a good amount, and it seems some people even favor the original 12 over the M, or the difference is not quite so large.

++

well, in the end, I'm glad I have a 12 inch speaker coming rather than 10 inch, as I am playing stuff that does tend to rock a bit. though the Coda+ really looks great and I am actually considering changing things up now

David,

If it's used and you're getting a good deal, then that says it all. A new Coda+ will cost more than used stuff and not too many people are looking to part with their Coda's. Maaaan, sorry for throwing more ideas. You'll be happy with what you've got.