New: Zoom B3n Multi-Effects

[gregmon79]

That's beautiful man. Why did you opt for keepin the tuner if the tuner on the B3n has been improved? Is just for functionality?

 

[gregmon79]

Here are some audio clips. If you've ever heard some of the sound samples I've made in the past, I'm a fan of tones that have a bit of edge and grit/dirt, and are not necessarily pristine. This set of clips is no different. TOOL, RHCP, AIC, STP, and others of that ilk are among my favorite bands and bassists, so if you're looking for polite tones, you'll not like these at all, and apologies that maybe this demo series is of little value to you.

First, I've posted a clip of my Schecter Stiletto Studio 4 string bass, essentially dry with some B3n LMT-76, as a reference (tones set flat, both pickups). It's (for me) a perfectly workable tone as-is, and I've gone fully direct with this bass with nothing else and happily gigged. What I like is how much of an effect the amp/cab modeling have on the tone, and to me it is as good as a mic'd version of the real thing. Of course, you may disagree.

Next you'll hear versions of both the B3 and B3n going into the SVT model/cab sim and then the Limiter. I did spend some time to consciously make these sounds to be pretty close, and they both have a fair amount of amp gain for some hair/overdrive. You may not think that there's much of a difference in the tone, and I'd have to agree, in this context. The settings between both devices are totally different, though, and the B3n amp model has a more flexible and realistic range of sounds/settings IMO. Obviously the cab sim has a lot more flexibility now, and is a different animal than the SVT 8x10 sim in the B3.

Next, you'll hear the same signal chain SVT--8x10--LMT-76, but with the SVT's gain lowered and cleaned up. This is because I wanted the Darkglass PRE and OD to provide the distortion you're hearing, with is quite a different flavor than what you get from the SVT preamp. You may also notice that the Darkglass PRE and OD sound pretty similar the way I've set them, although the 2 slot PRE is ultimately far more flexible, while the OD gets you the flavor but not much control for the tone/EQ.

Feel free to skewer me or fire away with pointed questions. Also, I'm soon hoping to get going on some special effects comparisons and demos for the B3n.

I'm looking forward to some comparisons. Should be awesome.

 

[Spblat]

That's beautiful man. Why did you opt for keepin the tuner if the tuner on the B3n has been improved? Is just for functionality?

As it turns out the tuners in B3 vs. B3n are pretty much the same.

Proof: #1233

 

[gregmon79]

As it turns out the tuners are pretty much the same.

Proof: #1233

Thanks. I noticed that the tuner on the B1Xon was markedly better than the ms60b. I guess it's probably the same type of tuner tech they're using. Not a huge deal. Works in a pinch. Wouldn't rely on it though. So I now see why @CharlieC has the poly onboard still.

 

[JeffreyW]

You are correct. You really wouldn't want that uneffected signal in front of house. For my purposes, I run a direct signal for the sole purpose of feedback by it back into my monitor. The rig I speak of was a question asked by another user.
I run the B3n by itself with no stage amp. Directly into the mixer and fead back to me through powered monitor. The problem is that effected signal which sounds great in the mix out front is not what I need coming out of my monitor. In fact, what I need out of my monitor is rather harsh. This said, I had great success feeding a blended signal to my monitor and letting the B3n handle the FOH. Latency didn't seem an issue in a 5 hour gig today. With my wireless on I was able to listen to FOH and adjust. This multifx unit is great.

Thanks for the warning. ;-)

you seem to think this is a big deal, and I'm honestly interested as to why. Please describe the usage situation of the B3n - or any other modeler/multifx - that would make sense of having BOTH a pre AND post effects DI feed to FOH.

If I'm using a multifx for things such as envelope filters, volume swells with distortion and trailer echoes, flanges, whammy pitch shifts, etc., the last thing I'd want is a prominent mix of a pure dry tone pre-fx, as it would undermine the intent of any effect that is intentionally designed not to resemble a "dry" sound. No?

 

[JeffreyW]

As it turns out the tuners in B3 vs. B3n are pretty much the same.

Proof: #1233

Tuner is ok. A bit of a pain in live use. Display is ok but it has you tapping to get to in and out. I think I'll front it with a Boss.

 

[Midas]

Wow...64 sides of discussion and I just discovered the item in a store hp.... I HOPE the B3N does sounds somehow "better" than the B3 because although I own one I only use my B2 live because although the processors might be "older", it sounds way better than the B3 - in the band!!!!!! Played alone the B3 has many sweet sounds but the B2 cuts through 5 times better than any B3 sound.

 

[Askia]

Wow...64 sides of discussion and I just discovered the item in a store hp.... I HOPE the B3N does sounds somehow "better" than the B3 because although I own one I only use my B2 live because although the processors might be "older", it sounds way better than the B3 - in the band!!!!!! Played alone the B3 has many sweet sounds but the B2 cuts through 5 times better than any B3 sound.

That's truly an interesting point of view, as I've read there are already forum members, who has used the b3n already on gigs. They could share their experiences, how the B3N works in live situation!

 

[FuzzFacetious]

Sounds incredible - I've only toyed with presets but it blows the previous generation away! Now I never need to buy another bass product again (except maybe strings and actual instruments ) - the dirt on many presets sounds better than straight up amp distortion (though maybe I suck at dialing in the amp dirt) and everything tracks perfectly when there's a synth or pitch effect.

I can't seem to find any way to use the expression pedal though ; no volume swell, pitch bend or wah effects built for it yet?

I'll keep the B3 for 3 purposes :

1. Incase I ever need the XLR out live or want to record via USB

2. To use as general delay, verb and limiter in the fx loop for all my main patches to focus on tone and modulation, so I don't waste slots on those always on effects.

3. To use modulation, echo and synth effects with the amp's distortion.

[Maybe : 4. If no expression pedal effects come to the B3n I'll have to use the B3 for them]

So I effectively have :

10 effect slots (7 top grade, 3 MORE THAN decent quality too)
A nice clean bass tone even if I don't use a bass and cab sim in a patch
A distortion even if I don't use any dirt in a patch
USB recording
XLR

All from one cheap amp, cheap b3 in the loop and cheap b3n in front.

Not bad, not bad at all!

 

[jimfist]

I can't seem to find any way to use the expression pedal though ; no volume swell, pitch bend or wah effects built for it yet?

There are 5 dedicated PEDAL effects: Volume, Bass Wah, Pedal Reso (resonance), and two Pedal Pitch effects.

Invalid Link Removed

 

[CharlieC]

That's beautiful man. Why did you opt for keepin the tuner if the tuner on the B3n has been improved? Is just for functionality?

Thanks!

Although the tuner built into the B3n is quite capable, the Polytune provides a much nicer and easier tuning experience.

 

[gregmon79]

Thanks!

Although the tuner built into the B3n is quite capable, the Polytune provides a much nicer and easier tuning experience.

I figured. Nice mute when you need it too. I really want to try a B3n. You guys are making it really difficult to quell GAS for this unit right now. I mean, I can't afford it. But its tempting when I can.

 

[JohnHartford]

L&M called...my unit is in.

I think the kids may have an early bedtime...

 

[JeffreyW]

Wow...64 sides of discussion and I just discovered the item in a store hp.... I HOPE the B3N does sounds somehow "better" than the B3 because although I own one I only use my B2 live because although the processors might be "older", it sounds way better than the B3 - in the band!!!!!! Played alone the B3 has many sweet sounds but the B2 cuts through 5 times better than any B3 sound.

As far as cut. Depends on patch and setup. EQ ect.... I think the B3n sounds great in the mix. A lot of patches don't cut through on stage IMO

 

[JeffreyW]

Do the B3n amps overdrive when the amp gain is increased?
I'm still curious because on the B3, only the SVT & Super-Bass amps had any input gain drive.


(Still hate you all )......

Yes and no. To me it does break up more as gain increases. Im speaking specifically on the SVT model. The gain is way different that the original. Does seem to get dirty but as you increase the gain you have to decrease the volume to prevent clipping the B3n unit, "if you will."
My suggestion is, although this is a great unit and sound similar to amp and cab sims, it responds quite differently. Learn how to get the sound you want out of the B3n rather than trying to make the sims respond like the hardware version.

 

[John Swartz]

Here are some audio clips. If you've ever heard some of the sound samples I've made in the past, I'm a fan of tones that have a bit of edge and grit/dirt, and are not necessarily pristine. This set of clips is no different. TOOL, RHCP, AIC, STP, and others of that ilk are among my favorite bands and bassists, so if you're looking for polite tones, you'll not like these at all, and apologies that maybe this demo series is of little value to you.

First, I've posted a clip of my Schecter Stiletto Studio 4 string bass, essentially dry with some B3n LMT-76, as a reference (tones set flat, both pickups). It's (for me) a perfectly workable tone as-is, and I've gone fully direct with this bass with nothing else and happily gigged. What I like is how much of an effect the amp/cab modeling have on the tone, and to me it is as good as a mic'd version of the real thing. Of course, you may disagree.

Next you'll hear versions of both the B3 and B3n going into the SVT model/cab sim and then the Limiter. I did spend some time to consciously make these sounds to be pretty close, and they both have a fair amount of amp gain for some hair/overdrive. You may not think that there's much of a difference in the tone, and I'd have to agree, in this context. The settings between both devices are totally different, though, and the B3n amp model has a more flexible and realistic range of sounds/settings IMO. Obviously the cab sim has a lot more flexibility now, and is a different animal than the SVT 8x10 sim in the B3.

Next, you'll hear the same signal chain SVT--8x10--LMT-76, but with the SVT's gain lowered and cleaned up. This is because I wanted the Darkglass PRE and OD to provide the distortion you're hearing, with is quite a different flavor than what you get from the SVT preamp. You may also notice that the Darkglass PRE and OD sound pretty similar the way I've set them, although the 2 slot PRE is ultimately far more flexible, while the OD gets you the flavor but not much control for the tone/EQ.

Feel free to skewer me or fire away with pointed questions. Also, I'm soon hoping to get going on some special effects comparisons and demos for the B3n.

Very cool jimfist no skewering here!
Brent

Actually, I have one - the drums are a little too loud...

 

[VerryBerry]

Another Canadian responding to an email from Long & Mcquade stating that "Your order is in". So I detoured and just picked up my B3n.

 

[JeffreyW]

Ok here is a question for you guys. As experienced multifxers know, playing through headphones/ practice amp at home give a way different tone than performance volumes and FOH mixes. How are you guys tweaking your sounds to make them sound great in live situation?
Ex: Running through mixer, ref monitors or going through a full PA.

2nd question???? Do you think that it's good right out of the box with out tweaking? I do notice that the preset patches are pretty level volume wise which has always been a gripe with other pedals.

 

[jimfist]

Ok here is a question for you guys. As experienced multifxers know, playing through headphones/ practice amp at home give a way different tone than performance volumes and FOH mixes. How are you guys tweaking your sounds to make them sound great in live situation?
Ex: Running through mixer, ref monitors or going through a full PA.

2nd question???? Do you think that it's good right out of the box with out tweaking? I do notice that the preset patches are pretty level volume wise which has always been a gripe with other pedals.

1) I only create my patches for gig use at gig stage volume, which for me is pretty loud, and a lot louder when doing this at home than you might feel is necessary...so...LOUD. I also made it a point to get the flattest response speaker system I could reasonably afford (Atomic CLR) as the basis for creating my live patches. Since these speakers don't have a lot of sub content below 80hz, I'm sensitive to not over-hype the low end. The softer the volume you create patches, the more likely the sub low and ultra high frequencies will be jacked-up and need serious HPF/LPF filtering.

2) No. I've never really been able to get a "gig ready" tone straight out of the box with just about any modeler/multi-fx I've ever owned. There's either way too much of something, or way too little of it. I've got to home brew my stuff to get it where I want it.

 

[jimfist]

OK, so I shifted gears here. After downloading the Acoustic 370 amp/cab, I figured to do a demo that showed how much of an impact the cabinet sim (digital cabinet Impulse Response from the 18" speaker) can have on shaping the tone.

This is a cool tone for those looking for the old school vibe of a big, fat, round bass. You can John Paul Jones your arse off all night long with this amp/cab combination. I was really surprised at how much fun this amp+cab tone is to play with.

The three clips are:

1) Dry bass
2) Amp model - no cab simulation (the tone gets slightly overdriven and brittle on the top end)
3) Amp model + cab sim (the drastic high end filtering of the cab IR puts all of that nasty stuff from clip #2 back in its proper place, and adds a boatload of low end).

All three have a little bit of post compression (LMT-76) to take some of the jagged edges off of things (my poor technique on a cheap bass). Also note that I used the default settings for the amp model and cab simulation. Nothing at all was tweaked for tone, so pretty much WYHIWYG.

For those of you into more traditional P-Bass tones (finger style), this one's for you.