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Newbie chasing tone. Am I crazy?

#61
I like the Sire as a learning bass for sure. I'm not sure about the SBMM right now though. It's nice but I don't like how close the g string is to the edge and the tuners, input jack and selector switch are crappy. Most of this can be easily fixed, so I will keep it as my 5-string experiment to see if I want or even need a 5-string.

I do like shiny things though and so I am bound to make a few more mistakes along the way. I do have GAS though for every bass in every color so therapy or a winfall of money is needed.
 
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#62
lomo said:
Well, LOL, I dunno about "noble", but it can be enjoyable. I must admit that if I had a Mulligan on my last 17 years (which is how long I have been playing bass for), I'd be spending a faaaaaaaar less time chasing tone and more time juss' playin'. YMMV.
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Lol. He left Noble out of his booteek list of gear he wasn’t going to chase.
I am with you on the playin’ aspect but I have learned a ton in the last 30 odd years (yes some of them were very odd) chasing tone. It’s been an eye opening, enlightening and enjoyable experience. I could’ve practiced more efficiently for sure but where’s the fun in that? :smug: Although I’d probably be about $30,000 richer. That or dead in a ditch somewhere. Either way, It’s a safe, creative approach to the art form.
 
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#67
My P-bass felt obligatory to keep, but I ended up selling my Jazz after acquiring my 5str Sire P7, to fund a fretless 5 string.

I want to replace the knobs on my Sire, but I personally, find I enjoy having the active-pre. There's nothing to be ashamed about with that bass. But chances are, GAS will get you, you'll find new favorites, go back to old favorites.. as long as it keeps you playing it's justified imo.
 
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#68
Just gonna echo most of the others...learning to play with proper technique will get you the most in your tone quest. If I were in your shoes, which i was not too long ago, I would be practicing:

1. Evenness between my index, middle and ring fingers on my plucking hand.

2. Playing with a straight wrist with my left.

3. Fretting notes just behind the fret.

4. MUTING. Everything else is moot without it.

5. Floating thumb.

6. How to play with a pick

7. Note duration. The attack and cutoff of notes will make a huge difference in your playing.

8. How to work with what you have. Lucky for you, those Sire basses are tone monsters. Learn what each pickup sound like on it's own, together, with the tone rolled off, etc. Then introduce the preamp.

This is by no means a comprehensive list, but there's some good jumping off points. Also make sure your bass is set up right. Its a lot easier to learn when the bass isn't fighting you. Theory education is important as well and music is way more fun when you know what's going on. Best of luck on your journey!
 
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#70
TheLowDown33 said:
Just gonna echo most of the others...learning to play with proper technique will get you the most in your tone quest. If I were in your shoes, which i was not too long ago, I would be practicing:

1. Evenness between my index, middle and ring fingers on my plucking hand.
I didn't know about the ring finger. I've been just using my index and middle so far. Evenness I am working on and alternating fingers.

2. Playing with a straight wrist with my left.

3. Fretting notes just behind the fret.

4. MUTING. Everything else is moot without it.
Working on this but it's a work in progress.

5. Floating thumb.

6. How to play with a pick
I can play better with a pick at the moment but I noticed a post about Carol Kaye and her technique so I guess I have to learn how to play with a pick on a bass.

Points 2, 3 and 5 I picked up from Scott's Bass Lessons videos, as well as posture so at least I am conscious of these. Sometimes it's not so easy. I'm having trouble with flying fingers at times and trying to get space between my middle and ring finger (they tend to want to stay close to each other when the pinky is still fretted)


7. Note duration. The attack and cutoff of notes will make a huge difference in your playing.
I'm trying to incorporate it but muscle memory isn't established enough for me to have much control at this time.

8. How to work with what you have. Lucky for you, those Sire basses are tone monsters. Learn what each pickup sound like on it's own, together, with the tone rolled off, etc. Then introduce the preamp.

This is by no means a comprehensive list, but there's some good jumping off points. Also make sure your bass is set up right. Its a lot easier to learn when the bass isn't fighting you. Theory education is important as well and music is way more fun when you know what's going on. Best of luck on your journey!
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#71
RyanOh said:
My two cents. Explore technique and gear you already have, spend nothing to achieve "tone".
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Agreed.
Try out all the things your hand can do. Change your hand position, the way you pluck the strings (and what part of the finger you use), how you mute them, etc. There's many great ways to change your tone with devices, but there's also a spectacular array of sound to be gotten with your hands.

Practice like heck and in a year or so when you're confident in the tone coming from your fingers then you can worry about modifying your tone with your gear. Maybe you'll end up with a rack of cool toys. Maybe you'll end up like me with just your bass, amp, and a cable to attach them (to be fair, the country, gospel and rock I play doesn't really have a pedal requirement). Wherever you end up it's important to start from a place of knowing what your hands can achieve before you start to augment them.

No aspersion on those who love their pedals and such, but I rarely even touch my tone or EQ knobs, Mostly I'll move my hand to a different plucking or finger contact position, or otherwise vary my attack.
 
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#72
Bassic Needs said:
I am new to bass and so my knowledge is limited in most aspects, especially when it comes to gear. Right now I am playing a Sire V7 into a Focusrite Scarlett. It’s perfect in that I can put on headphones and practice without disturbing anyone and I can practices or play along with songs on the Internet. (I tend to stay in passive-mode when I play, if that matters)

I understand that there are a ton of factors that contribute to your tone/sound, from the instrument perspective, and that it can be the woods used in the body, neck, fretboard, the pickups, the strings, your technique, etc. But after that…it’s everything else I really have yet to grasp and that is the rest of the gear to get your tone.

I am reading about DI’s, Preamps, Preamps/DI’s in one box, Tube vs SS amps, speaker reviews, pedals, etc. The more I read the more I get confused at what I need right now and what I might need/want in the future.

I currently don’t feel the need to get an amp and cab since I have no intentions of playing gigs or being in a band; I just want to learn how to play the bass and enjoy it.

What I would like to do is to find a way to shape my tone. I have lost many-a-night to YouTube videos on sounds and instruments and I think I have a good idea of what sounds I like…but I have no clue achieve them.

Here are a couple of videos so there is context into what sounds I find appealing.

The first 2 are running into an Avalon U5 and then into an Aguilar DB-750 with a Bergantino cab. I love the warmth of the sound here.



The Kinga Glyk sound is just perfection to my ears but I have no idea if she is using anything to shape the tone. This is punchier and if I could get only one sound, I think I would learn towards this.



These MusicForce videos also sound great but I guess they would be considered a more modern sound?





I understand that I will need different basses to get different sounds (J bass, P bass, etc) but for the gear, is it possible to have one set of gear that would cover most of the sounds I like?

Or am I just crazy to be chasing after tone so early in my journey? Help!
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This is only my observation based on MY experience.

Once I am familiar with the piece forward and backwards, I can work on the nuances that the original player imbued within their part.

Their sound, I can usually approximate with minimal effort pedal wise, their style.....to me is the missing part.

If I had to say which of those two thing is more important, its the style, WHICH is helped by having the part nailed down!

Trying to get the sound, the manner in which they played while still learning the part.........makes no sense to me.
 
#73
I’m gonna say something a little wild, but plenty of guitarists swear by this and so do I, and that is spend some time in your practice routine playing an acoustic instrument that is mostly analogous to your electric instrument. For me, personally, that’s the fastest way to improve core tone-producing technique, articulation, dynamics, etc.
 
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#74
BarfanyShart said:
I’m gonna say something a little wild, but plenty of guitarists swear by this and so do I, and that is spend some time in your practice routine playing an acoustic instrument that is mostly analogous to your electric instrument. For me, personally, that’s the fastest way to improve core tone-producing technique, articulation, dynamics, etc.
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I heard that too when I was starting out... but to me it didn't make a lot of sense. There are characteristics inherent to each instrument, so I'd want to train on the instrument I ultimately want to play. It's also about making it pleasant and fun, not a chore: play what you like, because if you like it you're more likely to stick with it.

There's no substitute for putting in the hours, 'though, whatever approach you take.
 
#75
mcnach said:
I heard that too when I was starting out... but to me it didn't make a lot of sense. There are characteristics inherent to each instrument, so I'd want to train on the instrument I ultimately want to play. It's also about making it pleasant and fun, not a chore: play what you like, because if you like it you're more likely to stick with it.

There's no substitute for putting in the hours, 'though, whatever approach you take.
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I think it’s a hard thing for electric bass guitarists to put into practice because acoustic bass guitars are generally very different from electric basses. I have an acoustic set up now that is shorter scale and pitched an octave higher than my electric in order to most closely match the playability of my electric, and it works for my practicing. But it took me a lot of effort and experimentation to dial in on what was going to work best for what I needed.
 
#76
Let's take it as a given that lots of practice at improving your technique will go a long way toward getting you closer to the sound you're looking for.

But, in my opinion, tone processing is just as important, and it's a mistake to virtually ignore it for a few years while you develop your chops. Having a versatile DI in your signal path will make an enormous and immediate improvement in your sound, and you can practice on technique just fine while using the technology and you don't have to spend a lot of money chasing tone. There are numerous tried and true DIs that are pretty affordable (especially on the used market) that will go a long way toward giving you tones like those you posted in the video clips.

I could list dozens and dozens of possibilities but will just stick with a few to start with.

-- Tech21, especially the Sansamp DBDI or the VT bass. The Geddy Lee signature is an option if you want to emulate his tone.

-- JD Radial, either Bassbone or Firefly.

-- Any rack mount or standalone preamp made by a traditional amp company like Ampeg, Mesa, SWR, etc..

-- Any floor unit multi FX processor for bass (Boss, Zoom, Line6, Digitech, etc..)
 
#77
Perhaps more importantly is your choice of headphones. You'll need studio quality phones that won't distort or degrade your sound. If you're using cheap headphones it's going to make your bass sound like dog doo. I guess I should ask which headphones you're using.

I've been practicing with headphones for almost 20 years and typically put in 10-12 hours per week. My favorite value phones are the Sennheiser HD 280 ($99 street price new) but of course there are numerous other choices.

If you do need to upgrade, there is a pair for sale right now in the TB classifieds for $50 and it looks like a great deal. I'd buy them myself but I already have 2 pairs plus several other more expensive cans. You can't go wrong with these as they reproduce bass frequencies very accurately and also isolate your sound so no music leaks out and no room noise leaks in.

Here's a link. I have no connection whatsoever with this seller.
For Sale - Sennheiser HD280 Pro closed studio headphones
 
#78
My current setup is plugging into a Focusrite Scarlett 4i4 and using Beyerdynamic DT 990 Pro headphones.
It's been great in that I can practice without disturbing anyone else in the house but the sound isn't all that pleasant to the ears. Kind of thin and plain. I guess that's how it's supposed to sound.

I was hoping to add something to my setup that would allow me to shape and color the sound. Now I am really new to the tech side of things so I have no clue what gear I need or don't need. I know there is software than can simulate amps and I can tweak the sound from there but I would prefer a real device.

I started looking into preamps/DI's but I don't know if that's what I need. (REDDI, Noble, Two Bass, Tonecraft 363, Jules Monique, etc, because I want tubes if possible. Warmer sound?) From what I understand, the DI portion is to send a good signal to a PA....whereas the preamp is to get a desirable tone and to shape it using whatever EQ functionality it has. If I bought a preamp with EQ and DI functionality would this give me what I am looking for? Would I be able to plug this into the Scarlett?

I want to practice using my PC, the Scarlett and some headphones. I don't plan on buying a cabinet or head at this time. That could change down the road but for now I just want to get the best setup I can for practicing quietly.
 
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