• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Double Bass NS Design WAV4 megathread part II

#342
fred pratt said:
Thanks, Francois and Nichola.

A sponge seems like a great idea, obvious enough for me to have overlooked it. (Fender and Rickenbacher electric basses I've had in the past came with one form or another of tailpiece string damping.)
Click to expand...
... I'd really recommend trying sponge(s) in all sorts of different positions...be brave

fred pratt said:
I'm not sure how to use compression to decrease sustain though. My limited understanding of compression was that by decreasing the transient volume of the attack it allowed overall volume to be slightly greater and more consistent throught the length of the note, thereby increasing rather than decreasing sustain.
Click to expand...

My "understanding" is limited to twiddling with knobs til I get a sound I like... So, I'm not a sound engineer... And I run the risk of getting out of my depth if I explain the "why" of it. But I have engineered most of my recordings. So I have practical experience.

Yes, in the "Loudness Wars, it's true that, compression is mostly used to "compress up"... i.e. to boost lower volume so that it is more detectable, without raising the volume of the loudest element. i..e. "Raising the floor".

But... you can compress down - which has the effect of lowering the ceiling. i.e pushing down the loud bits.

Doing both at the same time creates a narrower band of sound "above X and below Y"

This squished down band of sound in itself doesn't affect sustain, but it does affect timbre. And this can create a more percussive or thumpy feel as opposed to a more tonal or melodic feel. I got a sense from your note (and listening to your tunes... outstanding BTW) - That this is what you were looking for.

In addition, what _does_ affect sustain is how quickly and aggressively these compression effects kick in and kick out. This is the attack and release... the back end is also sometimes referred to as "decay"

Usually engineers are trying for a smooth transition, so that "clipping" doesn't occur, or is minimized. This smooth decay, combined with upwards compression may actually increase the perception of sustained sound. i.e. it increase the perception of those faint lingering tones.

However, in your case, you don't want a gradual effect, you almost _want_ it to clip. So, you can go the other way... Squish the sound (top and bottom) to get your thumpiness ... Use a fairly steep attack (too steep and it sounds like you're coming in halfway through a conversation)... and a really steep decay which cuts off all that lingering subtlety. Voila...

...Anyway, there are probably REAL engineers out there who would develop a nose bleed reading my attempts to explain something that I am not trained for...

Bottom line is that if you twiddle enough knobs, you'll likely find a sound you like. And, it really does seem to me that what you are venturing into is "modeling" your sound rather than revisiting string choice.

There's some info here (including sound samples) which may be of interest... although this guy's emphasis is on slower attack and BIG sound... so it's not the application you'd be looking at, but you will get sense of it.

Link Removed

Cheers,

N

p.s. The free recording/engineering software I use is Audacity: http://audacity.sourceforge.net/

It's a fantastic (free) way of "twiddling knobs"
 
#343
Thanks so much for taking the time to write and to listen to my band's music.

That was a great explanation of compression. I have a feeling I might not have understood a "real" engineer's explanation so well.

As an acoustic player and technophobe, I usually want to start with a sound I like and keep my signal chain simple, so strings and sponges is appeal to me more. But I do happen to have an old Blue Max compressor lying around. It might be worth trying.

FP
 
#345
I'm trying to come up with a portable setup which can easily switch between my WAV4 and a regular electric 5 string. So I _think_ I'm looking for something with a good digitally controllable (can store different settings) preamp/eq section. Some of the options I'm considering are the SansAmp Bass Driver Deluxe and the TC Electronics RH450. Any experiences with running a WAV4 directly into a either of these?
 
#348
relwof said:
I'm trying to come up with a portable setup which can easily switch between my WAV4 and a regular electric 5 string. So I _think_ I'm looking for something with a good digitally controllable (can store different settings) preamp/eq section. Some of the options I'm considering are the SansAmp Bass Driver Deluxe and the TC Electronics RH450. Any experiences with running a WAV4 directly into a either of these?
Click to expand...
Why not just a passive looper AB-Y box like a Radial? I use a custom made looper AB-Ypedal with a mute switch on it, LEDs to indicate which input is active. Easily switches between both instruments on the fly and then outputs to one input on the amp head
 
#349
mrpackerguy said:
Why not just a passive looper AB-Y box like a Radial? I use a custom made looper AB-Ypedal with a mute switch on it, LEDs to indicate which input is active. Easily switches between both instruments on the fly and then outputs to one input on the amp head
Click to expand...

I prefer using a Radial Bassbone instead an A/B box cause you can use different volume and eq setting. Often the differences in sound and level between a passive Wav 4 and for example an active 5 strings are not easy to control.
You have to change eq and volume on your amp everytime you switch between instruments. With a Bassbone you can set everything and recall with your feet. It also has a boost for solo pieces, effect send and return , a professional sounding DI box xlr output and also a tuner out.
 
#351
Impossible to compare.
The wav has not acoustic sound and the $600 upright has no electric sound, unless you spend other $200 for a pickup. Also, the electric sound depends from what kind of pickup and strings you are using. Whith real upright strings(I use Spyrocores) the wav has a good amplified upright sound with no feedback and it's very portable, but it's not the real thing (well...maybe also a $600 upright is not the real thing).
Also, the Wav is ready to go, the cheap upright will need new strings, a professional setup and a pickup installed.
Just my opinion.:)
 
#352
I got a private message about the WAV/NXT, and thought it might be helpful to post my response. Others have posted about these as well, but it's a common question, so I thought a re-post might be helpful.

Hi Mark,
... if I need to upgrade the tuners, what did you use, and was it difficult to swap them out with the stock tuners? many thanks!
Click to expand...

I got Hipshot UltraLites to replace the stock tuners, and they are a huge upgrade - smoother, and more reliable and sturdy. They come in 3/8 and 1/2 sizes - you need the 3/8.

The headstock holes needed to be widened slightly to accommodate them, and I installed them at an angle to fit them better (and use the stock anchor screw hole - they actually look really cool on the angle.) They are "ambidextrous" - you can easily reconfigure one to a left or right side tuner, so you just need a set of four.

wavtuners.jpg
 
#354
Wow that is interesting. I am a total newbie in the DB/EUB world. I was looking at the WAV as a good way to dive in (comfortable, portable, fret markers, good reviews from what I've seen over some other "entry level EUB's". I haven't had a chance to read through all these megathreads, but do you think the WAV is being discontinued b/c of quality issues. Is it worth it to jump to the NXT line? Thanks for giving me a starting point.
 
#355
NOLA Bass said:
Wow that is interesting. I am a total newbie in the DB/EUB world. I was looking at the WAV as a good way to dive in (comfortable, portable, fret markers, good reviews from what I've seen over some other "entry level EUB's". I haven't had a chance to read through all these megathreads, but do you think the WAV is being discontinued b/c of quality issues. Is it worth it to jump to the NXT line? Thanks for giving me a starting point.
Click to expand...
I have one of the Chinese WAV4s and the build quality IMO is excellent. Like you, it was my entre into the DB world. I'm loving it. Read through the WAV4 megathread - good reading, lots of info.
 
#356
NOLA Bass said:
...do you think the WAV is being discontinued b/c of quality issues. Is it worth it to jump to the NXT line? Thanks for giving me a starting point.
Click to expand...

I can't speak for NS Design, but since they make the NXT in the same factory in the Czech Republic where they have been making their CR models for years, I imagine it has something to do with keeping production costs down by keeping everything under one roof. But who knows?

As for quality differences, the NXT is a definite step up - I own a WAV4 myself (the unusual blue one shown above), and if I had them side-by-side and were choosing today, I'd definitely shell out the extra clams for the NXT. Better woods, tighter construction, more resonance. That said, considering that I own the WAV already, I'm have no plans to take the loss by selling it to "trade up" for the NXT.
 
#357
Thanks guys for the great info. Although I'm guessing the WAV would be a fine introduction, it seems the NXT might be worth upgrading too considering it is not a huge price difference. I guess that might be why the WAV is being discontinued, the price points are just not that far apart in the grand scheme of things. If someone really wants an NS, they will likely save the few hundred extra for the NXT. Perhaps, the few lost sales aren't worth the headache of dealing with a whole other line and the chinese production. Of course, that is all conjecture on my point.
Nonetheless, I'm excited to take the EUB plunge!
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back