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Opinions on my first rig?

El Raro

El Raro

Feb 6, 2009
1,071
298
Sydney, Australia
#1
I'm looking into playing gigs within the next few months. This of course means I will need a half decent rig that's road worthy. I'm currently playing on a 35 watt prac amp so that's clearly out of the question.

Money is a little bit of an issue for me. I'm looking for something affordable but practical. The style I will be playing will essentially be prog metal with jazz and industrial influences. After doing a bit of window shopping I've come across this rig:

Ashdown amp head:
Invalid Link Removed

Ashdown 2x10 cab:
Invalid Link Removed

I don't know the models of these items nor are they displayed on the site so if anyone knows please feel free to post them here.

So based on what I've mentioned above, would this rig be fine for my needs? Or will I need something else/less? Suggestions most welcome.

Thanks in advance.
 
#5
Ah, thats my fault. The speakers part of the link always gets me.

But Avatar is a buy and build company. I dont believe there are any places, other than their place of bussiness, that stocks them. But they get great reviews everywhere. Ah, Austrailian prices stike again.

I feel bad for you Aussies.
 
#6
Thanks for the link, Volt.

Well I guess that rules out Avatar speakers for me. We always get the short end of the stick here in Oz...guess that's what we get for being so far away from everything :P.

Any other suggestions? What about amps themselves? And what about thoughts on the rig mentioned in my original post?
 
#7
I actually like the sound of Ashdown amplifiers quite a bit and think that the tone would suit quite well. With 300W and a single 8ohm 2x10, I'm not sure how happy you will be in terms of volume and presence with a band like what you describe. Others may disagree with me, but I like more power and speakers when gigging. Maybe an Avatar 4x10 would be the ticket. I've not heard the Avatar, but it is a 4ohm 4x10, which would really, really help and the cost is similar to the Ashdown 2x10. If you could swing another $600 AUD, you could get also the 575w Ashdown head. That rig should be awesome. If you get the 300w head, you may well not be happy with the results and want to trade up anyways and lose on the deal.

Just my .02...
 
#8
Ok, my suggestion is to look for used gear. If you plan on gigging, look for around 300 watts and if you want 10's, at least 4 of them. A 210 works for many, but you said prog metal, and a single 210 won't cut it, imo. I'd actually prefer a 410 and a 15, or a 412, anything with alot of speakers. They're your friend when you need volume, big spkrs, and lots of 'em
 
#9
Alright now we're getting somewhere.

Thanks for the suggestion, Alexander, but unfortunately I'm not capable of obtaining Avatar speakers to my knowledge as mentioned earlier. After going through the website, it would be a godsend if I came across a dealer that stocked them here...but I am yet to see any results.

RicknBoogie, I was thinking that a 2x10 speaker wouldn't do me any justice but I wasn't sure since I don't have much expertise with amps. Also, I was thinking on a financial level...as in sacrificing good sound for the sake of my wallet. Sad but its out of my hands.
But you recommend at least a 4x10 for decent gigging in my case. I'm sure I can find an affordable cab in mind then. I haven't considered 2nd hand yet so I'll see what I can dig up at local pawn shops or even music retailers if they have any 2nd hand gear.

Keep em' coming, guys. The more knowledge the better!
 
#10
RickenBoogie said:
Ok, my suggestion is to look for used gear. If you plan on gigging, look for around 300 watts and if you want 10's, at least 4 of them. A 210 works for many, but you said prog metal, and a single 210 won't cut it, imo. I'd actually prefer a 410 and a 15, or a 412, anything with alot of speakers. They're your friend when you need volume, big spkrs, and lots of 'em
Click to expand...

+1

You're probably gonna want AT LEAST a 410 for playing any sort metal. Also, I've heard the ashdown stuff sounds good, but that they're a bit quieter than the wattage they suggest. My guess is that if you bought the ashdown rig you would end up upgrading the amplifier and adding more cabs pretty quickly.

On a budget it might be better to buy cheaper used gear that focuses on moving air first and then replace whatever you can with better stuff later. It does very little good to have a nice tone if no one can hear it.

*EDIT* the amp is a MAG 300 and the cab is a MAG 210. Both are pretty far into the budget catagory, you could buy about anything other than behringer and be on equal footing with that set up. I see those on Craigslist for $300 - $400 (US) for the whole rig on a regular basis.
 
#11
baalroo said:
+1

You're probably gonna want AT LEAST a 410 for playing any sort metal. Also, I've heard the ashdown stuff sounds good, but that they're a bit quieter than the wattage they suggest. My guess is that if you bought the ashdown rig you would end up upgrading the amplifier and adding more cabs pretty quickly.

On a budget it might be better to buy cheaper used gear that focuses on moving air first and then replace whatever you can with better stuff later. It does very little good to have a nice tone if no one can hear it.
Click to expand...

Noted. I'll scavenge around the local music shops tomorrow and see if they have any 2nd hand gear available. Thanks for that.

But while we're on the subject of 4x10s, how do Behringers compare with overall quality and sound? I found this just now for a tempting price...but something tells me I'll be getting what I paid for (in the negative sense)...

Behringer ULTRABASS BA410 4X10 Bass Cabinet:
http://www.allansmusic.com.au/Product.aspx?c=B93C30ED-B26F-4794-942F-67EDE1EA6BC3&p=109580&r=3

Thoughts on this one?
 
#13
Honestly behringer stuff sounds "ok." The problem is the build quality is TERRIBLE. I've seen a lot of dudes with behringer gear (brand new) who spend more time trying to get the gear to work properly than they do playing through it.

Behringer survives on desperate people making uninformed purchases.

However, with music gear you don't always "get what you pay for," there are plenty of companies that make decent - good "cheap" gear that'll do the trick for you. Just keep an eye out, BE AS PATIENT AS YOU CAN, and keep asking questions here when you spot things that seem like a good deal and you should end up with something that'll work for you.
 
#14
RickenBoogie said:
Ok, my suggestion is to look for used gear. If you plan on gigging, look for around 300 watts and if you want 10's, at least 4 of them. A 210 works for many, but you said prog metal, and a single 210 won't cut it, imo. I'd actually prefer a 410 and a 15, or a 412, anything with alot of speakers. They're your friend when you need volume, big spkrs, and lots of 'em
Click to expand...


I very much agree with this post. Sorry - I posted earlier before seeing the posts about Avatar not working for you. You should be able to find very good prices on used gear these days. I won't gig with less than a 4x10 and I think at least 400w is a must as well (assuming we're talking solid state). You should be able to find something in the same price range the rig you originally posted that would be this big.
 
#16
Ok thanks again for the input, guys.

One question. You guys are mentioning watts with the speakers. Are you referring to the output from the cabs themselves or are you referring to the watts from the amps? I got a little confused there when you mentioned 300 - 400 watts.

EDIT: Nevermind I get what you guys were talking about.
 
#18
Ok based on the above info, here's a new rig suggestion.

Speakers-

Hartke VX410 4x10 VX Series Bass Speaker Cabinet:
http://www.allansmusic.com.au/Product.aspx?c=B93C30ED-B26F-4794-942F-67EDE1EA6BC3&p=34539&r=4

OR

Hartke 410T 4x10 Transporter Series Bass Speaker Cabinet:
http://www.allansmusic.com.au/Product.aspx?c=B93C30ED-B26F-4794-942F-67EDE1EA6BC3&p=27720&r=4

Amp head-

Hartke H2500BH - Bass Head
http://www.allansmusic.com.au/Product.aspx?c=D43EBC89-48A2-4B82-9975-7DBBFA82FF3A&p=110508&r=4

The Ashdown, while powerful, is a little pricey for me so I'm willing to sacrifice some power at the moment. But 250 should be decent enough...right?
 
#19
El Raro said:
Ok based on the above info, here's a new rig suggestion.

Speakers-

Hartke VX410 4x10 VX Series Bass Speaker Cabinet:
http://www.allansmusic.com.au/Product.aspx?c=B93C30ED-B26F-4794-942F-67EDE1EA6BC3&p=34539&r=4

OR

Hartke 410T 4x10 Transporter Series Bass Speaker Cabinet:
http://www.allansmusic.com.au/Product.aspx?c=B93C30ED-B26F-4794-942F-67EDE1EA6BC3&p=27720&r=4

Amp head-

Hartke H2500BH - Bass Head
http://www.allansmusic.com.au/Product.aspx?c=D43EBC89-48A2-4B82-9975-7DBBFA82FF3A&p=110508&r=4

The Ashdown, while powerful, is a little pricey for me so I'm willing to sacrifice some power at the moment. But 250 should be decent enough...right?
Click to expand...

Looking at the specs given for what you are asking about tells me that the amp will probably get by for you, but if you're playing loud, you might be short on power. It will only put out 250watts into a 4 ohm load. Both of those speaker cabs are 8 ohms, so the amp will only be able to put out 180 watts into either one.

I'd go with the VX cabinet over the Transporter. A friend of mine has a 4x10 Trasporter and it breaks up very easily even when driven not too loud. I think his amp was only capable of putting out 200 watts into 8 ohms and the Transporter would start sounding really bad well before the amp ran out of power. The Transporter also wasn't very efficient.

So if 180 watts will do it for you, you might be okay with that rig. I don't know what brands are available in Australia at affordable prices, but you might want to look at Peavey 4x10 cabinets. They are at least as good as the Hartke and some are available in 4 ohm versions.
 
#20
Instead of a standard 4x10 you could think about a pair of 2x10s. I find this a great setup especially when stacked vertically. As to make, you have to go with what is available in your neck of the woods. It's useless for we North Americans to advise on equipment for someone who lives half a world away.

Paul
 

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