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Payment Options Advice Please

Kmrumedy

Kmrumedy

May 12, 2004
1,940
2,770
Montreal, Canada
#1
Hi Guys -

I placed an expensive instrument for sale on an FB owners group forum. A person reached out to purchase the instrument who happens to be a member here with references.

On the FB forum I stated payment would be Paypal FF as I won't ship until I have the funds in my account. The buyer is requesting Goods & Services and willing to pay the extra fees. Totally understandable request.

But this is a $10K transaction. I'm not comfortable shipping without first receiving the funds. Last time I used PP G&S on a $7K transaction, they held my money for no reason over 3 weeks. scared the crap out of me. I swore I would never use them again.

Can anyone suggest any options to make both of us feel safe to carry on with this transaction?
 
#2
Your request to use PayPal FF is unreasonable. Anyone spending $10k and using PayPal friends and family is a fool*.

This transaction was made for PayPal G&S. Holding funds is part of what they do in certain cases (Why is Your PayPal Payment on Hold: A Guide for Merchants).

*unless of course they happen to actually be close friends/family, that is not the case here
 
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#3
Understood. Perhaps I just build a written agreement between us where we stipulate clear return policy, payment etc.

My only fear with G&S is the recent rash reports on here of sellers claiming buyers making unwarranted claims getting their money back and then being at the mercy of the return.
 
#10
Interesting.

I found myself in a very similar situation about 3 or so years ago, when I was considering selling a 10k+ bass and was reluctant to ship.

My thinking then (and now) is the risk of damage in transit and insurers' extremely spotty record of honoring justified claims isn't worth it, and anyone serious about an instrument like this should have no problem with making the trip to see it and play It in person.

After all, If the item in question is a classic car (or a high end double bass) buyers generally EXPECT to have to travel to view and purchase the item.

However the prevailing TB advice at the time was to suck it up; If a buyer was willing to part with 10K+ sight unseen, I should respect that and follow shipping protocall using due diligence. The risks are basically part of the cost of doing business. Sorry but I don't agree with that then or now.

Perhaps in the intervening 3 years we have become more saturated with the horror stories of shipping gone wrong. Maybe it is starting to sink in that shipping comparatively expensive and fragile items is generally a risk that is not worth taking.

I do think tere is a point at which shipping is still practical. With instruments up to say $2500 or so, I would be more willing to take that risk. But once you start to hit hit price points above that, buyers often start to get very particular (and sometimes quite weird) about what they are buying and the circumstances involved. No thanks.

Even if it takes considerably longer to arrive at a transaction, an in person sale seems to be the answer to most of these issues.
 
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#11
Kmrumedy said:
Last time I used PP G&S on a $7K transaction, they held my money for no reason over 3 weeks.

Can anyone suggest any options to make both of us feel safe to carry on with this transaction?
Click to expand...
They held your money for 3 weeks to make sure you weren't a scammer. And now that you're insisting on FF you really DO look like a scammer.

But for a real suggestion: For a $10k instrument, someone should be willing to drop a couple hundred on a plane ticket and do the sale in person. The cost is part of doing business.
 
#12
BASSDROID said:
Interesting.

I found myself in a very similar situation about 3 or so years ago, when I was considering selling a 10k+ bass and was reluctant to ship.

My thinking then (and now) is the risk of damage in transit and insurers' extremely spotty record of honoring justified claims isn't worth it, and anyone serious about an instrument like this should have no problem with making the trip to see it and play It in person.

After all, If the item in question is a classic car (or a high end double bass) buyers generally EXPECT to have to travel to view and purchase the item.

However the prevailing TB advice at the time was to suck it up; If a buyer was willing to part with 10K+ sight unseen, I should respect that and follow shipping protocall using due diligence. The risks are basically part of the cost of doing business. Sorry but I don't agree with that then or now.

Perhaps in the intervening 3 years we have become more saturated with the horror stories of shipping gone wrong. Maybe it is starting to sink in that shipping comparatively expensive and fragile items is generally a risk that is not worth taking.

I do think tere is a point at which shipping is still practical. With instruments up to say $2500 or so, I would be more willing to take that risk. But once you start to hit hit price points above that, buyers often start to get very particular (and sometimes quite weird) about what they are buying and the circumstances involved. No thanks.

Even if it takes considerably longer to arrive at a transaction, an in person sale seems to be the answer to most of these issues.
Click to expand...
my daughtger is into classic cars. in 2 cases, she bought the cars, but once she found issues in person that the seller didn't really understand, and she was really happy she spent the $400 to fly out and back rather than buy a $25,000 car online and either have to find those scarce parts or go through the hassle of a return.
juniorh said:
They held your money for 3 weeks to make sure you weren't a scammer. And now that you're insisting on FF you really DO look like a scammer.
Click to expand...
unless the buyer has buyer's remorse or is a scammer, in which case you can end up in a dispute or return situation that can be complicated by the buyer swearing damage they did to the instrument was how they received it.
 
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#13
I relatively recently went through a similar conundrum in that I was hesitant in shipping an expensive bass (two actually, but neither nearly as valuable as yours). My issue was accepting payment, then insuring it for the purchase price. The problem with that is if anything happens to the bass and assume you get the sale value in insurance - if you take the payment up front, which you will - you have to reimburse the seller. Meanwhile, you're out a nice bass. The only real way around it is to insure for twice the actual purchase price and then you both get reimbursed, but that would be expensive.

The other thing is to take a ton of pictures. Both of the bass, pre-packed and during the packing process. It might even be beneficial to take a video of the whole packing process. That way if there is any transit damage, there is indisputable proof of the condition of the bass. It may also thwart any potential "buyers remorse" claims.

Good luck with the sale! (I hope it's not the Dingwall).
 
#14
Thank you everyone for the input. I appreciate it.

The buyer is in California and I am in Montreal Canada... 3000 miles in distance.

The bass is a Fodera for those that are wondering. They get sold and shipped on here all the time. I might ask that group for advice too.

I sell all my higher end gear into the US. I can use the 34% exchange rate and offer US buyers deals they wouldn't normally see while still not losing money by selling locally. It allows deals to happen much more quickly and I don't have to deal with the lowballers as the attractive price attracts serious buyers with money.

I do drive 5-6 hours to pick up or deliver instruments of this price range. California is not an option in this case.

My plan is to send a video to the buyer so he can see all the details of the bass before it ships. Video of the bass as it is packaged as proof of condition and packaging. In return he agrees to sale "as is" and no returns in writing unless there is obvious damage in shipping. Not sure what else I can do. The buyer is a member here so there are references. The other offers I got had no references.
 
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