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Double Bass Pickup for my upright
- Thread starter RDMJ
- Start date
I think you would be happy with one of the David Gage picks (classic Realist or the Lifeline) or your choice of piezos that get wedged in the bridge wing (K&K, Planet Wing, etc).
Personally, I've never had luck with bridge wing mounted pickups, but lots of people do. Currently using the Lifeline and am mostly happy with it. The classic Realist is really plug and play, kind of limited sonic palate, but for the music you are playing, there is a good chance that it would be what you want. It will scratch and maybe leave an imprint on your table, where as the Lifeline won't (assuming you have an adjustable bridge).
There are a bunch of other choices. They're all fine. They all suck. Chasing the perfect sound is very expensive and can be impractical (preamps, feedback, bleed, blending multiple signals, etc). I'd start with something simple. Traynor makes good amps, I'd pick something that you can plug straight in and go with.
Personally, I've never had luck with bridge wing mounted pickups, but lots of people do. Currently using the Lifeline and am mostly happy with it. The classic Realist is really plug and play, kind of limited sonic palate, but for the music you are playing, there is a good chance that it would be what you want. It will scratch and maybe leave an imprint on your table, where as the Lifeline won't (assuming you have an adjustable bridge).
There are a bunch of other choices. They're all fine. They all suck. Chasing the perfect sound is very expensive and can be impractical (preamps, feedback, bleed, blending multiple signals, etc). I'd start with something simple. Traynor makes good amps, I'd pick something that you can plug straight in and go with.
Check with your luthier. Mine installed two pickups for me and let me play them in the shop while I was in for a setup. The Full Circle happened to be a clear winner for my Eastman ply bass with dead orchestral strings. I wonder if I would have made the same choice today, now that the bass is wearing Spiros... But not enough to find out. Anyway, it sounds like a pickup to me, but it's worked fine for all the acoustic folk gigging I've done with it.
Piezos are relatively easy to install and position, can be less expensive, and they tend to have less problem with feedback at higher volume levels. But they tend to work best with a pre-amp, they are commonly said to have a 10-year life span, and they also tend to not reproduce the same acoustic tone that a DB produces, ie: they tend to sound more electric.
Mics can range from inexpensive to very expensive, they are much more prone to feedback at higher volume levels, their placement, including mounting method can be very critical to tone quality, but when located in an optimal spot they can reproduce acoustic tone extremely well.
Both are very popular. Some people have and use both either simultaneously or at different times/situations.
It's another rabbit hole, but you should probably read up and decide which direction you want to go regarding piezo vs mic, and then start worrying about which one(s).
Mics can range from inexpensive to very expensive, they are much more prone to feedback at higher volume levels, their placement, including mounting method can be very critical to tone quality, but when located in an optimal spot they can reproduce acoustic tone extremely well.
Both are very popular. Some people have and use both either simultaneously or at different times/situations.
It's another rabbit hole, but you should probably read up and decide which direction you want to go regarding piezo vs mic, and then start worrying about which one(s).
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I’m not a fan of the Realist, Lifeline or SoundClip (?) from David Gage.
A simple and easy to mount pickup is the Shadow SH-965NFX. It sounds a bit distant plucked but very nice with the bow. You only need to mount one foil under the E bridge foot and have one spare.
Bridge wing pickups need a low pressure on them and it might be tricky to get them installed. Otherwise they sound compressed and may get damaged. Not nice with the bow.
Pickups directly below the strings or clamped at the bridge crown often sound very direct and electric as you almost only get the sound from the string and nothing from the top.
A pickup in the bridge leg or adjuster often works well, but might have to be rotated to find the best sounding position.
Contact mics need time to find the right place to put on, so not for the beginner.
Similar with mics, but a bit easier, but if you want to feed the mic into your stage amp, you won’t get much out before feedback and may amplify the drummers cymbals as well.
If you only want to pluck, a bridge wing pickup installed by a good luthier would work.
If you have adjusters a Yamahiko (long lasting) or Full Circle (limited lifetime around 5 to 10 Years) is better.
If you might want to experiment with the bow amplified and have no adjusters, the Shadow SH-965NFX is a good solution.
For some pickups holes need to be drilled with a special reamer (bridge leg, under the strings). So if you don’t want that, choose a different one.
A simple and easy to mount pickup is the Shadow SH-965NFX. It sounds a bit distant plucked but very nice with the bow. You only need to mount one foil under the E bridge foot and have one spare.
Bridge wing pickups need a low pressure on them and it might be tricky to get them installed. Otherwise they sound compressed and may get damaged. Not nice with the bow.
Pickups directly below the strings or clamped at the bridge crown often sound very direct and electric as you almost only get the sound from the string and nothing from the top.
A pickup in the bridge leg or adjuster often works well, but might have to be rotated to find the best sounding position.
Contact mics need time to find the right place to put on, so not for the beginner.
Similar with mics, but a bit easier, but if you want to feed the mic into your stage amp, you won’t get much out before feedback and may amplify the drummers cymbals as well.
If you only want to pluck, a bridge wing pickup installed by a good luthier would work.
If you have adjusters a Yamahiko (long lasting) or Full Circle (limited lifetime around 5 to 10 Years) is better.
If you might want to experiment with the bow amplified and have no adjusters, the Shadow SH-965NFX is a good solution.
For some pickups holes need to be drilled with a special reamer (bridge leg, under the strings). So if you don’t want that, choose a different one.
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While there's certainly a sonic trade off with the Realist Life Line or Fishman Full Circle, they are both reliable pickups, last for quite a while, and reproduce the Double Bass well. I haven't played a Shadow SH 965NFX but I have listened to it through a main stage P.A. system and felt it had more warmth than the Fishman and Realist, with the immediacy of a transducer. I stopped using transducers that mount under the foot of the bridge, because it puts the pickup element directly in between the foot of the bridge and the table of the instrument, dampening the vibration of the bridge on to the table and through the bass bar. While that effect is subtile, it is there, and I remember distinctly when I took the Realist Copper off my bass for the last time and could hear the difference. Just my take of course.
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Start with a Vic's model B; $35 gets you in the game making sound. Then you can spend the next 10 years corksniffin' & investin' $35,000 just to realize that it is a whole lot more about the player than the pickup....
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I did recommend the SH-965NFX because of the ease of mounting without the need to adjust pressure or orientation and also because the impedance buffer is part of the pickup, so you need no extra one.
One drawback is that the output level is a bit lower than most other pickups, but still useable if you have a gain control at your amp. The other one that you always need a battery to use it (but this is also the case for most extra buffers/preamps).
So, if you look at the price, for a bridge wing pickup an impedance buffer/preamp is often helpful to get a better sound, so add that to the pickup price for comparison.
My recommendation of that Shadow pickup is for a beginner in amplification, not for an experienced user. The pickup/amp only is easier to handle than using an additional buffer/preamp.
Compared to the Realist, the SH-965NFX has (more) higher frequency content that can be amplified whereas the Realist has almost nothing there.
I had the Lifeline only heard at an earlier Frankfurter Musikmesse and it sounded almost as dark as the Realist. If that is a representative sound of the Lifeline it is not for me. I never had it myself or played a bass equipped with it.
I do use the Shadow if I need to change quickly between pizz and arco (Tango), but not for contemporary jazz because I have a different option for that, but for more classical jazz styles I would have been more happy with the NFX than with a bridge wing pickup that is mounted suboptimal and used without a buffer (as I had for years with an unpleasant compressed sound before I reduced the pressure by removing a very tiny amount of wood).
I wouldn’t recommend a magnetic pickup for DB as the only one, even though I have started that way. With suitable strings it is an option to get loud without feedback, but the sound is not very DB-like.
One drawback is that the output level is a bit lower than most other pickups, but still useable if you have a gain control at your amp. The other one that you always need a battery to use it (but this is also the case for most extra buffers/preamps).
So, if you look at the price, for a bridge wing pickup an impedance buffer/preamp is often helpful to get a better sound, so add that to the pickup price for comparison.
My recommendation of that Shadow pickup is for a beginner in amplification, not for an experienced user. The pickup/amp only is easier to handle than using an additional buffer/preamp.
Compared to the Realist, the SH-965NFX has (more) higher frequency content that can be amplified whereas the Realist has almost nothing there.
I had the Lifeline only heard at an earlier Frankfurter Musikmesse and it sounded almost as dark as the Realist. If that is a representative sound of the Lifeline it is not for me. I never had it myself or played a bass equipped with it.
I do use the Shadow if I need to change quickly between pizz and arco (Tango), but not for contemporary jazz because I have a different option for that, but for more classical jazz styles I would have been more happy with the NFX than with a bridge wing pickup that is mounted suboptimal and used without a buffer (as I had for years with an unpleasant compressed sound before I reduced the pressure by removing a very tiny amount of wood).
I wouldn’t recommend a magnetic pickup for DB as the only one, even though I have started that way. With suitable strings it is an option to get loud without feedback, but the sound is not very DB-like.
I got Kremona DB-1 and loved it. Inexpensive and very natural sounding piezo, eazy to mount. They have sales in USA, but I'm in Europe so I got it directly from their production in Bulgary, they were very kind and helping.
The Bassmax has a plastic shrink wrap around which dampens high frequencies. I would say it is the bridge wing equivalent of the Realist.
If you always turn down mids and highs and like a very dark sound it might work, but to have all options (you can always turn something down with EQ, but nothing up that is not there) I would take something else.
If you always turn down mids and highs and like a very dark sound it might work, but to have all options (you can always turn something down with EQ, but nothing up that is not there) I would take something else.
Most people tend to install the Bassmax in the bass side of the bridge; the sound gets a bit muddy. If you install it in the treble side wing, it is much more defined and balanced without the heavy low end. The Vic's is essentially the same thing for 1/4 the price.
I have six different pickups and everyone one of them does some things well and others mediocre.....
I have six different pickups and everyone one of them does some things well and others mediocre.....
Over many years, I have owned 1. The original Barcus Berry Silver Sliver, 2.the Polytone, 3. a Paul Tonnenges 4 element Magnetic, 5. the original Underwood, 6. a Fishman BP 100, 7. the Realist, and 8. Upton Revolution Solo, 9.the Planet Wing, 10. the KNB DB1
and the Ehrlund EAP. As James eloquently put it, they all sound different, I prefer the Ehrlund on my Mirecourt 5/8th DB with the Grace Designs Felix
and the Ehrlund EAP. As James eloquently put it, they all sound different, I prefer the Ehrlund on my Mirecourt 5/8th DB with the Grace Designs Felix
Is that your reccomendation to a beginner with a laminate student instrument "mostly playing folk/bluegrass"?
Another vote for the Vic’s. Inexpensive and they work. Great customer service.
