Pickups-How do you know...?

[vindibona1]

...when you should be thinking about "upgrading" pickups?

Sorry about the newbie question, but I am a relative bass newbie and a know almost nothing about bass gear.

I'm a part time bass player and have a Squier VM70's jazz bass. I've recently upgraded the bridge to a Gotoh 201B-4. The neck is slim and seems exceptionally easy to play with relatively low action. At this point I can't think of a reason to replace it though one day I want a 5 string.

Though not marked, I assume the bass has Duncan Designed pickups. What should I be listening for to determine if I should be thinking about new pickups? At what point will I outgrow the pickups, if not the bass entirely?

TIA

 

[Toptube]

...when you should be thinking about "upgrading" pickups?

Sorry about the newbie question, but I am a relative bass newbie and a know almost nothing about bass gear.

I'm a part time bass player and have a Squier VM70's jazz bass. I've recently upgraded the bridge to a Gotoh 201B-4. The neck is slim and seems exceptionally easy to play with relatively low action. At this point I can't think of a reason to replace it though one day I want a 5 string.

Though not marked, I assume the bass has Duncan Designed pickups. What should I be listening for to determine if I should be thinking about new pickups? At what point will I outgrow the pickups, if not the bass entirely?

TIA

If you have a good cab which you are happy with. Love your strings and setup. Have tweaked the pickup heights. and still find trouble with your sound, then you may need different pickups. But I would encourage you to try some other strings, first.

But it sounds like you are not yet to the point of even disliking your tone? No need to upgrade, for the sake of it. If your music is working, it doesn't matter what's in your bass.

 

[buldog5151bass]

I think there are too many people who think it's necessry to go modding a bass. If you are happy with the sound and playability, you don't have to mod. In over 35 years of playing, these are the only mods I have made to my basses:

- added detuners to the E strings in most of my basses;
- when I refinished my 70s Fender, I put a stock bridge back on to save some weight (Badass II bridge had been put on by the prior owner).

 

[SteveCS]

If, as you say, you are relatively new to bass, no amount of advice is going to help you as, with all due respect and no matter how proficient you might be with other instruments, you are not in a position to properly frame the question. Pickups are the link between you, your bass and your amplifier. They respond differently according to a player's touch, which it sounds like you are still developing. When the time comes for new pickups, you will know. You will also have a much better understanding of how you achieve the tones you do and therefore what pickup(s) might best fit you as a player.

Sorry for the rant, but there it is. All IMHO and YMMV, of course.

 

[jmattbassplaya]

Only when there is a specific tone you want that you know strings alone can't help you get.

 

[4StringTheorist]

I'd second what toptube and jmattbassplaya said and add two things:

1. Think in terms of the word modification not the word upgrade since the word upgrade carries some baggage with it that might have you forever chasing an ideal that isn't there.
   
   
2. If you're unhappy with the playability and feel of the instrument or its suitability to your musical needs (number of strings/frets meeting your goals, high fret access, weight, neck dive, etc.) then what you're looking for is another bass, not modifications to this bass. Obviously there's room for compromise in all things, I'm just saying that those other aspects deserve attention, and you ought to be solid on them before plowing $ into altering the bass rather than replacing it.
   
   Essentially, be happy enough with everything else before you bother modding the electronics.

 

[groove pump]

Liking the advice offered above - hard earned wisdom from the sounds of it.

Having done some modding and "upgrading" of the guts of one bass or another through my years, I'd say that there are really no guarantees when making a switch into different electronics that are considered to be "better". No need to apologize for your question - it's actually smart to gather some feedback from others who have been down this road.

Chasing some tone or another can become an endless quest. That can be some fun, but it can also be big-time frustrating. Expensive, too. Keep in mind that the sound you hear on a recording or even from a live show may be anything from rather raw to extremely processed. Plus, there's the issue of our hands - they're not the hands of the players we might want to emulate and a lot of anybody's sound comes from those. Yaddah-yaddah...

The one BIG tipoff that maybe your sound isn't as useful as it could be is when your bandmates routinely have trouble hearing you. If your amp/cab layout is halfway decent, but your tone is often not so audible, that's a problem. I've had more than one bass through my years that just didn't produce a strong sound that could cut through the ol' mix.

One example was a Korean neck-thru Spector with passive EMG Hz pickups and a treble/bass preamp. I wanted more sound from this cozy player, so I swapped in a set of active EMG's and 3 band eq. The sound didn't get bigger and/or better and I eventually moved on.

Another case was a nice German Warwick Corvette with passive pickups. I had a good set of Bartolini Jazz pickups and two band eq handy, so I dropped those in there to hopefully encourage the sound of that bass to cut through a little more. While this new setup gave me a warm and ultra-buttery smooth sound at home, my bandmates and I agreed that it was almost impossible to hear it at our shows. That one has found a new home, too.

A bass that sounds a little obnoxious on its own might actually be the one that sounds fantastic in a mix. This has been the tricky thing for me to come to terms with, just because my favorite keeper is a passive Jazz bass made of different pieces-parts and its sound is a little lacking in the mids. When I want to be heard in a mix, the no-brainer is my P/J bass with active EMG's. How obnoxious? The guitar player in my last band actually asked me to turn it down... cha-ching!! When I dial back the obnoxious a little, I routinely catch compliments on my sound with that bass.

Just my story. Trust your own ears, but also pay attention to what others hear when you play with a group. It's nearly impossible to predict what you'll get with a pickup swap, but sometimes it's just fun to scratch that itch when the curiosity bug shows up. If you try it at some point, keep your expectations under control.

 

[lz4005]

What should I be listening for to determine if I should be thinking about new pickups?

A lot of good advice in this thread so far.

Don't change anything until you can articulate a specific reason for it.
Specific as in: more output to drive my amp harder... more mids around 400hz so I can hear myself better... less in the 800-1200hz range because it sounds too harsh... a stacked humbucker because I'm getting too much 60cycle hum from the lights in the practice room... things like that.

 

[Batmensch]

...when you should be thinking about "upgrading" pickups?

Sorry about the newbie question, but I am a relative bass newbie and a know almost nothing about bass gear.

I'm a part time bass player and have a Squier VM70's jazz bass. I've recently upgraded the bridge to a Gotoh 201B-4. The neck is slim and seems exceptionally easy to play with relatively low action. At this point I can't think of a reason to replace it though one day I want a 5 string.

Though not marked, I assume the bass has Duncan Designed pickups. What should I be listening for to determine if I should be thinking about new pickups? At what point will I outgrow the pickups, if not the bass entirely?

TIA

If the pickups are not marked, then they're not Duncan Designed. If you bought it new, and the bass also has a glossy fretboard, then it's a newer model of te VM 70's Jazz, and the pickups are Fender.

 

[Growlmonkee]

I agree with everything above, as far as outgrowing the bass, you would have to first determine just what it is you no longer like about it, and look for something from that view. As far as pickups go, more $, or a respected name brand does not always make your sound better, and as stated above, what sounds good in your living room alone, sometimes doesn't work in a band setting (often). So..as far as what to listen for, ..for me...I need a sound that works well live, on a stage with my amp, and my band, something that sounds great, and doesn't leave me buried in the mix. I do have one bass that I really like the sound of, when playing at home, and I'm not gonna change it, but, on a stage it leaves me with a muddy, muffled, and undefined tone, (you can't hear my notes well), that bass has a popular set of "upgraded" pickups in it, it worked live before I changed them, still, it sounds great at home, and I don't need it for gigs.

 

[ofajen]

Great advice so far. Be glad your instrument works well for you and make some music!

I'll just add that in over 30 years of playing bass, electric guitar and other instruments, I've only replaced one pickup. That wasn't an "upgrade", because music creation is not a consumer contest. I replaced the pickup in my avatar Wishbass, because I had too much hum from just one single-coil J. I swapped in a stacked humbucker J, just to address the noise issue, and it works like a charm. I've also had one pickup in my Ripper bass rewound, as one coil went dead.

Otto

 

[vindibona1]

The one BIG tipoff that maybe your sound isn't as useful as it could be is when your bandmates routinely have trouble hearing you. If your amp/cab layout is halfway decent, but your tone is often not so audible, that's a problem. I've had more than one bass through my years that just didn't produce a strong sound that could cut through the ol' mix.

Don't change anything until you can articulate a specific reason for it.

I hear you guys! Thanks. Bass is SO much different than regular electric... by a mile. I've been playing bass in an acoustic group where the leader would usually play bass, but he took off for the summer and I was the only one who knew how to play the thing, so I became the designated bassist. I would get simulataneously plugged into the house bass amp AND the house system and don't yet actually own a bass amp of my own. I actually like it a lot. It gave me a lot more artistic freedom, often letting me dictate the style (while often chasing singers who don't know how to follow or keep tempo). But I think you're right... I don't play well enough or under enough circumstances to even know what I truly like or want (although initially I had to play the house 5 string (Dean Zelinsky Mule) which drove me crazy both times.

Today I got to play some Fender 4 string jazz basses (unplugged) and confirmed what y'all are saying (politely). I'm not in a position to judge anything yet. My SVM70's jazz is easy enough to play and sounds decent enough in the playing environment I'm in right now. I'm just learning more advanced techniques but would probably rank myself as a player on the lower end of intermediate. Lots more to learn, I guess.

Thanks again everyone!