poor string alignment on this cheap bass: fix or nah?

[Old Garage-Bander]

just received a mid-'90s Foundation with ghastly string alignment. the E string is almost off the neck at the 21st fret (about 3/32" from the edge), while the G string is 13/32". the neck pocket is tight and i don't think yanking the neck over will do anything to address the issue. the bridge saddles are already scooted over as far as they'll go, so no room for adjustment there either.

so: should i attempt to fix it? the pickups are soapbars, so there shouldn't be any issue with the strings getting picked up. the only issue i can foresee is it might be a problem if a future owner tried to play way up high on the E string.

and if it's worth fixing, i assume moving the bridge is the only remedy, yes?

thanks all!

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When you say received... does that mean you bought it from someone on line and it arrived?

Anyway, is it the original (proper) neck for that bass?

 

[96tbird]

I am not the one asking for advice here, so urging OP to take my advice, just because you apparently feel triggered by me disagreeing with you, seems a bit out of place, when you are clearly of the conviction that it's a bad advice.

I am just saying what I see on the pictures OP provided.

Triggered. Lol.

Lets take another look at the bridge shall we? When he moves the neck, the saddles are not anchored to the plate by any slots etc. They will adjust sideways naturally to the minuscule sudeways movement of new string position by virtue of string tension. Almost All of the swing is at the nut when you shift a neck. The bridge doesnt see much change because its not moving inly the strings and nut are.

Even if the saddles were anchored, they simply become the point where the string angle changes, instead of the tail block.

Absolutley zero reason to start messing with the bridge.

 

[Bruce Johnson]

Absolutley zero reason to start messing with the bridge.

I normally would agree with you, but in this case it does look like the bridge is about 1/8" off center to the left, in relation to the pickups. Something's not right. It would be interesting to unscrew the bridge and see if there's a second set of screw holes underneath.

In most cases, this condition means that the neck needs to be aligned in relation to the body. But here, he says that the neck pocket is tight, and it sure does look like the bridge is mounted out of position. Whether it's bad factory work or a clumsy repair. The best fix may be to move the bridge over and leave the neck alone.

 

[96tbird]

I'll separate this post to point something out about TB HS&R

This is a democracy. There are a few types of advice. Good, last resort, and bad. Advice to move the bridge is last resort

So by democratic process, and freedom to post, advice is given in a thread. You can note that the guys here that do this stuff for MONEY and have proven legacies of sound advice here all advise aligning the neck. They being Turnaround, JLS, 202dy, Zooberworx. I have added ny vote to their consensus because i know it to be real and true and that the OP would take the sage advice they give, not jump right to the last resort option.

 

[bobdabilder]

Loosen the strings and neck bolts, lay the bass down flat on its back and tell us how far the headstock will move toward the g string. Physically measure it.

 

[96tbird]

I normally would agree with you, but in this case it does look like the bridge is about 1/8" off center to the left, in relation to the pickups. Something's not right. It would be interesting to unscrew the bridge and see if there's a second set of screw holes underneath.

In most cases, this condition means that the neck needs to be aligned in relation to the body. But here, he says that the neck pocket is tight, and it sure does look like the bridge is mounted out of position. Whether it's bad factory work or a clumsy repair. The best fix may be to move the bridge over and leave the neck alone.

Yes thats what I looked at too, relative to the pickups. Acbit off but the saddles wil pivot sideways a bit on the intonation screws baxk at the tail so It isn't a huge issue.

 

[AdamR]

It looks like a lost cause. Even if the neck pocket wasn't tight you would never move it enough to fix that issue. You could move the bridge but it looks like it would need to go over a lot.

 

[screefer]

Remove bridge...fill holes with toothpick and JB weld.... Align new position with string/dental floss....mark centers on all five holes with sharp awl...run a 1/8" drill bit BACKWARDS to create a dimple (this prevents bit from wandering) ...drill holes normally and screw that sumbitch down. The neck is happy...the strings are aligned....all good.

 

[vindibona1]

You need to align the neck - the bridge isn't the problem.

Please explain your reasoning for your solution. You seem to have more experience than I have but to me it appears that remounting the bridge is required for this much difference.

So assuming you are correct, if the neck pocket is tight how to you go about aligning the neck enough to make it good? Can an average Joe do this or will it require special knowledge or equipment?

 

[Usidore T Blue]

I would be concerned with using the pickup placement to "measure" the bridge placement, even if I thought it was the bridge.

 

[McBubbler]

You need to align the neck - the bridge isn't the problem.

The quoted response is from a commercial user of this site, and he's also an instrument tech. Why would his answer be subject to so much debate? I'm not an expert, but if it were my bass and my choices were to loosen a couple screws to attempt an adjustment on the neck, or drill a bunch of holes in the bass, I'm going with the loosen the screws suggestion.

 

[Pilgrim]

My suggestion is to take the least invasive, most reversible action possible to start with, and work up from there.

In this case, looks to me like the least invasive way is to first simply try shifting the neck.

After that, if the existing neck pocket is too tight to allow sufficient tilt, the next least invasive option would be to either sand the side of the neck or widen the neck pocket slightly to allow more tilt to the neck. (I'd do the neck pocket, since a neck pocket that's a few 64ths wider than the neck doesn't matter a bit to me, and IMO doesn't matter to the sound - what matters is the connection of neck to body.)

To me, the absolute last resort would be messing with the bridge. If you move it, chances are 90% that there will be a footprint on the body finish that will be revealed by moving the bridge from its original position. You can sure do it, but you would need to remove the bridge, plug the existing bridge holes (although Bruce Johnson's post wondering if there are already two sets of holes is intriguing) and re-drill. Maybe you'd get lucky and there would be no footprint in the finish, but to me this is the LAST option to pursue.

 

[Bruce Johnson]

Lost cause???? Come on, guys, this isn't rocket science. If it were here on my bench, I could have it all straightened out in a half hour. From what I can tell in the pictures, the bridge is mounted poorly on the body. It needs to be moved over to the right a little bit to correctly align it with the pickups. That will solve most of the string alignment problem. It may also need some neck alignment in the pocket to get everything right. If it does, that's done with a bit of filing on the side walls of the neck pocket.

What's the argument? It just needs to be fixed. Not a big deal.

 

[Meyatch]

... If the problem were the angle of the neck, things should pretty close to right where the neck meets the body, but should get further and further out of whack as you get closer to the headstock...

How would this work? The strings are attached to the tuners, and held in place by the nut. They (almost) can't be wrong at the headstock end.

Yank that neck over. Even if the neck pocked is "tight" (which you can't possibly tell while its screwed in place, and tuned to pitch) there is almost nothing to prevent it from moving further to the G string side, because there is less pocket on that side.

 

[GBBSbassist]

I'm no luthier, but on all of my instruments, the bridge looks dead nuts on center. Is that not correct? This one is noticeably not even close to being centered.

Just asking since people are saying the bridge isn't the issue.

 

[Joshua]

They being Turnaround, JLS, 202dy, Zooberworx.

An excellent list, however not including @Bruce Johnson is an egregious omission.

 

[maturanesa]

If the neck fits right in the neck pocket in the upper part of it, its not the neck.
And it seems the misaligment is even across the neck, so the neck is bolted ok.

 

[RSBBass]

It should be pretty easy to determine if it is the neck or the bridge. Find the center line of the body. The neck should be parallel to it. The bridge should be perpendicular and cross the line at the middle of the bridge. This is hard to do from photos but pretty simple with the bass in hand. The problem could be either or it could be both.

 

[JKos]

What's the argument? It just needs to be fixed. Not a big deal.

Exactly. It can be fixed. Getter' done!

Remove the neck for two reasons. Maybe it is stuck as in the finish on the neck and body are stuck together. Maybe the screw holes are really tight trough the body (mentioned above). It will move. If necessary, it would take very little material removal to move it enough.

But it also seems the bridge is off, as others have said.

- John

 

[sissy kathy]

I claim no technical expertise here, but just using my eyes and some very elementary geometry suggests to me that it's the bridge that needs to be moved. If the problem were the angle of the neck, things should pretty close to right where the neck meets the body, but should get further and further out of whack as you get closer to the headstock. It seems clear to me from the pictures -- especially the third one, looking down the neck from the headstock toward the bridge -- that if anything, the opposite is true: The G string is practically off the fretboard near the body, and if anything gets farther from the edge of the fretboard near the headstock. Looking at that third picture, it's hard for me to imagine how changing the neck angle would fix the problem. On the other hand, it sure looks like moving the bridge a little to the left (in the picture) would do the trick. Am I missing something?

No, they will be closest to 'right' at the bridge and the nut. the neck joint will actually have the worst alignment. You are dealing with a triangle, but should be dealing with two straight lines over top of each other.

At any rate it's been three weeks since this thread was opened. So, OP surely you've done something by now, what was done to cure the problem?