Power amp question

[G43]

I´ve read lots of post here and seen that lots of player here use a power amp + preamp instead of a bass amp head, seems to be a powerful and cheap solution to expensive bass head amps, but, does a, for example QSC PLX power amp with preamp (sansamp for ex.) sound as good as e GK, Ashdown, or SWR head? or they will give you just power with no sound quality?
Here where I live I dont have the chance to hear it, and I will probably be the first one to try that. I have a nice warwick pro line bass, and I expect to use Hartke cabs, wih aluminium speakers, wich seem to be a good match for a bass slaper like me.
Thanks in advance

 

[bebass]

A power amp with separate pre can sound BETTER than the dedicated heads. But you must get a quality power amp. Then you can find the ideal pre for YOUR sound. For me, the sansamp RBI is the ticket but I have played through several pre's that I liked.
If you go this route, I suggest you don't get the cheap & heavy amps but one of the modern lighter-weight amps. And get more power than you think you want, then you will never have to upgrade to get more power (I have a 1200 watt/channel amp).
But be sure you don't want to go the minimalist route. A combo or dedicated head has the plug & go capability.
In fact, I am getting a 30 something lb setup (cab & head) for ease of use even though I have the 1200 watt power amp. I had decided to sell the power amp but I do not care if it sells or not - never know when I want to go back to the BIG KILLER rig.

 

[Metallkasten]

+1!

It can sound as good (or abd) as you want it to, with tons of flexability.

Granted, it's usually at the price of your back

 

[G43]

Thanks for the info, I needde some light on my way to my future rig, as I play in a metal band I need lots of power, the drummer plays really loud his massive setup and the guitar player uses two 4x12" marchall cabs at very hight volume so even my 750watt laney amp isnt enought, regardless of its lack of tone quality. So im changing this in the near future to get a better sound. This is my plan, hope you guys can help me to do it tight:
QSC PLX power amp with my sansamp PSA1.1 preamp running in to two 4x10" hartke cabs (400W80hm each). Ithough the PLX 1602 wich delivers 300watts per channel at 8 ohms will be the best option, am I wrong? are the QSC PLX series a good quality power amp for a bass rig?
thanks again

 

[bebass]

Thanks for the info, I needde some light on my way to my future rig, as I play in a metal band I need lots of power, the drummer plays really loud his massive setup and the guitar player uses two 4x12" marchall cabs at very hight volume so even my 750watt laney amp isnt enought, regardless of its lack of tone quality. So im changing this in the near future to get a better sound. This is my plan, hope you guys can help me to do it tight:
QSC PLX power amp with my sansamp PSA1.1 preamp running in to two 4x10" hartke cabs (400W80hm each). Ithough the PLX 1602 wich delivers 300watts per channel at 8 ohms will be the best option, am I wrong? are the QSC PLX series a good quality power amp for a bass rig?
thanks again

With what you are saying you have to compete with and 800 watts of speaker handling, I would say go for the PLX3402. You could of course bridge the 1602 into the 2 cabs but I must say I do not like bridging into 4 ohms. Others will tell you this is fine but my advice is to spend more money. I have owned the PLX3402 and it is a nice amp. I have a yorkville A4.4 which is very similar to the 3402 (1200 watts/channel into 4 ohms). I never felt like I was overpowering - just good clean headrooom.

 

[G43]

Hi again, and thanks for the advice, im learning a lot
I still have a question, if the cabs are 400watt at 8 ohm, should I put more power than 400 watts in to them? some people tell me to do so, others tell me not to overpower the cabs cuz Ill probably blew them up, so this is quite confussing to me, I dont know how to match amps with cabs powerwise

 

[Gearhead17]

Pre-amp and power amp rigs are generally really clean sounding. Some pre-amps can get tube growl to them, but none of them will get power tube growl. Not sure if you are really interested in that Tube Growl, but NO pre-amp and MOSFET power amp will ever match power tube growl.

The PSA-1.1 is a nice pre-amp when used alone with a poweramp. The capability for Distortion on that unit should help you cut through your loud bandmates.

As for the speaker power question. Overpowering the cabs will NOT HURT THE CAB, unless you are reckless. Putting a 2000watt amp into a 1000watt cab, does not mean the cab will receive all 2000 watts at once. The amount of volume you demand from the pre-amp, the way the tone controls are set on your bass and amp, will all determine how much wattage you will send to the cab. All you have to do is listen to the cab and if it is making farting sounds or sounds like it is about to explode, then turn the bass knobs down and/or turn the Master Volume down. By having the extra power in your amp, you can push the amp way hard and the amp will never distort/clip your sound. The only thing bad that can happen with overpowering is you destroying the cab. Don't crank the bass knobs to "11" or max the volume on your pre-amp and your poweramp!

As for underpowering, it is safe to do this. By putting 300watts into a 2000 watt cab, the worst that can happen is that you use up all the power in the amp and the amp distorts/clips your tone. When you push the amp to put out every watt it can and you crank it even more, the amp can't keep up and ends up distorting your tone - otherwise known as clipping. Clipping can hurt your speaker cab; let's not go into why, but keep your ears open for strange distorted sounds coming through your speaker. If that happens, turn the bass and Master Volume down on the amp and your bass.

Overpower the cabs, you can get the sound you want at the highest volumes possible with the speakers you have.

Let me warn you on one thing, don't bother with Hartke. You may like the sound, but you will be nothing more than rumble in the background. The Hartke 410XL (alum cones) does not go above 99db in any frequency. Your guitar player is pumping out around 110db-120db in the 100hz-6khz range. In a nut shell, the guitarist will drown you out in seconds, no matter what tone or how much power you use. I know this because I experienced this first hand when I had my 410XL. I had this damn Crate 212 120 watt combo kill me in volume the entire practice. At one point I had my tone as all mids and the lows completely removed. All I heard was clanking and nasally mids - the guitarist was still louder than me.

You might want to tell your guitar dude to only use one 412. If he says the head can't handle it, there are several switches on the back of the head that allow an 4,8, and 16ohm cab to be used. Two 412's is rediculous, especially in practice. One 412 will be plenty loud with a 100 watt tube head (assuming he has one).

 

[G43]

Hi again, and thanks for being so helpful
my guitar player will never go down to 4x12" as the drummer will kill all of us with his volume. Actually we are playing quite LOUD, I use a 750 Laney combo, but altought its very powerful it sucks big time, the quality of the sound, tonewise is quite poor, even using a sansamp and a warwick proline bass...
Thanks for the hartke advice, I need some power and hartke seems not be my solution, Ill probably go to GenzBenz or MarkBass cabs (something like that), and for sure, now that I know that its better to overpower I will also go for the big QSC.
Thanks agains