Propane Conversion for Cars

[iamlowsound]

...Kay...Well you seem to have your heart set on it so go for it.

Myself and Mike N have extensive mechanical backrounds and we're advising you to not do it. My 1976's fuel system burns so clean that my oil still looks new after 4,000 miles and I use cheap oil as well.

lol Plus you just admitted you drive cars into the ground...Soooooo....What's the point of getting this conversion kit? Just get a Jetta TDI or some car that gets good gas mileage and take care of it..... End of story.

Oh and one more thing, if you drive a car into the ground - what makes you think the propane kit is going to be okay to use again? You think it's just exempt from abuse because it "burns cleaner"? Uh, no.

Whatever I'm done here. :scowl:

I didn't mean drive it into the ground as in not take care of it, I mean I drive it and fix it until it can't be fixed anymore. I don't abuse my car at all. Right now I get 40mpg in my car, a TDI would get me ~60mpg, which is a cost reduction of 33%. The propane conversion would give me a cost reduction of 50-55%. Plus it is cheaper to do the conversion than to buy a TDI.

lowsound

 

[Mike N]

I didn't mean drive it into the ground as in not take care of it, I mean I drive it and fix it until it can't be fixed anymore. I don't abuse my car at all. Right now I get 40mpg in my car, a TDI would get me ~60mpg, which is a cost reduction of 33%. The propane conversion would give me a cost reduction of 50-55%. Plus it is cheaper to do the conversion than to buy a TDI.

lowsound

You're also assuming propane prices are going to remain stable. The more people that jump in the conversion bandwagon may drive the price up, law of supply and demand. I've typically seen propane prices rise in the winter because of home heating. Yeah, I know that gas prices fluctuate too and they're not likely to drop any time soon.

It's not that I'm advising you not to do it, just make sure it's going to be cost effective. There's also going to be a learning curve to get the tune up right with that stuff, and if you're off you could do some costly engine damage. Propane pressure in a bottle (much like nitrous oxide) is directly affected by ambient temperature. If you live in an area with wildly fluctuating temperatures, bottle pressure will rise & fall with them.

I don't know how many miles your current car has, condition, etc...... but if it something that you're going to convert and then wind up getting rid of in a year's time then it might be more cost effective to get a TDI now.

 

[SJLee]

Think of how much fuel you could buy for $2000, figure your MPG and how long it would take before the conversion paid off. Is it really worth it??

If it costs you $40 to fill your tank, it could be paid off in a year.

 

[iamlowsound]

You're also assuming propane prices are going to remain stable. The more people that jump in the conversion bandwagon may drive the price up, law of supply and demand. I've typically seen propane prices rise in the winter because of home heating. Yeah, I know that gas prices fluctuate too and they're not likely to drop any time soon.

It's not that I'm advising you not to do it, just make sure it's going to be cost effective. There's also going to be a learning curve to get the tune up right with that stuff, and if you're off you could do some costly engine damage. Propane pressure in a bottle (much like nitrous oxide) is directly affected by ambient temperature. If you live in an area with wildly fluctuating temperatures, bottle pressure will rise & fall with them.

I don't know how many miles your current car has, condition, etc...... but if it something that you're going to convert and then wind up getting rid of in a year's time then it might be more cost effective to get a TDI now.

~170k miles (232,000 km), 2002 Mazda Protege, no rust, perfect condition, all maintenance done at the recommend intervals ect. I should have another 3-4 years and 100,000km easy on the car, but I would have my mechanic give it a real good once over to make sure he thinks it will last long enough to make it worth while. I live in Ontario, so we have widely fluctuating temperatures, but it should be fine, just have to take that into consideration.

I know that I am assuming that prices will remain stable, but I see no problem with rising cost, the price would have to double before the savings are erased and I doubt that will happen, as historically propane has been a very stable price.

Sneha:
It costs me about $53 to fill the tank and I do that 4-5 times a month. Should be paid for in 10-13 months.

lowsound

 

[bmc]

Conversions to LPG in the UK have been going on for a decade. The UK has the highest pump prices for gas and LPG is significantly cheaper. At one time, the UK offered incentives to cover the cost. It may still be in place. Furthermore, LPG is readily available all over the UK.

What became attractive cars for conversion were big German sedans. Seven series BMW's, A8's, big gas guzzling Mercs. They could be bought for cheap prices. Putting the tank in the trunk left loads of room for luggage. Furthermore, the mods allow for the use of either petrol or LPG.

I wish I could find the story but I read a while back that the Land Rover Discovery, when converted to LPG, produced more power. That's all I can remember of the story. It was possibly in Top Gear Magazine or one of the Engish car magazines.

 

[DUC1098]

Make sure to do all your homework before you decide to switch. It is my understanding that propane is less "efficient" (produces less heat) than gasoline, so you will end up getting lower mileage. If you pay 30% less "per gallon" (I think propane is sold by weight, but not sure) but get 50% less mileage, you would end up paying more to drive the same distance. Fleet vehicles, at least in the US, normally get subsidies to run a "cleaner fleet" that offsets the decrease in mileage.

This is the same issue with ethanol conversions, lower mileage. I think the only conversion that maintains an equivalent, or maybe even slightly better, mileage is to convert a car over to burn hydrogen. But the availability of hydrogen makes it less attractive, except for those few countries that are testing it's practicality.

Biodiesel is definitely the way to go. No conversion necessary and if you can't find biodiesel, just fill it with diesel.

 

[Valiant Bandit]

I didn't mean drive it into the ground as in not take care of it, I mean I drive it and fix it until it can't be fixed anymore. I don't abuse my car at all. Right now I get 40mpg in my car, a TDI would get me ~60mpg, which is a cost reduction of 33%. The propane conversion would give me a cost reduction of 50-55%. Plus it is cheaper to do the conversion than to buy a TDI.

lowsound

Right now for the short term it's cheaper to do the conversion.

Look at it this way man :
A TDI 2001 Jetta that's been well maintained is what, 5K to buy used? You could save up, buy that and with all the money you're saving on gas, you can eventually convert it to run on bio-diesel.

Yep, straight 6.

I paid $200 for this Jeep two years ago. Just had the valve cover off yesterday to change the leaky gasket and couldn't believe how clean the engine was inside. Hoping to get another 200,000 out of it, if the body doesn't rot away first.

See those Jeeps are hit or miss. I've noticed that unless you're really good with cars like us, they're a mechanic's best friend lol. But yes if those Jeeps are taken care of, they'll run FOREVER. Leaky valve covers are common for those Mopars, just like it is for my Slant 6. Do you have rot on the frame? If not, I'm pretty good with bondo work and it's ridiculously easy to do if you're daring enough to do it. Worst case scenario is if you do, you can just pull the motor and put it in another Jeep that's got a blown engine.

Biodiesel is definitely the way to go. No conversion necessary and if you can't find biodiesel, just fill it with diesel.

+1. Plus natural gas is still a non-renewable energy source.

I did a bio-diesel conversion on an old Volvo 240 with that renault diesel engine. Dirty as hell but man I'd only have to fill that car up 4 times driving from Las Vegas to Rhode Island.

 

[Mike N]

The UK has the highest pump prices for gas..........

Which is why we told the Queen Mum to cram it up her knickers 235 years ago.

What is the tax on tea up to these days??

 

[Mike N]

See those Jeeps are hit or miss. I've noticed that unless you're really good with cars like us, they're a mechanic's best friend lol. But yes if those Jeeps are taken care of, they'll run FOREVER. Leaky valve covers are common for those Mopars, just like it is for my Slant 6. Do you have rot on the frame? If not, I'm pretty good with bondo work and it's ridiculously easy to do if you're daring enough to do it. Worst case scenario is if you do, you can just pull the motor and put it in another Jeep that's got a blown engine.

The underside is relatively solid, because it leaked oil for so long. The rockers are rusty, the tailgate is rusty and the paint is peeling off in sheets. This is a Grand Cherokee Laredo I'm dealing with. Between brake lines, brakes (thank God it has rear drums), radiator, tires and various little things I don't know how much more I'm going to put in to this thing. Runs great, A/C blows cold, functional 4x4 etc...... it's just to the point of being cosmetically challenged.

I did a bio-diesel conversion on an old Volvo 240 with that renault diesel engine. Dirty as hell but man I'd only have to fill that car up 4 times driving from Las Vegas to Rhode Island.

Economy be damned I'd have rammed a 350 under the hood of that puppy. The ultimate sleeper. One of the things on my bucket list is a SBC swap into an older 240 DL wagon.

Naturally, my Wife thinks I'm nuts.