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Double Bass Purely Arco Strings

#21
I have used Heliocore Orchestras Mediums, Flexicore 92s Mediums with a Stark (heavy) E, and Evah Pirazzis (regular) for my community orchestra.

The Evahs are my favorites so far overall. Though the Flexicores had a smoother, more mellow sound, the Evahs are darker and fuller sounding.

They seem to have a more complex tone quality than any other string I have tried, more overtones. It's a richer sound, though also a rougher (more growly) sound.

With the right amount of rosin, you can get a good orchestra section sound, strong bite, deep rumbly kind of sound. I am doing Beethoven's 6th now, and it occurs to me that the sound and attack I am getting is very appropriate for Beethoven.

When I say rough sound, think of the bass section sound you hear on some of the original instrument Baroque music. The difference is the Evahs sound a bit darker and stronger. I hope some of this makes sense to you.

They are easy to bow well, though perhaps not the easiest - except for the "stark" E on my medium Flexicore set-up, I think the Flexicores might have been easier (I haven't tried the Belcantos yet). The Evah E does not roll though and starts reasonably easily.

The fundamental especially on the E is a bit harder to hear clearly. My section members find it hard to tune to.

The did break in quickly, and I had my first set for about a year and a half. I am on my second now.
 
#22
Thank you Hector. that is exactly what I wanted to know.
I've been using the EPs on one of my basses for the community orchestra stuff, and spiros on my smaller jazz bass. I like my 7/8's bass and I like bringing that on jazz gigs as well, but I am not crazy about the EP's for Jazz (pizz only). I actually like the Obligatos on that bass and I don't mind the rolling at all. But the lower strings respond a bit slower than I like under the bow. So I've been wondering if it was worth the compromise, if any, or if I should just try the Belcantos and not bother about playing any jazz with that bass.
I guess now I should just try and figure out if the Belcantos would be a definite step up from the EP's or if changing strings would not be worth the trouble...
Thanks for your post.
 
#23
I have used Helicores, Flexicore 92s and Evahs (the regulars) in my orchestra. I play a SB180 Hybrid that's about five years old, with a decent quality pernambuco octagonal bow made in Germany by W. Seifert.

I really like them for orchestra, this is my second set. The first lasted a year and a half. The have a good sound right from the start, but do a lot of stretching in the beginning.

They have a dark, rich or complex sound (with lots of overtones). Loud and full. They are powerful strings but they don't have the smooth, mellow sound of the Flexicores (or from what I hear the Belcantos). They have a rougher more aggressive sound.

I am doing Beethoven's 6th now and the sound to me is very appropriate for Beethoven, especially properly rosined up and played with energy. I get a good biting attack, and a deep rumbly sound.

These are strings that you have to hear from out front (have someone else play your bass or record yourself) to really appreciate.

I like the thicker feel, and unlike many here, I have never felt them to be high tension at all, to me they are softer than the Flexicores.

To me the E string is fine, no rolling. As a whole they are also easy to bow well, though as is often the case, getting the E started quickly and cleanly with the tip of the bow, takes good technique.

I hope all this makes sense to you.
 
#24
Bijoux said:
...So I've been wondering if it was worth the compromise, if any, or if I should just try the Belcantos and not bother about playing any jazz with that bass.
I guess now I should just try and figure out if the Belcantos would be a definite step up from the EP's or if changing strings would not be worth the trouble...
Thanks for your post.
Click to expand...

Sorry for the double post - I am having trouble with my browser and connection - I got disconnected and thought my post had not published.

I thought you were asking about a string strictly for orchestra - no compromises. There are no compromises with the Evahs. It is, I think a matter of what kind of sound are you looking for. As I hear it the Evahs are not as easy to bow as Belcantos, but they have a more complex sound, and more power. The Belcantos (as I understand it) have more fundamental and less overtones, and are smoother and "sweeter" - two things that I wouldn't say about the Evahs. But I would be hard pressed to say that one was a step up from the other.

I will probably try them next time out. At that point I'll decide for myself which is more to my tast, overall.

There are huge mega threads about both the Evahs and the Belcantos. But as long as you are talking dedicated orchestra intrument (which I thought you were) there are no compromises.
 
#26
regarding your q's on gutty strings, check out 'string matrix' thread, pruney
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also, if you can more precisely specify your goals in sound and playing, you'll get more accurate advice. but you'll still have to try some strings out.
evahs are more difficult up high than most arco strings. If were working on solos and virtuosic repertoire, I would recommend thinner strings. I don't like the Weich Evahs for orchestra or chamber music. They don't produce enough sound on my bass- I really have to beat the strings, and that gets tiresome.
 
#27
Ok, so I've been playing with the EP's regular gage as an arco only string. I love how they sound right now, and the lower strings respond real fast compare to any of set of hybrids I have used in the past.
with that in mind though... I am wondering if the Belcantos are worth a try...
anyone has a preference, one way or the other?
thank you.
 
#29
It's a tough call. I've been playing Belcantos for about three years now, I"m coming to the end of my second set. They bow very well, with a nice, relatively dark sound that can work just about anwyhere. I would play them any day of the week and would say that if you got them that you would not be unhappy. The top strings are smooth and sing but not in that agressive bright way that spiro's do. As others have said, they bow easy and don't require a ton of touch to make them sound good.
The E string is pretty quick and articulate. If you've ever played spiro E's, which one of my teachers (William Schrickle MnOrch) does, they are ultra fast and articulate but have that spiro sound. I find that the Belcanto E isn't as fast but is fast enough to deal with and has a quality of sound that makes you want to play it all the time. The set as a whole is very well blended and fast and will blend with other strings with relative ease.
The pizz sound is good...but as I play more jazz I am looking for something different. I'm having a hard time right now getting to "My Sound" but I'm thinking it has more to do with my crap amp/pickup than my strings.
I've played flexo originals and 92's, though not as long. The originals have a wonderfully dark sound and will help you blend your bass in with any section. The "mellow" sound is something that I love and keep thinking about going back to. The 92's are similar though aren't qutie as dark. I found that both flexo sets were not very ballanced across the set on my bass and that the low strings on the originals were harder to bow fast and articulately, though they had an amazing sound, huge and dark like and organ pedal. The middle strings were harder to bow but not impossible by any means, just a different style of bowing than the belcantos, though I will say that I could push them further without overplaying them and standing out too much in the section. Both are good strings with many great orchestral players supporting each. I'm intending on trying the evah's soon :help:
 
#31
Since my juzek is in an out of commission for couple of months I've been using my Kay in community orchestra and classical/pops concerts. My section mate has a Romanian fully carved with Helicore Orchestras on it. I like his sound which is more complex and cello-like but in the section my Kay with Spiro E, Anima AD and Oliv G is louder and more powerful and the conductor is happy with the sound in works like 1812 Ovt. Beethoven 5 etc. For solo sections I don't think this set up would work very well. On the Kay it gives it a sort or Early Music sound which I like.
When my bass gets back, (Spiro E, flexoore ADG or Jargar ADG) is what I'll have on it because it seems to blend in better with the other string players. But after reading this thread I'm now very curious about the Belcantos.
 
#32
well... I tried the Belcantos for about a week now, and I think I am going back to the EP's regulars.
I tried them on my 7/8 Romanian flatback, and in comparison the Belcantos were very sweet sounding but they were a bit bright compared to the EP's. I thought the Belcantos responded a bit faster on the two lower strings than EP's. The Ep's do sound warm and darker on my bass.
I think I'll finish the season with the EP's on the bass and then I'll the Belcantos back for the summer so hopefully by next season they will be more settled in and maybe they might loose the edge.
 

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