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Qualities of a Good Drummer?

#21
Wow, definitely many more replies than I expected, thanks everyone for your input so far! :)

I do try to be a musician first and foremost. I'm still in the learning stages of guitar and bass, but I'm always trying to pick up new things when I'm working with other groups. I still have a long way to go, though; there are times when I feel like I'm just a drummer, and nothing more; I feel timid to the music, unsure of what to comment on, and confused on what to add.

I also feel absurdly intimidated by jazz. I don't even think about going to a jazz open mic, just because I don't know how the system works and what's required. I feel like a newbie in a room of critical experts.

I really appreciate the input though. It gives me a lot to think and work on.



Here is a performance I did last fall. Criticism would be greatly appreciated :)

YouTube - ‪PCC - Comin' Home Baby‬‏
 
#22
WyrmDL said:
Wow, definitely many more replies than I expected, thanks everyone for your input so far! :)

I do try to be a musician first and foremost. I'm still in the learning stages of guitar and bass, but I'm always trying to pick up new things when I'm working with other groups. I still have a long way to go, though; there are times when I feel like I'm just a drummer, and nothing more; I feel timid to the music, unsure of what to comment on, and confused on what to add.

I also feel absurdly intimidated by jazz. I don't even think about going to a jazz open mic, just because I don't know how the system works and what's required. I feel like a newbie in a room of critical experts.

I really appreciate the input though. It gives me a lot to think and work on.



Here is a performance I did last fall. Criticism would be greatly appreciated :)

YouTube - ‪PCC - Comin' Home Baby‬‏
Click to expand...
Nice steady playing, suited the tune. I just took the liberty of measuring your tempo using this page:

Tap for Beats Per Minute BPM

You were around 134 bpm at the start of the tune and 128 bpm at the end. Folks who assume their tempo is dead constant might think that sounds like an issue, but they'd be wrong - it's actually pretty damned good. And horn players nearly always tend to drag just a little if you let them, in my experience.

I'd obviously agree with the folks who've stated things like the various aspects of professionalism and other personal qualities, as well as precise and accurate time, dynamics, listening well, general musicality and versatility. For the last of these, I'd consider good reading a must - I'm assuming you're a reader judging by the nature of the band in the clip you posted, correct?
 
#23
Hi.

IMLE, if I had to pick one quality over anything else, it'd be dynamics.

True, personality has often more to do with any bandmember fitting in than any skills they may or may not posess, but if any musician, cough, guitarist, cough is too loud, it ain't gonna work. Even the rehearsals are going to be literal pain. Been there, done that.

If You're going to be a hired hand, the same exact qualities that make a good worker in any trade applies.

I once played with a drummer who could keep a steady beat with an acoustic piano, keeping the feel there as well. I haven't been that fortunate since.

Regards
Sam
 
#24
The best drummer I have played with (and I have played with many) have put the time in to master rudimentary and advanced technique to a metronome, and listen to the players around them while performing. In the studio, it is imperative to strike each drum (especially the snare) and the ride and hats with consistency of attack in the same spot every time. The best drummer I know has mastered every style of music, from country, to hip hop, to jazz, funk, blues and rock and can cop just the right feel every time.
 
#25
Forgot to mention the click thing!

Make sure you are comfortable playing with a click!

My bland always plays to a click track and whenever we need to play with a dep drummer you can really feel the difference between the ones who are used to it and practiced it and he ones who probably dont own a metronome and always struggle to keep up!
Feels pretty awful when the drummer is always speeding up or slowing down a few bars here and there to try to keep up with a click!
 
#26
First he's got to be a cool, needs to be ok with partying, dogs, guns, playing for little pay, not going to start problems with others.
second he's got to be able to play jazz, and blast beats, fast, and slow, quite, and loud.
third atomic clock
fourth needs to be available
fifth needs to fit into most overhead storage compartments.
 
#27
At the church where I use to play bass at, there were 4 differant drummers and eventually I played with all of them. Same set of drums and while all of the guys were good there were two of them who REALLY knew how to make those drums sound great. Call it the sound, the tone or whatever you want....these two guys just knew how to hit those drums just right. It's not like they sat there and tuned the drums either. They just got up there and went to town. Everytime I played with either of them I was going..."Yeah!!!"
 
#29
bassybill said:
Nice steady playing, suited the tune. I just took the liberty of measuring your tempo using this page:

Tap for Beats Per Minute BPM

You were around 134 bpm at the start of the tune and 128 bpm at the end. Folks who assume their tempo is dead constant might think that sounds like an issue, but they'd be wrong - it's actually pretty damned good. And horn players nearly always tend to drag just a little if you let them, in my experience.

I'd obviously agree with the folks who've stated things like the various aspects of professionalism and other personal qualities, as well as precise and accurate time, dynamics, listening well, general musicality and versatility. For the last of these, I'd consider good reading a must - I'm assuming you're a reader judging by the nature of the band in the clip you posted, correct?
Click to expand...

Hmm, very interesting, because I always thought that on faster paced songs, I would speed it up rather than slow it down. I know on slower paced songs, I probably have a bad habit of dragging.

This brings me to a question on tempo though: Is it a big problem if the tempo changes slightly throughout the song, even if it's not very noticeable?



Also, what are your thoughts on sight reading and chart familiarity?

Thanks, I really appreciate this!
 
#30
WyrmDL said:
This brings me to a question on tempo though: Is it a big problem if the tempo changes slightly throughout the song, even if it's not very noticeable?
Click to expand...

No. The key word being "slightly". Just make it musical. This thing about a good drummer functioning as a human metronome is exaggerated and overblown, IMHO.

The important thing is good relative time - not necessarily good absolute time. Not unlike the distinction between having good relative pitch vs. having good absolute pitch: The one is essential in the real world; the other is useful mostly in a theoretical context. :hmm:

MM
 
#31
MysticMichael said:
No. The key word being "slightly". Just make it musical. This thing about a good drummer functioning as a human metronome is exaggerated and overblown, IMHO.

The important thing is good relative time - not necessarily good absolute time. Not unlike the distinction between having good relative pitch vs. having good absolute pitch: The one is essential in the real world; the other is useful mostly in a theoretical context. :hmm:

MM
Click to expand...
I'd agree with this. Sometimes music should change tempo. If you're playing certain dance styles you might want to move with the energy of the crowd. As long as the tempo changes are not blatant, and the band is moving together then there's no problem. I'm a DJ and I'm very aware of just how much of a tempo shift there is in a LOT of old-school funk, soul and disco. Rhythm in life is an organic thing: it moves tempo-wise and there's nothing wrong with that - up to a point. ;)

As far as being intimidated goes, that's pretty normal. I think one of the best things a person can do to help overcome such feelings of intimidation is to really listen to the music in question. Get to the point where you feel a connection with the music, as if this is your music and you have some business playing it. The rest is practice and time. :)

P.S., I would have checked out your clip but Youtube videos won't play on my computer at the moment.
 
#33
Best drummer I've ever played with also knew how to play bass, guitar, keyboard, and sing backing vocals. During downtime at rehearsals he would ask me to teach him lines on the bass so he understood the songs better. At the gig he always knew exactly where we were in the song form, made eye contact with everybody, used body language and drum fills to signal transitions. If somebody got lost he would get their attention and bring them back in line.

To the above I'd also add the "three S's": Show up on time, Stay Sober, and Say nice things about people.

If you can do all the above then, in my opinion, you'll put yourself in the best position to gig with musicians who are maybe a little better/more experienced than you, which is the type of situation where you will be challenged, learn, and improve. :)
 
#34
scottfeldstein said:
Let's take some things as a given: shows up, is reliable, doesn't cause personnel problems with other musicians, etc. Aside from that, here's what I'd like to see:

1. Does not play extremely loud. Period. If your sticks are like tree trunks and you beat your drums like they were rented mules, forget it.

2. Does know how to change things up. Same song, same beats per minute...different kit arrangement. It can really make the transition from one part of a song to another into something magical--and inspire me to bust out a different groove to accentuate it.

3. Related to 2: someone who actually listens to the other musicians. It helps if he/she can play another instrument, I think. Even if not proficiently.

4. Is willing to drop out or almost completely out of an arrangement to create a wider, more dramatic arrangement.

5. Rock-solid, atomic-clock-level timekeeping. Even when singing a harmony.
Click to expand...

These are all very good, and very well stated. Agreed 100% to all and I'll add 5 of my own.

1) I like to see a guy (or gal) who takes good care of their kit. I play several times a year with a very busy local drummer who bought his main kit in the early 1980s and those drums are still in showroom condition today. No joke. And this is a guy that probably averages 10 to 12 gigs a month, every month. The way I see it, if someone cares that much about how their kit looks, they also probably care that much about how it sounds.

2) Also relating to gear, I am very much a "less is more" guy with bass gear and I appreciate the same from drummers... especially when room on stage is sparse. The guy I'm playing with regularly now runs a kick, a snare, 1 rack tom, 1 floor tom, and no more than 4 cymbals (including the hat). That's all he needs and we're covering the gamut from 50s oldies to 80s cock rock to Black Eyed Peas and Lady GaGa. Yes, it can be done.

3) Knowing how to tune drums has been covered by others, and is critical. All the EQ and effects in the world won't fix drums that sound like crap at the source. I also love it when a drummer shows up to the gig with his own set of high quality mic's and knows how to place them.

4) Also in the vein of good sound at the source... it is always a treat to play with drummers who have great "internal balance" in terms of volume across the kit. They don't play a teeny-tiny backbeat and then huge thunderous tom fills (or vice versa). They don't expect the soundman to balance their sound, they do it with their playing. The drum kit comes across as one integated instrument, not a bunch of assorted pieces. This one is kind of hard to put into words, but you know it when you hear it.

5) I love drummers who prioritize good tone over volume. The hardest hitters don't always have the best sounding drums and in fact their tone often sucks. A caveat to this being, I really like drummers who put their foot into the kick drum with authority. One of the biggest gripes I have with younger / less experienced drummers is they simply will not give me a good, solid kick to latch on to. More often than not I'm telling young players to take that excess volume they're putting into the hat and the toms and redirect it to the kick instead.
 
#37
I second a lot of what's been said.

- Learn to play quiet, or just learn dynamics in general. I'm so sick and tired of loud drummers I could scream!

- Remember where the starts and stops are in the songs, including how the song itself starts and ends.

- Hold the tempo, duh.

- Play the appropriate beat/groove for the song. I could care less about your fancy chops, or if you think the beat is repetitive or boring. I have repetitive parts that I'm not fond of too, but they fit the song correctly. Deal with it.
 
#39
treekiller said:
This will get you farther than anything else, so you are off to a good start.

I also agree about dynamics, and it's not just for drummers either!!!

Playing with a crappy drummer sucks, period and it makes you appreciate a good drummer. Playing with a good drummer makes you vow to never play with a crappy drummer again!!! :hiding:
Click to expand...

+1000

I got spoiled in that my first real band in the 80's had one of the best drummers in the area. It made my job so much easier.

Qualities. Good rhythm and tempo. I hate fighting with a drummer trying to keep him from speeding up or slowing down. Big ears. I play blues so being able to adjust dynamics and feel on the fly is important. Good feel for what fits in a song. Responsible, on time, no drama.
 
#40
CapnSev said:
Play the appropriate beat/groove for the song. I could care less about your fancy chops, or if you think the beat is repetitive or boring. I have repetitive parts that I'm not fond of too, but they fit the song correctly. Deal with it.
Click to expand...

"Love Shack" is a perfect example of this, and my band plays it almost every show. A lot of bassists and drummers ask us how we can deal with playing such a "boring" tune but the drummer and I both love just laying down a solid groove so we kind of go all zen on that tune and see how deep into the pocket we can get. The crowd sees we're having a good time with it, and they love the song to begin with, so it usually turns out to be one of the highlights of our show.
 

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