Question about sensitivity/volume

[KJung]

If nothing else, won't rolling off bass on the amp at least increase the amp's available headroom by reducing the power-soaking lows it's trying to reproduce?

Liam

The trouble with using a standard shelving bass control for this is that many times the shelving point is high enough to reduce some upper bass and low mids from your sound. And, of course, the narrow Q of the lowest band of semi-parametric won't help much at all, even though you can dial it down quite low.


However, with a bridged Eden800, there should be no problem getting the Acme up to 'full volume'. The 'problem' with the Acme for me is that huge low end tends to overwhelm the mids and highs as you turn up. That little bitty mid driver just can't seem to compete with those four hi xmax woofers. So, the lack of 'punch' results in the cab sounding 'softer' than it actually is. Of course, many really like the Acme sound live, so that's a personal choice.

 

[12bass]

Actually, rolling off a click or two of the lowest semi-parametric control set to 30 Hz may do a reasonable job cutting the sub-lows on the Eden and be somewhat useful with the Acme cabinets. IMO, the bass control covers too broad a range to be useful for that purpose. Also, note that one added clock setting (12:00 => 1:00) on the Eden's bass control adds about 6 dB of bass, which is a huge boost.

 

[Lia_G]

The 'problem' with the Acme for me is that huge low end tends to overwhelm the mids and highs as you turn up. That little bitty mid driver just can't seem to compete with those four hi xmax woofers. So, the lack of 'punch' results in the cab sounding 'softer' than it actually is. Of course, many really like the Acme sound live, so that's a personal choice.

Hey, Ken,

Have you ever compared the B410 against 2 x B210? Just wondering if the 210 stack, having an extra mid driver versus the 410, might alleviate this somewhat?

Having said that, I do understand that the Acmes don't do your sound the best. I think they might do mine, though, and they're also very well thought of in double bass circles (and most of my work these days is on upright or country-blues P-bass).

I'm still not in the position to consider spending money on cabs again, but through circumstances beyond my control, it seems I've ended up with the perfect amp to drive these things (the B1500). A modular stack of Acme 210's might be very cool someday. And I do have an outboard high-pass filter to use.

Cheers,
Liam

 

[KJung]

Hey, Ken,

Have you ever compared the B410 against 2 x B210? Just wondering if the 210 stack, having an extra mid driver versus the 410, might alleviate this somewhat?

Having said that, I do understand that the Acmes don't do your sound the best. I think they might do mine, though, and they're also very well thought of in double bass circles (and most of my work these days is on upright or country-blues P-bass).

I'm still not in the position to consider spending money on cabs again, but through circumstances beyond my control, it seems I've ended up with the perfect amp to drive these things (the B1500). A modular stack of Acme 210's might be very cool someday. And I do have an outboard high-pass filter to use.

Cheers,
Liam

You know, I have and it sounds identical. This is actually a good thing. From what I understand, Andy 'attenuates' the mid drivers and tweeter in the 110 and 210 so that the balance between them and the woofers remain constant as the cabs 'scale up or down'. While these cabs are not really my 'sound', I have always been very impressed with the design and quality execution.

They are the only cabinets within a product line that I've ever heard that, to my ear, are completely, transparently scalable.... the 110 sounds like the 210, only softer... same low end, same 'voicing'. Two 210's sound like the 410, etc., etc. And, Andy offers a 4ohm and 8ohm version in every cab, so you can optimize the 'mix and match' with any head.

I assume there might be some slight 'dispersion' advantage in the midrange and treble with two 210's aligned vertically with multiple mid and tweeter point sources versus the 410, but I don't feel it would be enough of a difference to result in someone saying 'I like the two 210's but not the 410', etc.

Nice stuff for those looking for deep, warm, fat, and organic IMO. Not so good for some other tone goals and playing contexts IMO and IME (like every other piece of gear IMO).

Edit: a hi pass filter really can make these cabs sound 'better' in a mix IMO.

 

[Lia_G]

I'm thinking more and more that I'll try one out one of these days, once the finances are turned around. Thanks for the insights ...

Cheers,
Liam

 

[alexclaber]

Sensitivity becomes far less relevant when you realise that most bass cabs can't handle anywhere near their rated power. The Acmes are the exception to that.

If you're into fatter smoother bass sounds then the 5" mid won't have any problems keeping up - the problems lies when you're wanting the bite that typical 10" woofers have in the upper midrange or the boosted brightness of a horn tweeter. The Acmes have much flatter response in that region hence no blaring sound cutting through the mix. Also as those frequencies are coming from a dedicated midrange speaker there tends to be much lower distortion than if coming from a woofer that is already running near or beyond Xmax some of the time (very common with conventional bass cabs) or from a tweeter which has too shallow a highpass slope on it.

In my experience using a 30Hz highpass filter on the Acmes makes no difference to the sound but it does stop the woofers moving as much. Logically it will thus increase your headroom. I don't see the point the raising the highpass filter higher, better to just turn down the lows in a broader sense, especially as boom lives about two octaves higher.

Alex