Ray Ross Bridges

[MustangWally]

New ideas are often met with resistance - "but that is not the right way to do X" cry the naysayers and the visionaries who have had, and acted upon, these new ideas continue on regardless, often to great acclaim and success over time. I think that Mr Ross will be regarded as a visionary over time, but we are still at the naysayer stage and I am sure that he is rightfully sick of dealing with them. Remember, the man is a bass player too, he is one of us and we should at the very least give him a hearing free of uneducated guesses about how his bridge might work.

Here is an idea to all of you who are weighing in with negative comments based on nothing apart from your own concept of what 'should' work - go buy one, put it on a bass and try the dang thing for a while. Then, and only then, are you qualified to comment. Anything less is purely conjecture based on no actual information (except that your buddy/cousin knows a guy who might have seen one once and heard bad things about it).

As other posters have noted: these bridges are going onto production instruments as we speak. Not many manufacturers (like none) are going to sell a bass with a non-functional bridge on it, and you can bet that those manufacturers have tested the heck out of the RayRoss bridge before committing it to production.

So there it is: buy it and try it or shut the heck up. Sorry gents but I call it as I see it. Let the flames begin....

 

[RodRy]

New ideas are often met with resistance - "but that is not the right way to do X" cry the naysayers and the visionaries who have had, and acted upon, these new ideas continue on regardless, often to great acclaim and success over time. I think that Mr Ross will be regarded as a visionary over time, but we are still at the naysayer stage and I am sure that he is rightfully sick of dealing with them. Remember, the man is a bass player too, he is one of us and we should at the very least give him a hearing free of uneducated guesses about how his bridge might work.

Here is an idea to all of you who are weighing in with negative comments based on nothing apart from your own concept of what 'should' work - go buy one, put it on a bass and try the dang thing for a while. Then, and only then, are you qualified to comment. Anything less is purely conjecture based on no actual information (except that your buddy/cousin knows a guy who might have seen one once and heard bad things about it).

As other posters have noted: these bridges are going onto production instruments as we speak. Not many manufacturers (like none) are going to sell a bass with a non-functional bridge on it, and you can bet that those manufacturers have tested the heck out of the RayRoss bridge before committing it to production.

So there it is: buy it and try it or shut the heck up. Sorry gents but I call it as I see it. Let the flames begin....

While I respect your candor, and agree that the proof is in the playing, I'm afraid I have to take exception with your line, "Anything less is purely conjecture based on no actual information."

There's something to be said for education and familiarity with the concepts involved. Force, translating into tension, and the mechanics of vibrating strings are not new concepts. Some of the "naysayers" have used their experience and knowledge to evaluate the designs. To claim that they are only using conjecture is to remain ignorant of the understanding that they may be bringing. I have to support them to a degree: there are really no great lessons to be learned from a force diagram of the RayRoss bridge. The real question is, are there other assumptions being made which should not be? One of the things I'm seeing in the discussions is that "downforce" of the string may actually be much less important that what we have been lead to believe.

For that answer, a real bridge is needed. And I applaud @StefanMarinov for putting that to the test, both in his video, and in being willing to send a bridge to @TrustRod for a second evaluation.

@TrustRod, the ball is in your court, and we're interested in what you do next.

 

[BassBeginer64]

I received one of these bridges a week ago and havent been wound up to put it on yet myself, maybe tomorrow, when i do I'll post.

 

[Joshua]

For clarity; all comments are welcome here whether negative or positive as long as they are offered respectfully.

 

[BAG]

Here is an idea to all of you who are weighing in with negative comments based on nothing apart from your own concept of what 'should' work - go buy one, put it on a bass and try the dang thing for a while. Then, and only then, are you qualified to comment.

I disagree Wally. Anyone with even a small amount of instrument and sound experience is more than qualified to refute many of his statements without having to pay two to three times more for his contraption (compared to a quality proven bridge) for the privilege.

Many of the negative comments were aimed at the outlandish claims from the designer. Had he not made hugely unrealistic claims of the benefits of his design, and then insulted those who challenged those claims, things would have most likely gone very differently for him. He came across as an old time snake oil salesman..... so much so that I'm actually a little surprised her didn't claim that using his bridge would increase the size of your old fella.

This below was one of my favorite bits of snake oil.....

RayRoss is not a bridge. It is a studio grade"pre-amp" and reference monitor for the bass, and it is MECHANICAL in nature. No plugs, cords, dials, etc..All the sound, instantly. No more dead spots. No more trouble hearing what you are playing, for you or anyone listening. Everything ELSE is a bridge.

I do NOT need to pay for one to be qualified to say "What a load of bollocks!"

 

[StefanMarinov]

I disagree Wally. Anyone with even a small amount of instrument and sound experience is more than qualified to refute many of his statements without having to pay two to three times more for his contraption (compared to a quality proven bridge) for the privilege.

Many of the negative comments were aimed at the outlandish claims from the designer. Had he not made hugely unrealistic claims of the benefits of his design, and then insulted those who challenged those claims, things would have most likely gone very differently for him. He came across as an old time snake oil salesman..... so much so that I'm actually a little surprised her didn't claim that using his bridge would increase the size of your old fella.

This below was one of my favorite bits of snake oil.....

I do NOT need to pay for one to be qualified to say "What a load of bollocks!"

Bag I think there’s two ways to go about this. If you take it literally, of course it isn’t and anybody would say “but it is not a preamp or a monitor” - end of story. The other way is, I think he’s tried to be more metaphorical about it. In my experience there’s more sound coming out of the strings with this bridge - you could see it as more clarity, volume and harmonics - which could be metaphorically referred to as a preamp grade. Hope you see where I’m coming from.
I’d however agree with Wally that the only way to see if it has any sound advantages (or disadvantages if someone sees it that way after trying) over other bridges is to try one.

 

[Killing Floor]

I find it curious that this thread is basically 22 pages of bass players going after some guy trying to make a living. If you don’t want one, don’t buy one. But there’s no need to bash someone because they are trying to make a product for the bass. I’ve played Fenders for over 40 years and you can say Fenders are cool, you can say Jaco, you can say you like yours. But you can’t say Leo’s bridge is beyond improvement. Don’t be so crabby.
C’mon. Y’all be cool!

 

[Koshchei]

For what it's worth, I did hear a significant difference in the A:B video above - B was noticeably brighter in the upper mids and also seemed to buzz a bit more too. As a solo instrument, I don't prefer it to a regular bridge (it's a bit brash to my ear), but it'd be interesting to hear it in context with a drummer and a guitarist. A bass normally lives in the 60-110Hz, 300Hz, and 800Hz range, topping out around 1.6kHz, while guitar's mids are in the 400Hz-1k range, topping out around 3-4kHz. This new bridge seems to change that up a bit - I'd like to hear how it hangs in a mix.

 

[StefanMarinov]

For what it's worth, I did hear a significant difference in the A:B video above - B was noticeably brighter in the upper mids and also seemed to buzz a bit more too. As a solo instrument, I don't prefer it to a regular bridge (it's a bit brash to my ear), but it'd be interesting to hear it in context with a drummer and a guitarist. A bass normally lives in the 60-110Hz, 300Hz, and 800Hz range, topping out around 1.6kHz, while guitar is 400Hz-1k, topping out around 3-4kHz. This new bridge seems to change that up a bit - I'd like to hear how it hangs in a mix.

Check it in a mix here -

 

[StefanMarinov]

For what it's worth, I did hear a significant difference in the A:B video above - B was noticeably brighter in the upper mids and also seemed to buzz a bit more too. As a solo instrument, I don't prefer it to a regular bridge (it's a bit brash to my ear), but it'd be interesting to hear it in context with a drummer and a guitarist. A bass normally lives in the 60-110Hz, 300Hz, and 800Hz range, topping out around 1.6kHz, while guitar's mids are in the 400Hz-1k range, topping out around 3-4kHz. This new bridge seems to change that up a bit - I'd like to hear how it hangs in a mix.

Buzz can be introduced or removed by adjusting the string action, I personally like some so I set my basses low. It’s not a trait specific to this bridge.

 

[Koshchei]

Check it in a mix here -

Thanks for this -- it's got a really sharp attack. Do you find yourself playing a different place on the beat relative to the drummer with the new bridge? Wondering how it plays with the kick.

edit: re buzz - yeah totally. I like my action as low as possible. On my Ric, it's limited by how low the saddles can go vs how straight I can get the neck without introducing back-buzz (~1.5mm @ 12th), and with the GWB, it's 0.75mm at the treble side and 1.5mm on the low B.

 

[StefanMarinov]

Thanks for this -- it's got a really sharp attack. Do you find yourself playing a different place on the beat relative to the drummer with the new bridge? Wondering how it plays with the kick.

edit: re buzz - yeah totally. I like my action as low as possible. On my Ric, it's limited by how low the saddles can go vs how straight I can get the neck without introducing back-buzz (~1.5mm @ 12th), and with the GWB, it's 0.75mm at the treble side and 1.5mm on the low B.

I generally always try to sit behind the kick, not always successfully but that’s my approach, regardless of the bridge or bass. My playing style is slightly aggressive and punchy and it wouldn’t work if it’s on top or before the drums. So it doesn’t make a difference with the bridge really, I get more punch but I’d have it slightly quieter in the mix in order to blend. It just shifts the focus in a direction I like.

 

[Koshchei]

Sweet! Thanks for the prompt feedback! Much appreciated!

 

[StefanMarinov]

You told me it was delivered. You know it was delivered.



I'm really starting to dislike you and your name calling.

I know that it was showing as delivered. I expected a prompt confirmation from you.

No problem about name calling - consider it ended.

 

[Chef]

any further fisticuffs/taunting/insults in here will be dealt with by me. keep it nice or don't post.

 

[BassBeginer64]

 

[Joshua]

Wow; that was fun.

First and foremost, thanks to @Chef for the cleanup.

Secondly, this thread is officially at a zero tolerance point. If we have to clean up again it's getting shut down. For anyone keeping score at home:

This forum is for the specific discussion of hardware (and setup and repair as well, of course). Got an opinion about the bridge? Please feel free to share it. First hand experience with it? Come right in and let us know. In doing so, please ensure you are following rule #1 here at TB, that of respect.

Beyond that? Take it elsewhere.

 

[StefanMarinov]

Wow; that was fun.

First and foremost, thanks to @Chef for the cleanup.

Secondly, this thread is officially at a zero tolerance point. If we have to clean up again it's getting shut down. For anyone keeping score at home:

This forum is for the specific discussion of hardware (and setup and repair as well, of course). Got an opinion about the bridge? Please feel free to share it. First hand experience with it? Come right in and let us know. In doing so, please ensure you are following rule #1 here at TB, that of respect.

Beyond that? Take it elsewhere.

I’m sorry for the part I’ve played leading to this. Never wanted it that way but messages are very often misunderstood and I can see how I’ve failed to steer this in a more civilised direction. We’re all but human beings after all.

With this I’d like to express my willingness to start anew, without offences - just purely discussing what we do like or dislike about the product in question.

 

[MattZilla]

My neighbor has a newer than 2010 Honda Civic V-Tec which he revs up at least four times between starting it and then pulling out of the driveway. He’s at least 50 years old and is a really nice guy and that makes me laugh a little bit- him revving it like an excited 16 year old.

Now I see that this thread is surviving on insults. That makes me laugh in kind of the same way.

Stefan, I’m glad you like the bridge so much. It’s good to be passionate about your instrument.

 

[TrustRod]

The following review has been pre approved by a mod.


We’ve heard many times from this company that it’s unfair to judge this bridge by any other means than having one in your hands. Here are my hands on impressions.

This bridge is much wider than any 5 string I have. The screw holes do not line up with my 3 kinds of Hipshots (vintage and A & B style), Fender, Tobias, Yamaha, cheap import, Wilkinson, Fernandes, or Peavey.

2 hole sizes are used to adjust the intonation and height. 1.5mm and 2mm. The enclosed toothpick sized tool has both, don’t lose it.

You can’t adjust bridge height tuned to pitch. The instructions tell you to use a “medium tension” to adjust the string height and to tune to pitch after the adjustment is complete.

There is a large amount of slop in the fit of the pin. It almost feels like the “tone pin” is a smaller size than the hole in the saddle it screws into. The saddle themselves can wiggle sideways and click against each other.

The pins don’t poke into my palm. The edge is sharp though and will shave your fingernail.

The powder coating, while pretty, makes the bridge non conductive and will need to be scraped to expose the brass in order to ground the strings.

The mounting screws are super thin at .125” at the outside of the threads. Compare this to .170” on an old Tobias. Even if the holes lined up the included screws would be unusable without doweling the holes first.

So to mount this on one of a dozen 5 strings I have I would have to drill and dowel the old holes, then redrill new holes. And then repeat that to repair the bass.

At this point I will not be subjecting one of my basses to test the claims that this bridge is a hi end preamp, ends all dead spots, or any of the other tonal claims. Before I handled this bridge I thought it was well made but with ridiculous tonal claims. I no longer feel it is well made. Personally I greatly prefer the $11 bridge I have on my Guild Pilot as it doesn’t have the problems the Ray Ross bridge does.