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Replacing Sadowsky eletronics - Heresy?

SanDiegoHarry

SanDiegoHarry

Inactive
Supporting Member
Aug 11, 2008
17,143
9,104
San Diego, CA
#1
I bought a lovely 24 fret "modern" NYC Sadowsky 5 string about 6 months ago - Looks factory fresh, plays great but the sound... seems... oddly thin. I plug in my Lakland and it *sings* to me. I know my Lakland sits in the mix really nicely, and I'll bet that even though it is different (and not so pleasing to my ears by itself) it too sits in the mix. But I just don't love the sound. With the bass & treble rolled to zero boost, it sounds gutless. So I am considering having my local tech install the Bart arrangement that I know and dig.

So am I mad? Is this insanity, or am I not alone here?
 
#4
One thing for sure is you'll be able to sell the Sadwosky electronics in a flash. I myself prefer the Sadowsky Single coils over the Hum cancelers. Maybe start there?
 
#7
brianrost said:
Exactly!

If I can get the sound I need out of the existing electronics I'm happy. If I can't, it's the wrong bass for me. I've never been one for pickup/EQ swaps.

It's interesting how many classic EQs...Fender tone stack, StingRay 2 band, Sadowsky (actually designed by Alex Aguilar)...are boost only.
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The bass could just as easily have been built with different electronics. If you like everything else about the bass why not switch out the preamp or pickups? I have a Lull that came with an Aguilar preamp. Sounded great at home but didn't work at all in a band setting. I considered selling the bass but, liking everything else about it, decided to switch the preamp. Now it works fantastically in a band setting and I'm very glad I decided to not sell it when a simple alteration is all that was required.
 
#8
SanDiegoHarry said:
So am I mad? Is this insanity, or am I not alone here?
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It's your bass and you can mod if you want to. Mod if you want to...
I have a friend who just recently put a Les Paul neck on his strat. OK, it doesn't "look" like a Les Paul neck since he had it custom made to match his 70's Les Paul exactly but still have a Fender(ish) headstock, but that's got to be a bigger heresy than putting different electronics in your Sadowsky.
 
#10
I'm not sure why or how you would think it would be heresy. Roger Sadowsky is but a man. A mortal! His preamps are not everyone's cup of tea that's for sure.

Personally I would try a few different brands and gauges of strings first. I'd also listen very carefully to the bass unplugged, in a quiet room. Ask yourself what is missing from its acoustic tone. If it sounds nice, but is lacking a bit of this or that, then you've got a good shot at getting there with some other electronics. If it still kinda sounds lifeless and thin unplugged, then go for the barts that you know, but cross your fingers. IME, when a bass is not speaking to you acoustically, changing the electronics has much less chance of helping.

With the bass & treble rolled to zero boost, it sounds gutless
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I've seen a few of these with a passive tone control. If it's not there, it's an easy addition, and sometimes tweaking the passive tone can just mellow out that treble boost and fatten up the overall tone. You can also try lowering the input Z on the preamp. It's as simple as adding a resistor across the input. You could try it with a pot, then add it as a push-pull switch if you like the sound of it. The load the pickups "see" before the preamp is really critical to how the treble response is.
 
#11
you could also consider a set of Big Singles or Big Splits (It is also an option that Roger offer in his basses)… me on my 24 I installed a Nordstrand 3b with the mid switch set at 200hz and 1k. The 200 helps a lot to fatten up those Duncan's pups
 
#12
I think that more than the electronics, what you are hearing is the unusual pickup location, which is closer to the bridge. I've had a love/hate relationship with the 5-24s, but ultimately, I love them.They do sound great in the mix, both live and recording, although generally are not a crowd-pleasers by themselves. I've learn to love the sound, especially because it's so different from a Fender sound.

I have also thought about putting some Nordstrand Big Splits to liven the sound and make them more aggressive, but like i said, I have learned to love the sound and don't think it's worth changing anything. Every time I hear somebody playing one, I think to myself how amazing they sound.

I always boost the lows at least 1/4 of a turn, and tend to favor the neck pickup. This sounds huge. I also boost the treble a bit if I want to hear myself better (I wear earplugs when playing).

All this said, I would think you could also benefit from a 3-band EQ, or even a graphic EQ, so you can bump a little on those frequencies you are missing that the onboard preamp doesn't give you.

I also have a love/hate relationship with the Sadowsky preamp. I have an onboard one that I use with other basses, and man, it sound so round and sweet, but it does take away some frequencies that I miss from the natural sound of the bass, most likely some mids. . .

All in all, I do prefer the sound of a Lakland 55-94, for example, but the playability of the Sadowsky (and the 34") made it a winner for me.

And in conclusion, I don't see anything wrong with changing the pickups and/or the preamp. That might do it for you, but remember that the signature sound of that bass is baked-in with the pickups' location.
 
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#13
nope, It's the pickups, both position and their sound. I played modern 5 and wasn't impressed at all. on the other side, NYC standard is the nicest bass I played. I use Sad pre with fat stack pickups and it gives me tons off ground shaking bottom end for my modern pop/disco/R'n'b band.

PS, I've had pretty much all of the onboard preamps available
 
#14
SanDiegoHarry said:
I bought a lovely 24 fret "modern" NYC Sadowsky 5 string about 6 months ago - Looks factory fresh, plays great but the sound... seems... oddly thin. I plug in my Lakland and it *sings* to me. I know my Lakland sits in the mix really nicely, and I'll bet that even though it is different (and not so pleasing to my ears by itself) it too sits in the mix. But I just don't love the sound. With the bass & treble rolled to zero boost, it sounds gutless. So I am considering having my local tech install the Bart arrangement that I know and dig.

So am I mad? Is this insanity, or am I not alone here?
Click to expand...
No, you are just trying to learn a new bass and make it work for you.

Here are a couple of thoughts:

First, I recommend you work with the bass for at least a half dozen gigs to see what you CAN get out of it.

The Sadowsky preamp has a lot of magic in it. BUT, I find that magic is in a rather narrow range of settings. I like the bass boost up about 30% and the treble up about 27%. Then panning and varying VTC produces a lot of useful sounds. Varying the bass and treble boost much away from those settings gets me into zones I don't find useful. Turning them to 0 defeats the point of the preamp. Not sure what you were going for by trying that. That's way outside the comfort zone.

Comparing a bass with the Modern pup placement to any other bass with the more typical J placement will generally give you a bit less bass response, all else equal. They are different instruments. Sounds to me like you may need to do a little more work with the bass to figure out what part of the thing works for you and what doesn't. At least Sadowsky basses come with impeccable set up; so, you don't have to fight that battle.

So, give it a little more elbow grease. You can always try different preamps. That doesn't always solve the issue.
 
#19
You know, it could just be that particular bass. I was recently at the Sadowsky shop and I tried a bunch of different basses, some with very similar specs. They all sounded a bit different. Overall I liked the sound of each bass I tried, except for one (a Standard) that just sounded a bit anemic to be (by Sadowsky standards - no pun intended). I tried a couple of Moderns and didn't find them lacking in low end at all but they were very focused-sounding and very smooth/clean. So, sure, it could be that the Modern sound just isn't for you but it could also be that the bass you own possesses undesirable (to you) characteristics that aren't necessarily representative of the model itself.
 

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