• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

RUSh at Barclays Center Last Night - Problems

lijazz

lijazz

Dec 5, 2008
389
54
Isle of Long, New York
#1
Saw Rush in Brooklyn, NY last night at the new Barclays Center. I had concerns about sound quality being that it is a large venue like many others. And unfortunately my concerns were well warranted. Granted, I was in the nosebleed seats, so that had something to do with it, but from what I have heard this morning on the internet, my complaint of the sound is shared by many others regardless of seating location. From what I COULD hear, the band sounded great, but the sound was so boomy and bottom heavy that I could not hear Geddy's bass AT ALL. The best way I can describe the overall sound quality is like listening to a concert in the parking lot outside an arena. All boom, no clarity. I think between Neil's bass drum and the Taurus pedals, that really killed the sound as much as the arena acoustics themself. Plus Alex's guitar issues during the 2112 encore didn't help matters either. Anyway, that show is history and now I can only hope for a 40th Anniversary tour at a different venue.
 
#3
We also started in the nose bleed seats. I had hope that the sound would improve once the engineers "felt out the room".
By the end of the first set it was still nothing but kick-drum sub woofers. Agreed, it sounded like being outside of a club.
We moved down right next to the stage for the rest of the show, and were in direct path of the speaker arrays. Unfortunately, although now we could at least read lips, there was zero intelligibility in the mix. No vocals, no clarity in guitar, certainly no clarity in Geddy's bass. (Forget about hearing the string section at all. They may as well have not even been there.)

There are a few factors that contribute to this epidemic:

- Sporting arenas are gymnasiums that are not conducive to good sound. Given.

- Tours are now mixed using automated consoles that have all of the levels and fx pre-programmed in and can be recalled to be consistent nightly. Unfortunately the venues change dramatically from place to place, and the audio mixer is generally not the tour sound designer and is very hesitant to adjust much "live". Just basic adjustments during sound check, usually to the master eq only.

- Now that the artists use in ear monitors, they are somewhat oblivious to the sound in the venue that the audience is hearing. (Last night, Geddy seemed to have several issues with his in-ear monitors.)

- Audiences for most modern music are not as discerning when it comes to sound quality. Most big shows are about dancing, costumes, and spectacle. However, musicians like us (especially fans of a great band like RUSH) are quite a bit more picky when it comes to the music ACTUALLY SOUNDING GOOD.

Still...

RUSH was incredible, and I cannot hold the "hostile sound" situation against them. They delivered.


P.S.
How about the roadie that didn't have Alex's backup guitar ready. Get fired much?

:)
 
#4
It depends on the sound engineer and the venue. I saw Rush in 2008 in OKC and their sound was much like you described. Very boomy with no clarity in the lows and mids, which drowned out the highs. Horrible. Then I saw them last year in Tulsa and they sounded GREAT. Much better mix and clarity.

Sorry to hear about your experience. :atoz:
 
#8
I was there too last night. They rocked hard as hell but I agree on the sound being to woofy. I thought it was kinda funny that they probably had half of Alex's stuff packed away when his guitar went dead. That dance he did while waiting was hilarious and hearing just Geddy and Neil while that was happening was cool to see/hear.
 
#10
I wonder how hard it would be for the owners of the large indoor venues to spend a little $ and time to do some basic acoustic treatments? Nothing fancy, just take care of the "hot spots".

The sound system technology has come a long way, so just a little effort in the room treatment pays huge dividends in terms of listening pleasure, plus you can then actually turn down the volume a little so as not to overload the room. Lots of good acoustic engineers out there who do this for a living.
 
#12
nrausch said:
- Tours are now mixed using automated consoles that have all of the levels and fx pre-programmed in and can be recalled to be consistent nightly. Unfortunately the venues change dramatically from place to place, and the audio mixer is generally not the tour sound designer and is very hesitant to adjust much "live". Just basic adjustments during sound check, usually to the master eq only.
Click to expand...


With all due respect, this is assumption and incorrect.
Yes, you can store settings, and don't have to run patch cables to multiple racks etc. but essentially the role of the crew and sound engineers/ system technician are the same as when the equipment is analog.
 
#13
IMO, if big shows like that got rid of the subwoofers(blasphemy, I know) they would have much fewer issues with the FOH mix. Since people like to feel like they are being kicked in the chest while at shows, I doubt this is to ever happen.

Anecdote to this, I mix for several bands in lots of places and since I can always get a great sound, many venues are starting to come to me for suggestions when buying new equipment and I always tell them to take the money that they would spend on subs and that part of the system and put it into better speakers. I was mixing at the only place that has listened to me so far one night and the promoter came up to me and said "the low end sounds so good and tight and everything is crisp, what subs are you running?" I turned, smiled and said, "there are no subs, just great speakers and a someone that knows how to eq a room."

lowsound
 
#18
I also was at the Barclays Center on Monday night. And I agree: it was a sonic mud fight. :rolleyes:

dhsierra1 said:
I wonder how hard it would be for the owners of the large indoor venues to spend a little $ and time to do some basic acoustic treatments? Nothing fancy, just take care of the "hot spots".

The sound system technology has come a long way, so just a little effort in the room treatment pays huge dividends in terms of listening pleasure, plus you can then actually turn down the volume a little so as not to overload the room. Lots of good acoustic engineers out there who do this for a living.
Click to expand...

My gut says it could certainly be done - and for a not unreasonable cost. The real question is: How much incentive would venue management have to finance the upgrades - given the fact that muddy sound at large sports arenas is the norm rather than the exception, and that audiences, by and large, have become accustomed to it and accept it?

If the venues can draw the same size audiences, or nearly the same size, without ponying up for the acoustical upgrades, 95 times out of 100, they'll take the cheap way out and forgo the cost of the upgrades.

Solution: Register your dissatisfaction with the sound quality to the venue management - as I already have to the Barclays Center. If - and only if - they receive enough complaints about sound quality, along with pledges to stay away from future concerts until the matter is resolved, will they hearken to the messages...and act! :eyebrow:

MM
 
#19
Years ago I saw Willie Nelson, Asleep at the Wheel and Ray Wylie Hubbard at the Brown County Arena in Green Bay. I'd been to other concerts there, and it was usually what you describe...boomy, echo'y, with guitars, bass and vocals muddy and indistinct. But this night, the sound was crisp, clear with every instrument and voice distinct and large. I walked the entire venue, and there wasn't a bad sound in the arena.

The PA was mostly Karlson cabinets...an old design many decades old, and various treble horns along with some smaller mid cabinets. The volume was high, but all was clear and distinct. I remain impressed as the quality of that concert exceeded most of what I've seen since, soundwise.
 
#20
Their sound sucked north of the 49th as well, the second set was much better, but the first set was meh. Any time the keys came in they ate the entire mix. The snare was also way to quiet in the mix.

It wasn't so much that Rush's sound sucked, it is that it sucked for Rush. I saw them on Snakes and Arrows and they sounded amazing.... in an arena!

For the record, I was on the floor, in the middle, maybe 30 rows back, not far from the sound booth, should have been one of the best sound spots of the night.
 

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back