Double Bass Shadow Rockabilly Pro vs Fishman Platinum Pro vs Other

[jdh3000]

After getting a set of strings and pickup, I had planned on then getting a good preamp that had a phase switch and an hpf.

I was thinking along the lines of the Fishman Platinum Pro, but then I saw someone talking about the Shadow Rockabilly Pro the other day, and it got me to looking into it.

I see that several of you use this as well as others who use the Fishman.

With the Shadow I could forgo buying a separate pickup.

I'm a little confused as to what the Shadow has on it...the hpf (lo cut) seems to only be on the fingerboard side, while there is a subsonic frequency on for the bridge. Does that have a similar effect as an hpf?
Is the phase for the fingerboard or bride or overall?

I'm familiar with the features on the Fishman and they seem pretty straightforward... I have read some reviews here.

I just don't know which would work out better. Indeed the Shadow would be a little more affordable by not having to get a pickup and it's about $20 less to begin with.

I saw one post about someone still experiencing feedback with the Shadow using it in conjunction with an hpf.

I know the F-deck gets a lot of praise here as a good hpf.
I'm wondering if that could be the only thing I really need.

I was also considering the K&K. I understand it's the "go to" for many.

I have a Zoom A3 and would have to use it for channel splitting if I got the Fishman.
It has a pretty good feedback killer that I've used with my EUB, but it's unknown how well it would do live with my DB.
Unfortunately the only hpf it has is for the mic input.

I appreciate advice or thoughts on any of these, or anything else.
I'll probably get my strings and have a setup done in a couple weeks or so, then move onto a preamp.

Thank you!

 

[Don Hergert]

I was also considering the K&K. I understand it's the "go to" for many.

As you know, the K&K 2 channel model I have is pretty bare-bones, it only offers EQ and gain for each channel in the form of adjustable pots inside the box, and volume (aka blending) control for each channel outside the box. But the K&K's advantages are small size, light weight, simplicity and ease of use as a mounted battery operated pre-amp (although K&K offers an AC adapter for it for those who need it).

K&K offers a number of these smaller 1 and 2-channel pre-amp models with and without pickups. There is enough variety that it takes some comparing of specs while deciding which one is needed.

 

[jdh3000]

As you know, the K&K 2 channel model I have is pretty bare-bones, it only offers EQ and gain for each channel in the form of adjustable pots inside the box, and volume (aka blending) control for each channel outside the box. But the K&K's advantages are small size, light weight, simplicity and ease of use as a mounted battery operated pre-amp (although K&K offers an AC adapter for it for those who need it).

K&K offers a number of these smaller 1 and 2-channel pre-amp models with and without pickups. There is enough variety that it takes some comparing of specs while deciding which one is needed.

If I understand correctly the K&K has some sort of internal eq that can be adjusted, something that you would adjust once and leave it.

I may need to give them another look...thanks!

 

[h00v3r]

Doing my broken record thing again: Shadow RB Pro - it has buttons and dials for everything - just keep pressing and twisting things and it'll always get you where you need to be - just be careful because they're not exactly robustly built. The "T" place from Germany usually has the best price that I know of. To my mind, it's worth risking a couple hundred bucks. If you don't like it, just ping me and I'll take it off your hands (I like to keep a spare due to my proclivity to spill beer and step on mine)

 

[Don Hergert]

If I understand correctly the K&K has some sort of internal eq that can be adjusted, something that you would adjust once and leave it.

Yes, those are the "pots" that I was referring to, potentiometers -- little settable dials soldered directly on a circuit board, and you change the settings with a little screwdriver. Inside the box, my K&K Dual Channel Pro ST has bass, mid and treble EQ pots, and a gain pot, for each channel. They're easy to change settings with, and K&K includes a tiny little screwdriver inside the box for you to use with these pots. But for me the beauty of this little pre-amp is that there are only 2 controls to worry about outside of the box while you're playing, those being the volume (aka blend) controls for both channels.

My tone on my DB is pretty well balanced for EQ (I have mounted my bridge wing piezo on the treble side of the bridge), so for both channels I actually leave my internal EQ pots flat and high which gives me plenty of volume headroom, and I leave both of the gain pots at about 20%. If and/or when I need to adjust EQ I do that on my amp, but it's pretty rare.

 

[jdh3000]

Yes, those are the "pots" that I was referring to, potentiometers -- little settable dials soldered directly on a circuit board, and you change the settings with a little screwdriver. Inside the box, my K&K Dual Channel Pro ST has bass, mid and treble EQ pots, and a gain pot, for each channel. They're easy to change settings with, and K&K includes a tiny little screwdriver inside the box for you to use with these pots. But for me the beauty of this little pre-amp is that there are only 2 controls to worry about outside of the box while you're playing, those being the volume (aka blend) controls for both channels.

My tone on my DB is pretty well balanced for EQ (I have mounted my bridge wing piezo on the treble side of the bridge), so for both channels I actually leave my internal EQ pots flat and high which gives me plenty of volume headroom, and I leave both of the gain pots at about 20%. If and/or when I need to adjust EQ I do that on my amp, but it's pretty rare.

Yes I had read that some of these roll out of the factory not set flat like the should be.

I would never want anything internal set any other way but flat.

 

[jdh3000]

Yes, those are the "pots" that I was referring to, potentiometers -- little settable dials soldered directly on a circuit board, and you change the settings with a little screwdriver. Inside the box, my K&K Dual Channel Pro ST has bass, mid and treble EQ pots, and a gain pot, for each channel. They're easy to change settings with, and K&K includes a tiny little screwdriver inside the box for you to use with these pots. But for me the beauty of this little pre-amp is that there are only 2 controls to worry about outside of the box while you're playing, those being the volume (aka blend) controls for both channels.

My tone on my DB is pretty well balanced for EQ (I have mounted my bridge wing piezo on the treble side of the bridge), so for both channels I actually leave my internal EQ pots flat and high which gives me plenty of volume headroom, and I leave both of the gain pots at about 20%. If and/or when I need to adjust EQ I do that on my amp, but it's pretty rare.

A question please about the K&K...how is the battery consumption?

I saw a guy on YouTube who had one on a pedalboard, but it looked like he had it wired to a power supply. To do something like this, would a snap 9v adapter work? I know it doesn't take an adapter directly.

I know most people fasten them to the tailpiece, but I was thinking about pairing this with an Fdeck and just having them side by side, not necessarily on the floor, but on a stand within reach.

Thanks!

 

[Don Hergert]

With my K&K Dual Channel Pro ST, in about 4 years of use I've never had the battery go dead yet. I visibly check it and do a tongue voltage check with this battery before I use it, and I also tend to change this kind of battery out once every year or two, dead or not, so it doesn't begin leaking. The specs say battery power expectation is around 60 hours, but I suspect it's probably longer.

To me the one ease-of-use disadvantage with these pre-amps is that there is no on-off switch -- the power goes on when the mono output lead gets plugged in. So essentially you can't leave the wires plugged in all the time, or you'll eventually kill the battery. For me with a mounted pre-amp that I'd love to just leave plugged in all the time, an external on/off switch -- and a power LED -- would be very handy.

That said, here is the K&K 9V AC power adapter. The pre-amp has a convenient notch for the power cable to run in and out of the box, and the adapter is exactly what you suggest, an adapter that plugs directly into the 9v battery snap socket, so you can't also have the battery plugged in at the same time as you're using the adapter. I could live with that if I needed to plug it in, but I do prefer battery use; I use wireless TX/RC units, so the way I have everything setup, I don't need to run any cables of any kind with either my DB or my battery powered amp.

My pre-amp is mounted out of sight, but in very easy access located on the back side of my bow quiver. To use it while playing (after turning it on by pluging in the mono-output plug) I just slightly reach down with my right hand and adjust the blend, and that's all there is to it.

I also have a mounted dynamic mic (Sennheiser e604), and I do find that I use it more often lately than my Vic's=>K&K system because of the kind of music I'm playing. Since the pandemic began I've been tending to play more volume and tone sensitive music with other acoustic instruments at moderate volume, where feedback isn't an issue and the mic captures tone very nicely. It also works much more nicely with arco. That said, I'm keeping everything ready to use the piezo system whenever I'm playing with electric instruments again.

 

[jdh3000]

With my K&K Dual Channel Pro ST, in about 4 years of use I've never had the battery go dead yet. I visibly check it and do a tongue voltage check with this battery before I use it, and I also tend to change this kind of battery out once every year or two, dead or not, so it doesn't begin leaking. The specs say battery power expectation is around 60 hours, but I suspect it's probably longer.

To me the one ease-of-use disadvantage with these pre-amps is that there is no on-off switch -- the power goes on when the mono output lead gets plugged in. So essentially you can't leave the wires plugged in all the time, or you'll eventually kill the battery. For me with a mounted pre-amp that I'd love to just leave plugged in all the time, an external on/off switch -- and a power LED -- would be very handy.

That said, here is the K&K 9V AC power adapter. The pre-amp has a convenient notch for the power cable to run in and out of the box, and the adapter is exactly what you suggest, an adapter that plugs directly into the 9v battery snap socket, so you can't also have the battery plugged in at the same time as you're using the adapter. I could live with that if I needed to plug it in, but I do prefer battery use; I use wireless TX/RC units, so the way I have everything setup, I don't need to run any cables of any kind with either my DB or my battery powered amp.

My pre-amp is mounted out of sight, but in very easy access located on the back side of my bow quiver. To use it while playing (after turning it on by pluging in the mono-output plug) I just slightly reach down with my right hand and adjust the blend, and that's all there is to it.

I also have a mounted dynamic mic (Sennheiser e604), and I do find that I use it more often lately than my Vic's=>K&K system because of the kind of music I'm playing. Since the pandemic began I've been tending to play more volume and tone sensitive music with other acoustic instruments at moderate volume, where feedback isn't an issue and the mic captures tone very nicely. It also works much more nicely with arco. That said, I'm keeping everything ready to use the piezo system whenever I'm playing with electric instruments again.

Yes I'd most likely get the adapter, I appreciate the link!

I'm still trying to decide what I'm going to do within my budget.

I was planning om using my zoom a3 for this aplication, just splitting the signal and putting the bridge in the piezo input and the neck in the xlr/1/4 i put, but I don't know if the impedence will match for the neck.

Thanks for your help!

 

[Don Hergert]

You may have seen comments about this in other TB/DB threads, but some people are able to collect a strong enough slap sound with just their single bridge wing piezo setup without having a separate fingerboard pickup. Because it's a 2 piezo pickup, I suspect that the [Invalid or Expired Link Removed] might do that for you, in fact this is even alluded to on their Model B web page...

If that worked for you and your DB-and-amp combination, you might not even need a pre-amp -- you wouldn't get blending, but you'd save a fair amount of money. I'm pretty sure it doesn't work that way with every DB-and-amp combination, so you'd have to try it out and see if yours would work that way.

You might even exchange email with Zac Victor (Vic) and see if he might let you buy a Model B to try it, and if it doesn't work for both your string and your slap tones, return it with a little more money for a [Invalid or Expired Link Removed]. I've personally worked with Zac in the past and his service and customer care ethics are remarkable (and I've seen similar experiences discussed here a lot).

 

[jdh3000]

Thank you for the advice!

I've read something about someone using s Fishman full circle and being able to hear the click. I was kind of thinking about being able to control the amount of click going out though.

If I go the "B style" pickup I'll definitely get in contact with Vic tp see if we can do that. It could actually do what I want.

BTW, I am going to most likely need some sort of preamp because I'm goig to be sharing the amp with my BG. Eveything is flat on the amp and I have a preamp for the BG. I woud need to be able to match them.

Thanks again!

 

[DoubleMIDI]

If a single bridge wing pickup works for the slap might also depend on the type of strings you use. So do the test with strings you like to play acoustically for your type of music.

 

[bassically_eli]

After getting a set of strings and pickup, I had planned on then getting a good preamp that had a phase switch and an hpf.

I was thinking along the lines of the Fishman Platinum Pro, but then I saw someone talking about the Shadow Rockabilly Pro the other day, and it got me to looking into it.

I see that several of you use this as well as others who use the Fishman.

With the Shadow I could forgo buying a separate pickup.

I'm a little confused as to what the Shadow has on it...the hpf (lo cut) seems to only be on the fingerboard side, while there is a subsonic frequency on for the bridge. Does that have a similar effect as an hpf?
Is the phase for the fingerboard or bride or overall?

I'm familiar with the features on the Fishman and they seem pretty straightforward... I have read some reviews here.

I just don't know which would work out better. Indeed the Shadow would be a little more affordable by not having to get a pickup and it's about $20 less to begin with.

I saw one post about someone still experiencing feedback with the Shadow using it in conjunction with an hpf.

I know the F-deck gets a lot of praise here as a good hpf.
I'm wondering if that could be the only thing I really need.

I was also considering the K&K. I understand it's the "go to" for many.

I have a Zoom A3 and would have to use it for channel splitting if I got the Fishman.
It has a pretty good feedback killer that I've used with my EUB, but it's unknown how well it would do live with my DB.
Unfortunately the only hpf it has is for the mic input.

I appreciate advice or thoughts on any of these, or anything else.
I'll probably get my strings and have a setup done in a couple weeks or so, then move onto a preamp.

Thank you!

You can use the parametric EQ effect on the Zoom A3 as an HPF. Set the frequency to 20hz (that's as low as it will go), the Q=1 or 2, and use the gain to control the amount of low cut.

 

[jdh3000]

If a single bridge wing pickup works for the slap might also depend on the type of strings you use. So do the test with strings you like to play acoustically for your type of music.

Yes, I need to get my new stings on there first, then I'll better be able to tell what I need.

Thanks!

 

[jdh3000]

You can use the parametric EQ effect on the Zoom A3 as an HPF. Set the frequency to 20hz (that's as low as it will go), the Q=1 or 2, and use the gain to control the amount of low cut.

I actually have an Empress ParaEq that I'm not using. I was was going to try to use it to roll off some boom.

After the setup and a soundpost adjustment, I should be able to tell what's going on qith it.

Thanks!