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Signal chain / path integrity and multiple pedals

SamJ

SamJ

Founder - Fender MIA Club
Apr 22, 2006
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#1
So I was wondering if anyone has done any sort of test of the fidelity (noise level) of the signal that's coming from, say, a passive bass or even an active bass when it's passed through multiple pedals... Pre-amp pedals, Gain boost pedals, tuners, compressors, etc.. This assumes you're putting your pedal board directly into the front end of your amp's pre-amp, and not in the effects loop return of course.

The more pedals in the chain the higher the noise? And how audible is that noise to the human ear?

What I've found with my 4 to 5 pedals is that I sometimes have to raise the output of the pedals closest to the original output (the bass) more and that gradually is reduced until the final pedal which has flat gain.. The metric I use is the input gain of the amp, and how much I have to set that (the position o'clock) vs when I input the bass directly into the amp, totally bypassing the pedals.. my goal is for that gain knob to be set exactly the same.

What are you all doing?
 
#3
Michedelic said:
I would think that it would depend on the quality/specs/buffering of the individual pedals used, and the quality of your connector cables, rather than quantity.
Click to expand...

factoring out that part (I'm using Mogami gold connectors, and DarkGlass, MXR and Spaceman pedals), the question is how do you insure the proper signal quality? It comes down to the input and output settings I'm guessing... but how do you know when you've begun to distort the signal? I guess you can get an oscilloscope lol?
 
#4
SamJ said:
factoring out that part (I'm using Mogami gold connectors, and DarkGlass, MXR and Spaceman pedals), the question is how do you insure the proper signal quality? It comes down to the input and output settings I'm guessing... but how do you know when you've begun to distort the signal? I guess you can get an oscilloscope lol?
Click to expand...
Maybe using a buffer pedal at the start of the chain?
 
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#6
The chap at Vertex effects always recommends high quality input and output buffers when talking about guitar pedals. With an active bass this is less of an issue on the input, as it's an active bass. The signal is already a lot higher so shouldn't suffer from capacitance roll-off like a passive bass will. Are all/most of your pedals true-bypass?
 
#7
CMallett said:
The chap at Vertex effects always recommends high quality input and output buffers when talking about guitar pedals. With an active bass this is less of an issue on the input, as it's an active bass. The signal is already a lot higher so shouldn't suffer from capacitance roll-off like a passive bass will. Are all/most of your pedals true-bypass?
Click to expand...

yes, all are true bypass...
 
#8
Darkglass pedals are notorious for being incredibly finicky about power supplies and are, in my experience, very noisy. When I was still using a B7K I threw a noise gate on the end of my signal chain, nothing else worked.
 
#9
Obese Chess said:
Darkglass pedals are notorious for being incredibly finicky about power supplies and incredibly noisy. When I was still using a B7K I threw a noise gate on the end of my signal chain, nothing else worked.
Click to expand...

I will say there is a bit (and I mean a tiny bit) more noise now with the addition of the two DarkGlass... The Spaceman (true bypass) is dead silent, as is the MXR.
 
#11
SamJ said:
how do you insure the proper signal quality
Click to expand...
Don't use pedals?

I seriously struggle with hissing whenever I add any dirt greater than an octave pedal. Between the fact that most effects get buried in the live mix anyway and the fact that forgetting to check any one knob on your brings chaos, I keep my chain limited to always on (compressor & HPF/LPF) + octave. Octave is rarely used.
 
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#12
Yes, here is what you do:

Plug your bass directly into the amp, and check how it sounds. Then, run your bass through the amp, and check how it sounds? Any difference in gain or noise that you notice is the difference caused by your pedals.

Most of the time there is no difference when I try this, but I've had a couple of pedals get booted off the board because of a clear difference in signal.
 
#13
My thoughts are that regardless of the quality of the pedal, each pedal will have an amount of noise that is inherent and unique to that pedal. Some are noticeable and some may add a trivial amount, but it is still there. So there are variables that you can't account for. In any case, proper gain staging at every pedal that has gain adjustments is critical to minimizing the nose. You should, in theory, be able to turn on any or all pedals with no (unwanted) change in total output gain.

I adjust gain by playing the with the pedal off and then turn it on and compare the the two sound levels.
 
#14
Not helpful, but people in the 60's, 70's, 80's and 90's just played. I never remember a discussion in those years (my gen was the 80's and 90's) about noise in pedals. We all just used what we had and got on with life. I respectfully suggest to the OP that this is the Zen way and should be heeded.
 
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