Signal Splitting And Changing Blend Through Technique (Not Knobs)

[Matthew_84]

I'd like to take my bass's mono signal, and split it into two different paths (one fairly clean with a bass boost/treble cut; and the other kind of dirty with a bass cut/treble boost) and blend them back into one mono signal into the amp.

If I were to setup a fairly equal blend of the two when I played in between the pickups, could I adjust the blend (making one channel seem louder, and the other sounding quieter) by playing closer to the bridge or closer to the neck (depending if I want a dirtier tone, or a cleaner one)?

I realize this would work better with a stereo wired bass (like the Rick-O-Sound feature of a Rickenbacker 4003), or if I used a crossover pedal to split the signals based on a certain frequency, but would it still work with the initial scenario?

Thanks.

 

[Tom Bomb]

One of Invalid Link Removed would get it done, in a roundabout way.

[…] The potentiometers are in the signal path when output A and B are active simultaneously, and the volume of the two amps [signals] can be balanced - producing a third sound you've never heard before! Output T, basically intended for instrument tuners, can also be used for a third amp or for a second channel for amp B, opening up even more potentials.[… emphasis added.]

This may not perfectly suit your needs but the good thing is, there are plenty of other uses for a dual - like pistols at dawn I'm doing stuff like using two combos, signal preamping, into a small mixer - so either signal can be shaped, effected - stereo or mono, any-which-way, then buffered, blended and or switched, with one good stomp, into any output scenario you can dream up, including two, or more, very different rigs.

I'm sure there'll be easier ways to solve your problem, but who said life was meant to be easy

 

[Matthew_84]

One of Invalid Link Removed would get it done, in a roundabout way.

This may not perfectly suit your needs but the good thing is, there are plenty of other uses for a dual - like pistols at dawn I'm doing stuff like using two combos, signal preamping, into a small mixer - so either signal can be shaped, effected - stereo or mono, any-which-way, then buffered, blended and or switched, with one good stomp, into any output scenario you can dream up, including two, or more, very different rigs.

I'm sure there'll be easier ways to solve your problem, but who said life was meant to be easy

Hi Tom, thanks for your response.

I've read your post a couple of times, but I'm not quite sure you understood my question.

My question wasn't about how to split the signal, but rather how to change the balance of the two channels by simply changing where I plucked the strings (closer to the neck, or bridge).

This device seems like just a signal splitter to me, but perhaps I'm mistaken?

 

[Tom Bomb]

Yeah. Forgive me, Matt. It was the "signal splitter" part that sent me off on my tangent.

I guess "roundabout" was my cue that I wasn't going to be too helpful. I didn't give it enough thought. What you're trying to do is beyond me. But sound-wise, there's a rough equivalence. My way, I don't need to alter my attack, so much - for me, it's just the flick of a switch. I'll have another think about it. Hope you get it done somehow, despite my interference. I'm sure you'll get there, if you put your mind to it. Sorry I couldn't help.

 

[Matthew_84]

Yeah. Forgive me, Matt. It was the "signal splitter" part that sent me off on my tangent.

I guess "roundabout" was my cue that I wasn't going to be too helpful. I didn't give it enough thought. What you're trying to do is beyond me. But sound-wise, there's a rough equivalence. My way, I don't need to alter my attack, so much - for me, it's just the flick of a switch. I'll have another think about it. Hope you get it done somehow, despite my interference. I'm sure you'll get there, if you put your mind to it. Sorry I couldn't help.

Hey Tom, don't worry about it!

I appreciate you taking the time to respond anyway, and I think I also know I'm going to split the signal, but I like that unit has a Tuner Out, so I may end up going with that, if I go a different route.

It seems like what I was hoping for is somewhat plausible, but I am not sure I'll get as big of a difference if I simply altered the blend by spinning a knob or two...

I personally prefer to "set it and forget it" and alter my technique to get my tone rather than spinning a bunch of knobs, but I also am looking for some clean, strong, punchy lows, with some clanky, distorted highs. I do think it would likely work better with a stereo wired bass as then one channel would definitely get more volume than the other, but I don't have too much spare coin at the moment.

 

[chaak]

i use One Control Tri-loop pedal [Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

there is the Xotic effects X-blender as well

what i do is i run my bass through Radial JDI to the mixing board/soundcard (active monitors) and then through effects chain to amp then a D.I. from amp to the mixing board /soundcard. two channels of bass one effected other clean

 

[Matthew_84]

i use One Control Tri-loop pedal [Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

there is the Xotic effects X-blender as well

what i do is i run my bass through Radial JDI to the mixing board/soundcard (active monitors) and then through effects chain to amp then a D.I. from amp to the mixing board /soundcard. two channels of bass one effected other clean

Thanks, that looks like a pretty cool pedal as well, but doesn't answer my question...

Is it really that hard to read the second paragraph in an OP? Lol.

I'm going to change the thread title, maybe that will help.

 

[Rev. Cornelius]

If I were to setup a fairly equal blend of the two when I played in between the pickups, could I adjust the blend (making one channel seem louder, and the other sounding quieter) by playing closer to the bridge or closer to the neck (depending if I want a dirtier tone, or a cleaner one)?

I don't believe this would work without the bass being wired in stereo. You are asking the splitter to split the signal by frequency.
On the other hand, you could split the signal, run a 2 channel clean/dirty to a blend control to your amp. Maybe this could be made to work Volume Pedals | Ernie Ball.

Thanks

 

[Tom Bomb]

Depending on the instrument you're using, you could whack a piezo under-saddle pickup in, or something like that - even something like this maybe, which might make life much easier, saving all the bass rewiring - and then use that independent signal.

A JDI Duplex would be another way to harness those signals. Being Canadian gear, that could work out cheaper. There's obviously more in store (and more $, in-$tore), potentially, I imagine (NFI really) - like wiring harnesses, pots, caps, switches, transformers, outboard gear etc.. That stereo pedal from the Reverend's link looks like fun - Volume Pedals | Ernie Ball. Or one of these -
Invalid Link Removed - pedals may suffice, for blending.

 

[Rich Fiscus]

Hi Tom, thanks for your response.

I've read your post a couple of times, but I'm not quite sure you understood my question.

My question wasn't about how to split the signal, but rather how to change the balance of the two channels by simply changing where I plucked the strings (closer to the neck, or bridge).

This device seems like just a signal splitter to me, but perhaps I'm mistaken?

I think the problem is that the terminology you're using is confusing because it's not conceptually accurate. Assuming a typical (ie Jazz Bass style) 2 pickup setup, the individual pickups can't be treated as discrete channels because they're not electrically isolated from each other.

To answer your question, though, the answer is yes and no. Yes, you can change the tone by moving your plucking hand, and yes, it will be similar to the effect from boosting one pickup or the other, but no, it won't be the same. In either case, the change is a combination of pickup sensing/interaction and the physics of string vibration and harmonic content, each of which are fairly complex on their own.

In any case, moving your plucking hand is a great tool to have in your toolbox. However, I think of it more as a tool for adding tonal complexity, rather than simply being an extension of the volume knobs.

 

[lz4005]

I'd like to take my bass's mono signal, and split it into two different paths (one fairly clean with a bass boost/treble cut; and the other kind of dirty with a bass cut/treble boost) and blend them back into one mono signal into the amp.

If I were to setup a fairly equal blend of the two when I played in between the pickups, could I adjust the blend (making one channel seem louder, and the other sounding quieter) by playing closer to the bridge or closer to the neck (depending if I want a dirtier tone, or a cleaner one)?

No. It doesn't work that way. If you're sending out a mono signal and splitting it outside the instrument any tone changes you make by moving your hands to different places will impact both signals identically. Regardless of what effects and amps they're plugged into.

 

[Matthew_84]

Thanks guys, I figured it was a long shot... I was just hopeful that if
I played closer to the neck, the channel with a bass boost/treble cut would become louder than the channel setup for the bass cut/treble boost, but it is pretty obvious to me now that the volume for each channel would be the same, only the EQ of each channel would be effected.

Thanks again.

 

[Tom Bomb]

Thanks guys, I figured it was a long shot... I was just hopeful that if
I played closer to the neck, the channel with a bass boost/treble cut would become louder than the channel setup for the bass cut/treble boost, but it is pretty obvious to me now that the volume for each channel would be the same, only the EQ of each channel would be effected.

Thanks again.

Admiring your spirit, OP Don't give up on this. Ideal position is a fundamental awareness in good acoustic music, in the addressing of an instrument. Bringing power into the equation, it'll always somehow be a remove to the less aware but, sometimes, can be a divine re-imagining , accidental or otherwise - an echo of an essence.

 

[HaphAsSard]

I realize this would work better with a stereo wired bass (like the Rick-O-Sound feature of a Rickenbacker 4003), or if I used a crossover pedal to split the signals based on a certain frequency, but would it still work with the initial scenario?

Unless some kind of digital thingamajig exists that smartly senses the change in tone from the mono signal and gradually directs the splitted one to either side, the answer is no. It's either stereo wiring or, as you said, a crossover. In the latter case finding the correct xover frequency, assuming one correct one existed, might be tricky; also, since each pickup does have a wideish range, both would have part of the signal affected by the dirty path. Still, plucking in different positions (beside the normal variation in tone) would indeed get you a different ratio of clean vs. dirty in the recombined signal. An interesting solution (just spitballing here) might be to also split (A/B-style this time, not lo/hi) the high-passed signal before the distorsion stage and have the clean high path run through a sub-harmonic generator before it being recombined with the other two (the low-passed clean and the high dirty). Each time you'd be plucking towards the bridge to get more dirt you wouldn't lose too much bottom this way (as overdrive naturally does, by adding harmonics and change the tonal balance) - of course you'd want to adjust the signal with added low octaves to a tasty level, just a whiff. Again, just a thought.