Single coil pups vs double coil..What should I expect?

[DiabolusInMusic]

There ARE noise-free single coil pickups out there. Some might argue they don't have quite the mojo a true single coil have, but some of them have been very well received by jazz bass players.

No, they are not a strictly speaking "single coil." However, they are a SC for factor that, accordance to many, have a single coil sound with a single coil form factor.

So what you're saying is that there are no noise free single-coil pickups?



Lindy Fralins cop the single coil sound pretty good to my ears, as with a few other manufacturers, but they are all dual coil pickups.

 

[TomB]

Nice to get the update on good-sounding J-type dual-coils. I loved the Fralin P-pickup, never tried their SC. Someday maybe I'll spring for a Wilde or Nordstrand J-set just to see. ...or maybe I'll just keep living with my noisy Fender rwound '64's. They were wound by Peter Florence of Ludlow Guitar NYC (or he was there, anyway) and then "refurbed" by John Kallas (fellow TB'er). They sure sound good!

 

[wmhill]

this is my fave configuration - dual humbuckers (dual coils) that are split-able to CBCsingle coil. you have your choice of north/south coil or HB in each pickup. A ton of useful sounds at your finger tips.
[Bartolini MMCBC4]

 

[TomB]

Ah yes, coil-splitting! Can you have your cake and eat it too? I have that choice available on my G&L L1500 (K-mod?) The SC mode is no noisier than any other. Is that perhaps because the pickup has dual coils?

 

[bassbenj]

Ah yes, coil-splitting! Can you have your cake and eat it too? I have that choice available on my G&L L1500 (K-mod?) The SC mode is no noisier than any other. Is that perhaps because the pickup has dual coils?

Actually the SC mode is noisier. Perhaps you've just not been in a noisy environment.

On my L2500 with K-mod when both pickups are in SC and both are on it is dead quiet (same deal as a Jazz bass with both bridge and neck on full) but if you switch to just one pickup either neck or bridge in SC mode, you can immediately hear the hum come up.

 

[TomB]

Actually the SC mode is noisier. Perhaps you've just not been in a noisy environment.

On my L2500 with K-mod when both pickups are in SC and both are on it is dead quiet (same deal as a Jazz bass with both bridge and neck on full) but if you switch to just one pickup either neck or bridge in SC mode, you can immediately hear the hum come up.

I'll check that out! It's true, I haven't listened close to the SC setting in a quiet environment, more typically it's on stage in the middle of a set. Also, I haven't yet (don't know if I will) use the L-1500 in a studio setting. I wondered if the 2nd coil acts as a "dummy coil". It sounds like you're saying no. That's important to the O.P., as I would expect his pickups have a similar design to the MFD's and similar capabilities for re-wiring.

 

[Teacher]

So what you're saying is that there are no noise free single-coil pickups?



Lindy Fralins cop the single coil sound pretty good to my ears, as with a few other manufacturers, but they are all dual coil pickups.

Of course they are dual coil. But for the OP's purpose, they are what fits the bill.

 

[Watchootognbout]

All my basses have had 2 double coil pups on them (w/ active electronics). They have punch and definition with plentiful bottom end, heavy without being too muddy, and I have achieved great stage sound with these basses. I would however like to clean up the mud a bit more. What kind of sound characteristics would I get from a bass with a single coil at the bridge and a split coil at the neck? Better definition? Would I be losing some of that bottom end? Or do they just give a bright jazzy tone? General application will be extreme metal (and yes it does matter, people actually do hear me on stage).

Change nothing.
Get one of these.

 

[Ellery]

Change nothing.
Get one of these.View attachment 817256

That's a preamp...would I plug this into the input or directly into the fx return? Thanx for the suggest, it does look nice, sure don't look cheap!

 

[Ellery]

Change nothing.
Get one of these.View attachment 817256

Wow I checked online these are way less expensive than the SansAmp I was looking at a while ago. So these are pretty good huh?

 

[bassbenj]

I'll check that out! It's true, I haven't listened close to the SC setting in a quiet environment, more typically it's on stage in the middle of a set. Also, I haven't yet (don't know if I will) use the L-1500 in a studio setting. I wondered if the 2nd coil acts as a "dummy coil". It sounds like you're saying no. That's important to the O.P., as I would expect his pickups have a similar design to the MFD's and similar capabilities for re-wiring.

It's not quite clear what the OP has, but as I interpret what he's talking about he seems to have a humbucker at the neck and wants to know about a single coil at the bridge. I suspect his humbucker is like a Roscoe Beck pickup which is basically two Jazz pickups glued together side by side. He's asking if he uses a singe coil at the bridge and splits the coils in the humbucker what happens? Well, it depends on WHICH coil you use in splitting the humbucker. If you pick the correct coil then the bridge SC and the split coil act as a humbucker pair just as in a SC jazz bass with both pickups on full. If you pick the wrong coil it's hum city.

Of course, if you look at an MFD pickup they look very much like two jazz pickups side by side too, but in truth they are not quite. So when you split those coils and choose one in each pickup (in my L2500) if you don't want hum you must choose wisely. The no-hum choice is "inside coils" and "outside coils" . This means that you either choose the coils in the pickups that are closest to each other (makes it tend to sound like a stingray) or farthest from each other (tends to make it sound like Jazz bass). I used to have a switch where I could choose either setup, but I used "outside coils" so much I took it off. Flipping the K-mod on means that each pickup more or less is only looking at a single position on the strings rather than two of them. This gives a more clear bell-like tone.

But I say "more or less" because MFD pickups are NOT like two jazz pickups side by side. There is magnetic leakage from one coil to the other. You can prove this by going into single coil mode and tapping on the poles with a paper clip or small screwdriver. The chosen coil will give a loud click. But the other coil will ALSO give a click but just not as loud. What this means is that the K-mod does not give quite as pure a tone as the true Single coil but it also means that it doesn't have quite as much hum as a true single coil. So it kind of balances out.

 

[Ellery]

It's not quite clear what the OP has, but as I interpret what he's talking about he seems to have a humbucker at the neck and wants to know about a single coil at the bridge. I suspect his humbucker is like a Roscoe Beck pickup which is basically two Jazz pickups glued together side by side. He's asking if he uses a singe coil at the bridge and splits the coils in the humbucker what happens? Well, it depends on WHICH coil you use in splitting the humbucker. If you pick the correct coil then the bridge SC and the split coil act as a humbucker pair just as in a SC jazz bass with both pickups on full. If you pick the wrong coil it's hum city.

Of course, if you look at an MFD pickup they look very much like two jazz pickups side by side too, but in truth they are not quite. So when you split those coils and choose one in each pickup (in my L2500) if you don't want hum you must choose wisely. The no-hum choice is "inside coils" and "outside coils" . This means that you either choose the coils in the pickups that are closest to each other (makes it tend to sound like a stingray) or farthest from each other (tends to make it sound like Jazz bass). I used to have a switch where I could choose either setup, but I used "outside coils" so much I took it off. Flipping the K-mod on means that each pickup more or less is only looking at a single position on the strings rather than two of them. This gives a more clear bell-like tone.

But I say "more or less" because MFD pickups are NOT like two jazz pickups side by side. There is magnetic leakage from one coil to the other. You can prove this by going into single coil mode and tapping on the poles with a paper clip or small screwdriver. The chosen coil will give a loud click. But the other coil will ALSO give a click but just not as loud. What this means is that the K-mod does not give quite as pure a tone as the true Single coil but it also means that it doesn't have quite as much hum as a true single coil. So it kind of balances out.

FYI 2 of my basses came stock with EMG-HZ pups at the neck & bridge. The 3rd is the same but they have no logo, no name. I am considering buying a bass w/ single coil pups if it could give sound that I like.

 

[Snaxster]

There ARE noise-free single coil pickups out there. Some might argue they don't have quite the mojo a true single coil have, but some of them have been very well received by jazz bass players.

Could you name some names? Thx.

Wilde J-45, for example

Are you certain the Wilde's are single-coil? Bill's site calls them "air-gap noiseless", which sounds like a dual coil (similar to Fender, et al). If you're right though, then I'm interested!

No, they are not a strictly speaking "single coil." However, they are a SC for factor that, accordance to many, have a single coil sound with a single coil form factor.

In terms of sonics and electrical design, Wilde J-45 are not anything like single coil pickups; neither strictly speaking, nor loosely speaking, or by any definition. Though J-45 pickups sound great, they do not sound like single coil pickups. (Yes, I do own a set of J-45 pickups.) "form factor" has nothing to do with it. Does "form factor" mean that the pickup will fit in a conventional route? Then there are rail pickups that employ that form factor, but decidedly they do not sound like single coil pickups.

Single coil pickups normally are not noisy. However, they are always prone to hum (EMI). Thus there are no hum-free single coil pickups. That's what all the fuss is about. (I know, I know... nowadays everyone uses the term "noise" to describe any undesirable sonic artifact in audio. But it is useful to understand the difference between various causes and their respective audible effects.)

Even the sound of the venerable RWRP format split-coil Precision Bass pickup design is a compromise between hum cancellation and a loss of some frequencies due to comb filtering (or something), however slight.

Not even the most skillful pickup designers can make a hum-canceling Jazz Bass-type or SCPB-type pickup that sounds like a true single coil pickup, and the honest ones will admit it if pressed.

In the matter of the characteristic sonics of single coil pickups, there is no "mojo". There is only sound.

After decades of not paying much attention to the pickups aspect of bass guitar, when recently finally I heard myself playing single coil Jazz Bass pickups and recognized the characteristic sound, thereafter I could neither un-hear it in my playing or others', nor ever again accept that approximations of it could be substitutes for the real thing. It is not a measure of what sounds better or worse; it is a measure of what is authentic.

 

[40Hz]

If it's just a clearer tone you're after, you could try increasing the distance between the pickups and the strings by lowering the height of the pickups.

You sacrifice some signal level in return for a clearer sound. But since boosting the input level is what amplifiers are for, it's easy to compensate for that with the gain or volume knob.

Try lowering both pickups evenly. Try a quarter turn at a time and see if that "mud" goes away.

Just be sure to adjust both sides of both pickups the same amount when you lower the height so you won't have to rebalance them.

And keep track of how much you've lowered them so you can easily set them back to their original height if you don't like the sound.

Luck!

 

[Ellery]

If it's just a clearer tone you're after, you could try increasing the distance between the pickups and the strings by lowering the height of the pickups.

You sacrifice some signal level in return for a clearer sound. But since boosting the input level is what amplifiers are for, it's easy to compensate for that with the gain or volume knob.

Try lowering both pickups evenly. Try a quarter turn at a time and see if that "mud" goes away.

Just be sure to adjust both sides of both pickups the same amount when you lower the height so you won't have to rebalance them.

And keep track of how much you've lowered them so you can easily set them back to their original height if you don't like the sound.

Luck!

Wow thanx I never even thought of that