So wait... mid scoops are bad?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Mike Money, Sep 20, 2004.

  1. Mike Money

    Mike Money Banned

    Mar 18, 2003
    Bakersfield California
    Avatar Speakers Endorsing Hooligan
    All this time I thought mid scoops were your best friend in cutting through...

    But no?

    Its all about mid-boost? which sounds like butt?
  2. What sounds like butt is ...

    "either / or," when the "room / stage" seems to like the opposite. IOW:

    Play, and listen to the room.... it (the sonic environment ) will determine if mids are too hot or too cold.
  3. Samurai


    Sep 13, 2003
    I see three question marks, but it doesn't sound like you are asking anything. What exactly is your post about. Ideas on how to stand out in the mix better?
  4. I know what you're saying. A lot of people here seem to think that the sound that sounds best alone doesn't sound best in a band context. You need to make that determination on your own, or trust the advice of someone in the house who can hear. I don't like mids in my bass sound, but listen to everything and see if the sound you like is being heard in the mix. If it is- follow what you believe in and what you experience, not what you read, but really listen.

  5. IvanMike

    IvanMike Player Characters fear me... Staff Member Supporting Member

    Nov 10, 2002
    Middletown CT, USA
    it is true that your ears should be the final judge but............
    mids are what people hear the best
    the audience may hear the attack of your highs to a point, and they may feel your lows, but they will hear the mids.
    don't belive me?
    have a friend play in a full on band setting with the mids cut, flat, and slightly boosted
  6. jeff schmidt

    jeff schmidt no longer red carded, but my butt is still sore.

    Aug 27, 2004
    Novato, CA
    mid scoops = bad.

    for me. :p
  7. IvanMike

    IvanMike Player Characters fear me... Staff Member Supporting Member

    Nov 10, 2002
    Middletown CT, USA
    dance away jeff, dance away............i hear the groove..................and it has mids............ :p
  8. Jackson E

    Jackson E Supporting Member

    Aug 20, 2004
    East Nashville, Tn.
    Sorry but that was funny as hell.
  9. Try boosting around the 1.6khz this allows the bass to standout without losing the clarity and bottom end. I to was having the mid scooped problem in our band, as well as ultra low bass, sounded great on my own but with drums and guitar it was a boomy load of mud. Reduced the ultra low and boosted the 1.6khz and now it rocks.
  10. cetera


    Apr 29, 2004
    Surrey, England
    Endorsing Artist: Spector Basses & Cort Basses
    Oh yes! :)

    Mids are where it's at... :bassist: :cool:
  11. General rule: Take the sound you love in your bedroom, and do the exact opposite when you play live. That might be an exaggeration, but it's not far from the truth. I have found that for me, a boost around 600Hz will let people feel and hear more of the bass.

    The sound that works well on stage will sound a little muddy in your bedroom.
  12. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    It is worth noting that there are good mids and bad mids. From my experience, it seems that there is more variance from gear to gear in how midrange is reproduced than in either the low end or the high end. For instance: I can't find another bass that can match the darkish yet clear mids of my Thunderbird. The preamps at show a lot of variety in the mids. Among some of the better amps that I have tried (WWU, Thunderfunk, iAMP 800, Walkabout), the mids seem to vary the most (though there are certainly other distinctions). And it really shines through with cabs. With all else being equal, mids that would sound sucky (to my ears, at least) through a 410XLT (an excellent cab, and just the ticket for many cats), sound killer (again, to my liking) through a VL-208 (the midrange king, IMHO). As I have been experimenting with more and more cabs, I find myself leaning towards cabs with great midrange (EA and Accugroove cabs, mostly, although certain cabs from ACME, Epifani and Bergantino also really float my boat).

    So, while a discussion of general preference for mid-cut, mid-boost, or relatively flat mids is certainly worthwhile, keep in mind that all mids are not created equal!

    Later, Tom.
  13. i have found that, despite differing mid reproduction in my different pieces of gear, i prefer the sound of mids. in fact, unlike most people, my bedroom tone keeps the mids -- i rarely ever like a scooped sound.

    i have found my bergantino HT-112 to be the sweetest sounding cab i've ever played when it comes to mids. it's so articulate and smooth. that is why i love it so.

  14. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    North central Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    And that is why an HT112 and an EX112 are on their way to join the "arsenal!" :D:bassist:
  15. Larzito


    Aug 1, 2000
    Dallas, Texas
    I eats em for brakfast lunch and dinner. Seriously, I understand the struggle between the beefy mid scoope and the quest for sweet mid range. The classic GK mid scoope button on the 800 is a good example. It can pump you lows to juicy goodness, but suck the life out of your mids, especially on the D and G string. GK now has a variable scoope knob on their later does Eden, SWR, etc. this allows for more or less scoope, depending on the situation. I rarely scoope the mids, but I'm mostly a fingerstyle player now. Back when I thought I was Flea, I used the scoope a lot...depends on the sound you are after. But you have to have SOME mids to cut throught the band. Finding the mid sweet spot is your quest. Interesting post above about a lot of the high end cab mfgr's treatment of mids...I have found some of the "flat" sounding cabs to lack cut-through and definition in a band setting...but my conclusion is- personally, for my taste, I like a touch of low mid hump...adds midrange cut-through without being clanky or nasal snarly.
  16. Joe P

    Joe P

    Jul 15, 2004
    Milwaukee, WI
    Yup. I see what y'all mean. I find that setting the 'best sound' - speaking EQ-wise - for the B and E strings leaves the other three sounding lifeless. It's because I end up scooping-out the low-mids too much.

    I'm learning - I'm learning the most from TalkBASS.

    Thanks all,

  17. xcental34x


    Feb 28, 2003
    Memphrica, TN
    I like my mids like I like my ice cream....boosted!

    j/k. scooped.
  18. Luckydog

    Luckydog Supporting Member

    Dec 25, 1999
    For me, mids help cut through in my loud classic rock band. Best combination I have found for a thick, very audible tone with plenty of bottom, is a Fender Precision and Ampeg SVT. Gets the job done every time. Most of the bands that I hear where the bassist uses a lot of mid scoop, particularly with bright strainless strings and active electronics, it is very hard to hear anything but ping ping ping. There is no bottom, and overall the band sounds weak and harsh
  19. Alexander


    Aug 13, 2001
    Seattle, WA
    Mids are where it's at for me too. Just a little boost somewhere between 400-600hz does the trick. And yes, the Bergs are quite tasty...
  20. RAM


    May 10, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    For me, mids define my tone. Treble only defines the attack, but doesn't do anything for the fundamental. Bass muddies the fundamental, in and of itself.

    Being a purely fingerstyle player, I rely heavily on mids (slightly boosted around 3500 Hz to 500 Hz, depending on bass and cab) allows faster runs to cut through clearly.