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Some questions about aluminum

S

Sardine

Feb 2, 2009
114
1
Maine
#1
I have recently been thinking about the possibilities of aluminum in instrument making, possibly for necks. However, my knowledge of aluminum is pretty scant. I know another member here made a fretless guitar with a cast neck, but I've been toying with the possibility of a neck shaped from a solid billet with a wooden fingerboard. My worries are about the sensitivity of aluminum to temperature changes. Can anyone tell me how susceptible 6061 T6 aluminum is to movement due to temp. changes? I.E., if I make a neck out of this, will I be retuning constantly, or is this grade pretty stable?

Also, I recall reading that aluminum can be polished for a high gloss finish, but I've also read that it can turn your hands funny colors.:eyebrow: Does a polished surface still stain skin, or will it need some kind of coating?

Thanks,
Rob
 
#2
I can tell you that old Kramer & Travis Bean aluminum neck guitars had a finish - mine shure did. My neck was odd - the metal wasn't shiny, it was dull - -looked like a factory defect, but the bass played better than the other ones I tried so...

I can't say much about which flavor or aluminum you want to use - but if you do some googling on Kramer and how they did things, you should get some answers.
 
#3
Sardine said:
I have recently been thinking about the possibilities of aluminum in instrument making, possibly for necks. However, my knowledge of aluminum is pretty scant. I know another member here made a fretless guitar with a cast neck, but I've been toying with the possibility of a neck shaped from a solid billet with a wooden fingerboard. My worries are about the sensitivity of aluminum to temperature changes. Can anyone tell me how susceptible 6061 T6 aluminum is to movement due to temp. changes? I.E., if I make a neck out of this, will I be retuning constantly, or is this grade pretty stable?

Also, I recall reading that aluminum can be polished for a high gloss finish, but I've also read that it can turn your hands funny colors.:eyebrow: Does a polished surface still stain skin, or will it need some kind of coating?

Thanks,
Rob
Click to expand...

Most aluminum alloys have similar thermal expansion coefficients. It won't depend on the type, and 6061 is commonly available. However, it is notable that the metal will expand at a different rate than the fingerboard material.

I owned a metal neck Kramer, with fretless plastic fingerboard, and its tuning was quite stable.

As for a finish, you want to have something on it for a couple of reasons. First, acids and oils from your skin will cause visible corrosion. Second, magnesium in the alloy will oxidize causing an effect called "white rust." Virtually all aluminum parts used in manufacturing receive a coating of some kind, even if it is a simple clear anodize.

A solid aluminum neck is going to be heavy. I sold the Kramer because it sounded wonderful and played like butter, but was a real neck-diver.
 
#5
When thinking of developing product with non-customary methods, I feel the best place to start is by asking the question- "why?"

In other words, what are you hoping to achieve? Are you looking to answer a problem? From there, I work it backwards.
 
#6
Thanks for the info guys. I would plan on using a headless system with a solid neck to reduce neck dive a bit.

Hasbeen, to your question "Why?" I answer "Why not?":p But jokes aside, I'm mostly interested to see what the sound and playability of an aluminum neck will be like. Also, after looking at some price lists, it seems as though a solid aluminum neck would actually be cheaper than a wooden one with a truss rod. I'm part Scottish.;)

For a finish, would something like Rustoleum spray enamel work?
 
#9
Hi.

Sardine said:
Also, after looking at some price lists, it seems as though a solid aluminum neck would actually be cheaper than a wooden one with a truss rod. I'm part Scottish.;)

For a finish, would something like Rustoleum spray enamel work?
Click to expand...

:eek: WHAT?? How on earth did You came to that conclusion?

I'd say (BEng Mech here) that You're looking at about 5 times the material cost when comparing aluminium with wood. For machining, You're looking at 10 times the cost in machinery and tooling.

For finishing, anodizing is about the only option IME/IMHO for a long lasting, durable finish.

And yeah, the bass with a solid aluminium neck will weigh a ton and be a hell to keep in tune if the temperature changes non-uniformly. That was the reason AFAIK for the wooden inserts on the Kramer necks.

Regards
Sam
 
#10
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If we're talking about a headless guitar neck, an 18" length should be sufficient. So less than $18. A piece of maple of those dimension is much less, probably $5-10, but a Stew-Mac hot rod adds another $15-20. For a bass neck, headless, 32" scale, a 24" length would do nicely, so that's $22. Maple, $5-10, hot rod adds $20-25. So the aluminum neck winds up being just a wee bit cheaper.

The tuning issues are my main concern though. An inconsistent neck wouldn't be much use.
 
#11
Anodizing of the alloy is a must, you can get some really cool colored anodizing done (like electroplating).
What about an aluminum tee section with wooden parts added for fret board and 2 1/4 rounds for the neck.
Sure i have seen a guitar somewhere long ago, the aluminum neck looked like fish bones .

How about an upright bass that looks like a skeleton.
 
#12
Sardine said:
Invalid Link Removed

If we're talking about a headless guitar neck, an 18" length should be sufficient. So less than $18. A piece of maple of those dimension is much less, probably $5-10, but a Stew-Mac hot rod adds another $15-20. For a bass neck, headless, 32" scale, a 24" length would do nicely, so that's $22. Maple, $5-10, hot rod adds $20-25. So the aluminum neck winds up being just a wee bit cheaper.

The tuning issues are my main concern though. An inconsistent neck wouldn't be much use.
Click to expand...
And you will allow how much $ for anodizing? (figure 50 absolute minimum)
And you would turn the aluminum bar stock into a bass neck shape how?
And deal with the weight (even headless) how? As the previous poster points out, Kramer removed a lot of aluminum and replaced it with two wooden inserts. And I'm not sure if they required a truss rod.

Also, I'd recommend doing a search on "aluminum temperature kramer" to see more former owners' opinions on tuning stability. I remember them as being overwhelmingly negative, but maybe I remember wrongly.

There's one thread in particular from maybe a year ago. I think you'll find tone comments there also. My own memory of auditioning Kramers (opinion) is that they had a unique tone, that would be unusable in most contexts.
 

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