Speaker responsiveness

[BogeyBass]

Countless arguments on the internet about speakers sounding or feeling "slow"

10 inch are punchy n fast 15 are slow blah blah.

Even car stereo guys with subs talk about it. But after hearing countless drivers and even same songs on different systems. Some drivers do have noticeable difference it tightness or being " fast"

Its in the description of what people are hearing. And often cant explain it any other way except it just seems faster. No the speaker isnt moving faster or slower. But fast changes and big changes in transients do cause distortions. And the system seems slow cause its taking time for the speaker to recover from the distortion caused from transients. cause certain systems do have a notable performance with transients.

Transients being any sudden change.

Sudden change in volume or dynamics.
Or sudden change in frequencies.

Some drivers or even systems. Dont handle transients very well. Rather poor design or cheap drivers. Often especially musicians since your creating those tones with your hands and hearing it as well. Will definately notice poor transients and likewise good ones.

Just like in car stereo or home subs hearing fast and deep notes covering a large range. Or going from deep notes to mid bass. Some systems do sound clear and " faster" cause its just simply a better system/ driver with less distortion from good transient response.

 

[CryingBass]

In terms of driver momentum/responsiveness, does a properly sealed cab ( eg Berg NV115 ) vs a ported design help with the drivers “speed” more so than a difference in impedance?

 

[Al Kraft]

I may be off base (happens a lot), but I think the words fast and slow are technically inaccurate descriptors of what we experience. Those two words are completely inconsistent with the different acoustic characteristics we hear since the speed of electrical signals and sound are constant for the frequencies we're discussing. I tend to hear something as being crisper and more distinct (tighter works too) or lacking clarity and definition (looser could work here).

 

[Rick James]

In terms of driver momentum/responsiveness, does a properly sealed cab ( eg Berg NV115 ) vs a ported design help with the drivers “speed” more so than a difference in impedance?

There is no difference in anything that actually relates to speed, either in the response time or in the velocity of the cone. The term 'speed' shouldn't be used at all, because it doesn't apply to anything that a speaker does. The major difference between ported and sealed is that ported cabs go lower, they go louder. before farting out, and they have lower distortion. Extensive testing has proven that when EQ'd for identical response listeners can't tell the difference between ported and sealed, so if you want your sealed cab to sound like a ported cab turn down the bass EQ on your amp.

 

[seamonkey]

Is your last sentence backwards there?

 

[CryingBass]

2x NV115 - I need no stinking EQ! ( ok, time to relax

 

[Red Planet]

I may be off base (happens a lot), but I think the words fast and slow are technically inaccurate descriptors of what we experience. Those two words are completely inconsistent with the different acoustic characteristics we hear since the speed of electrical signals and sound are constant for the frequencies we're discussing. I tend to hear something as being crisper and more distinct (tighter works too) or lacking clarity and definition (looser could work here).

Yes tighter and looser are more accurate than fast and slow. It just sounds that way to many people. Also this gets confused when many are discussing Solid State amps verses Tube amps.

 

[rd2rk]

I may be off base (happens a lot), but I think the words fast and slow are technically inaccurate descriptors of what we experience. Those two words are completely inconsistent with the different acoustic characteristics we hear since the speed of electrical signals and sound are constant for the frequencies we're discussing. I tend to hear something as being crisper and more distinct (tighter works too) or lacking clarity and definition (looser could work here).

A lot like "fizzy", "creamy", and "organic".

 

[BadExample]

Mango tone is where it's at

 

[Downunderwonder]

Is your last sentence backwards there?

It's non specific. Maybe he meant turn down the bass EQ so neither cab has bass.

 

[Rick James]

Is your last sentence backwards there?

Bass ackwards (as in the fish pronunciation, not the instrument). Cut the lows and a ported cab will sound like sealed. Boost the lows and a sealed will sound more like ported, but only at low volume, because the sealed runs out of excursion at much lower levels than ported.

 

[CryingBass]

If a sealed cab limits extrusion of the driver, then all other things being equal, doesn’t that “reduced” travel make the driver “faster” to respond to cycles? Dare I say “punchier”? Jim Bergantino says finger style guys like that sound from his NV series cabs ( I do! )

So am I 100% wrong here? I yield to the God’s of bass to set me straight

 

[Rick James]

110%. Ported cabs limit driver excursion more than sealed, with the least excursion where output demands are highest, at and near the tuning frequency of the cab. Despite this they're louder than sealed in that range with the same power due to the port output. All drivers respond to a signal at a significant portion of the speed of light, which for all practical intents and purposes makes them identical.

 

[rd2rk]

".......because the sealed runs out of excursion at much lower levels than ported."
"If a sealed cab limits extrusion of the driver......"
"Ported cabs limit driver excursion more than sealed....."

HUH?

 

[agedhorse]

There is a difference between amplitude (related to excursion) and "speed" (related to frequency response or bandwidth).

Different things.

 

[rd2rk]

".......because the sealed runs out of excursion at much lower levels than ported."
"If a sealed cab limits extrusion of the driver......"
"Ported cabs limit driver excursion more than sealed....."

HUH?

There is a difference between amplitude (related to excursion) and "speed" (related to frequency response or bandwidth).

Different things.

Is EXCURSION the same as EXTRUSION?
AND, if so, then how can (first quote) all of these statements be true?

 

[BadExample]

Is EXCURSION the same as EXTRUSION?

Maybe an auto-correct or spell check gone bad?

 

[Al Kraft]

Is EXCURSION the same as EXTRUSION?
AND, if so, then how can (first quote) all of these statements be true?

If your speaker is ever extruding something, there is a really serious problem IMO. The correct terminology here is excursion, and only excursion...I think extrusion is a typo.

 

[rd2rk]

If your speaker is ever extruding something, there is a really serious problem IMO. The correct terminology here is excursion, and only excursion...I think extrusion is a typo.

The question remains, how can these statements:

".......because the sealed runs out of excursion at much lower levels than ported."
"Ported cabs limit driver excursion more than sealed....."

both be true? A sealed cabinet must allow for more, or less, excursion than a ported cab. Can't be both.....unless it's a quantum physics thing?

 

[CryingBass]

Yeh I said extrusion. Points taken. Thanks boys.