speaker size for metal?

[Bass_Pounder]

I still maintain hands down that more speakers and especially high effeciency cabs is the solution here.

Ken

Definitely right on this !

Adding speakers (especially ones with greater sensitivity) yeilds better results than just throwing more watts at your current cab(s).

 

[Bassmec]

I think one thing people overlook is the amount of power the amp head puts out. You're underpowered.
I was in the same situation a few years ago. I had a 250 watt Eden combo with a 15 and a 410 and it wasn't cutting it. Adding more speakers will only help so much.
Shortly thereafter I bought a GK 1001RB-II (750 watts @ 4 ohm) and a 4 ohm Basson 210 cab. The following practice I pounded the hell out of my bandmates until they were physically ill.
215 and 810 cabs are great but if you don't have enough power you're still in the same boat not getting heard.

The more power you have available the better a Bassoon 8 X 10 will sound, as they are reputed to need about twice the watts an old Eden, Ampeg or SWR 8 X 10 does for the same spl.
Sorry didn't notice you where talking about a 2 X 10 till i wrote that..... sod it, his guitarists have a total of 16 X 12"
speakers mate!, do you see a slight imbalance here.

 

[rockstarbassist]

4x412 stacks are 8 412s... They each have two full stacks?? Nuts.

I recommend 2x412s and 2x810s.
It's the only way to be sure.

 

[rockstarbassist]

also if they're playing Crate mapz through Recto 412 cabs, you probably want to quit LOL

that's downright heresy right there, son

 

[runmikeyrun]

I run 4x12s. They work great for clean sound and are the best for distortion. I suggest you get two of them, and run a head that's 700-1000w so you can keep up with the guitards. Make sure you're matching your cab's impedances so you get the max power out of your amp.

 

[Marko 1]

its not about the age, its more about the mental state lol...

...tastes do evolve but so can music and musicians without giving up the styles you love.

You're right, and I’m sorry... I really shouldn’t have said that.

 

[Windreaper]

Agreed with the previous poster - you need a bucketload of tens (or twelves) in ported enclosures. Something like 2x GK 410RBH with sufficient amp power might do the trick.

 

[somegeezer]

I wish a new trend would take over the death metal scene where bass players started using Phil Jones cabs.

I'd actually love some Phil Jones gear. Not in my price range though. =P I'll stick to my GK/Laney setup.

 

[staindbass]

i dont think the 4x10 and 15, or two 4x10 will keep up with full stacks. let us know if it does. "keep up" depends on how loud the guitars are. most guitarists just buy them for looks and dont use the full potential. if they are cranking like chainsaws, i say two 8x10 would keep your head above water.

 

[Windreaper]

The guitarists probably look like the guy below...

(yeah, I know it's Paul Gilbert. Doesn't change the fact you must be crazy to crank a full stack during a club gig)

 

[makohund]

Each guitarist has two 412's? Are they nuts? :scowl:

You need MINIMUM of an 810 or two and EAR PLUGS. One 412 is generally too much anyway for a guitarist.... It would be beyond silly to play with these guys in a practice setting. Playing a show with a PA system would be annoying too - they would overpower it quickly anywhere they went.

Aw, come on. Y'all act like all guitarists are idiots. (Many, sure... but not all. And ok, the head/cab mix here isn't promising. But still.)

Guitar amps come with volume knobs too, ya know. I play and rehearse regularly with 3 4x12 guitar cabs, and did fine for a long time with a lot less than an 8x10.

Also note that a death metal band that cares about tone and mix is gonna kick way more ass than the hordes that don't.

To be heard, skip the smiley face, or move it down. Mids for definition and stay out of the mud. And lows down below everyone else... no one can touch you under 80Hz. (But only if your cab can do it for real, and not too much. A little fundamental goes a long way, and will be lost without mids to go with it.) Convince the guitarists to go through an eq session with you... to get their sound without eating all the low end, and for you to wrap nicely around what they are putting out without getting drowned out.

 

[Windreaper]

Guitar amps come with volume knobs too, ya know.

Not all do .

If you like power tube distortion and use a full stack you're going to be crazy loud, master volume or not. Somehow I feel the guitarists in question have 100W amps too .

 

[makohund]

OK, if it's just gotta be power tubes distorting at full tilt, sure. But somehow most I've played with full & half stacks (and yes, 100W tube amps) manage to pull off sweet tone (including death metal worthy distortion when called for) without blowing the walls down. I won't pretend to know guitar rigs to know how, but can confirm it can be done.

And there's always differing personal opinions on what is crazy loud and what isn't. Yes, rehearsal includes ear plugs. With a heavy rock drummer it should anyway. At any rate, I've never needed a squadron of refrigerator cabs to keep up.

 

[Windreaper]

I know, the guitarist of my previous hard rock band had a Krank half stack (and he kranked it). All I really needed was a tilted GK 115RBH and couple hundred watts since my tone was pretty mid-heavy. Death metal usually calls for kind of scooped tone, though, so you need lots of speakers. Anything over 8x10 would be overkill though (unless the band in question plays stadiums).

 

[Korladis]

I use a 2x15 both for playing black metal and for doom metal. For the doom band I'll eventually have two of them.

Speaker size doesn't matter. What does is how much speaker and specific cabs. To keep up with 4x12"s, you're going to need a lot of speaker. I wouldn't bother looking at anything less than a total of eight 10"s, four 12"s, or two 15"s, preferably about twice as much of each of those.

Or, if you're feeling spendy and adventurous, you could build a fEarful 1515/66 or have one built for you.

Also, stop that mid-scooping. Your guitarists are probably also scooping their mids, and with their heavy distortion, they're going to win any volume war if you're EQing the same way they are. Boost what they're cutting, cut what they're boosting.

 

[zagralin_arf]

If your guitarists are each rocking a full stack then chances are they look really cool. A full stack is cool. And the smaller the venue the cooler it looks because it makes the amp look bigger. Match their full stacks with either an 8x10 or a 4x10 and a 1x15(or 18). You can't be onstage in a metal band with a small single cab rig between two full stacks of searing guitars. Even people that don't understand whats going on musically are just going to see whats going on with the amps and be like "oh...that wierd guy with the different guitar has a smaller amp than the other guys. He must not be as important."

And thus the stereotype of the bassist is perpetuated. Ideally if money allows you should match them both with 2 stacks for "sonic equality and stage audio balance" in case of a "bad sound guy"

This is a metal band, right? If its not over the top your doing it wrong.

 

[LuckyBassPlayer]

Google Images
About three of those would do. Now go show those little guitards what REAL POWER is! OTOH, another sensible thing would be to have them turn down to a reasonable volume level so nobody has to change their gear, and just leave most of the work to the PA system.

 

[makohund]

Or, if you're feeling spendy and adventurous, you could build a fEarful 1515/66 or have one built for you.

Also, stop that mid-scooping. Your guitarists are probably also scooping their mids, and with their heavy distortion, they're going to win any volume war if you're EQing the same way they are. Boost what they're cutting, cut what they're boosting.

Yeah, that'd do it.

Try to talk them out of their mid scoop, too. They might be surprised at how good guitars sound (and the resulting pounding metal goodness) when they haven't had all the guts and meat torn out of their spectrum.

Save the disemboweling stuff for the lyricist.

 

[Korladis]

I'm okay with the guitars mid-scooping a bit. Makes it easy for me to slot right in with a bit of mid boost.

 

[zagralin_arf]

OTOH, another sensible thing would be to have them turn down to a reasonable volume level so nobody has to change their gear, and just leave most of the work to the PA system.

Whats the point of having a full stack if you aren't going to use its volume? If half a stack was loud enough I'm sure they would leave the second cab at home...but its obviously just not enough.