Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
- Status
WOW! I will be honest. The only time I have heard Dan play is in that Trioscapes live jam that was on Youtube and I was blown away by Dan's playing. After seeing your picture, I went to listen to some of BTBAM's songs and I am just amazed. This new song off their CD that is coming out soon has awesome bass tone on it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xi_TafYAcd8
WARNING Most will not like this kind of music
But man, the bass tone he gets is simply amazing. Does anyone know what he has in his Legend as far as pickups and pre and is it stock?edit This song is just epic and I cannot stop listening to it. These guys kind of remind me of a MUCH heavier Dream Theater. I really want to be able to listen to Dream Theater but I am just not a fan of James leBrie's vocals.
Interesting. Maybe Sam could be persuaded to re-post those clips - I'd sure like to hear them.
And damn those first few pages of each new Club thread - now I'm gassing hard for NS-2 basses in ultra-violet, ocean blue and ultra-amber!
Beautiful NS-JH5. What year was yours made? I have a red one from 2002 that I really love the feel of and is such a comfortable bass to play.
delucajohn2000 said:WOW! I will be honest. The only time I have heard Dan play is in that Trioscapes live jam that was on Youtube and I was blown away by Dan's playing. After seeing your picture, I went to listen to some of BTBAM's songs and I am just amazed. This new song off their CD that is coming out soon has awesome bass tone on it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xi_TafYAcd8
WARNING Most will not like this kind of music
edit This song is just epic and I cannot stop listening to it. These guys kind of remind me of a MUCH heavier Dream Theater. I really want to be able to listen to Dream Theater but I am just not a fan of James leBrie's vocals.
Good question - his bass is listed as "Legend 5 Custom" on the Spector signature artists page. I'd love to know what he has in that thing.
John, your assessment of BTBAM's music is dead-on. Dream Theater is way too keyboard-heavy, and the vocals are not my favorite, either.
BTBAM goes from massively heavy to melodic many times in each song. Great guitar work, great bass, heavy drums, and really cool keyboard lines where they fit and nothing more.
Great stuff!
bunkaroo said:
I'll agree with you on the scream vocals; they're not my favorite either. However, it's more interesting than "Cookie Monster" style, and when he sings, you hear how great his voice is.
I can't listen to BTBAM any old time; a tune every now and then is plenty for me. Plus, most of them are 8-10 minutes long!
Nice bass tone, but I don't really like most metal bands due to being all screaming and the machismo "We're so friggin brutal and badass and blood and guts death and destruction and RARRRRRGH" attitude. (thanks for the warning before the link!)
Surprised how well he gets his bass tone to sit in that mix with those thick guitars!
Surprised how well he gets his bass tone to sit in that mix with those thick guitars!
PhatBasstard said:First, the amp is not in the equation...at all. An 18 volt mod, for pickups and preamps that can handle it and claim, by the manufacturer (like EMG) to run with more headroom as such should not be any louder than running at 9 volts. It simply raises the ceiling before clipping occures within the pickup's own internal pre (such as EMG's) from the amount of magnetic signal taken from the vibrating strings. In other words, given everything but the voltage being equal, a given (hard) note that clips the pickup's internal pre at 9 volts may not clip it at 18 volts due to the higher ceiling available. It is not making them run hotter/louder.
After the pickups, if there is an equalization pre amp (Tone Pump, etc.), your tech is correct about one thing: it probably doesn't need the 18 volts. But unless you want to run a separate battery/power system for the pre (one battery for the pre, two for the pups), it's kind of along for the ride.
In a passive pickups scenario, unless the added equalization pre's manufacturer recommends it, an 18 volt mod is unneeded. This all has to do with the internals of the bass and has nothing to do with the amount of signal hitting the input stage of the amp. This is where your tech is way off base.
I've been doing 18 volt mods to almost all my EMG equiped basses (mostly Spectors) for well over 25 years. I've never had one get louder from it....as they shouldn't.
Most of us here seem to think the 18 volt mod is about our equalizations pres (EMG, Tone Pumps, whatever). It is not.
It's about EMG recommending 18 volts for the pres inside it's active pickups. Most can even be run at 27 volts.
However, some manufacturers (Aguilar, etc.) actually recommend 18 volts for some of their equalization pre's.
And with their x series line, their tech actually told me NOT to run at more than 9 because the internal preamp was so powerful, 18v would induce clipping very quickly. But regular series 18v is fine.
Nice bass tone, but I don't really like most metal bands due to being all screaming and the machismo "We're so friggin brutal and badass and blood and guts death and destruction and RARRRRRGH" attitude. (thanks for the warning before the link!)
Surprised how well he gets his bass tone to sit in that mix with those thick guitars!
I appreciate good tone and good musicianship, which is obviously there, though I'm definitely more of a Pantera/FFDP/Sepultura kind of guy. But that's just me. I'm definitely looking forward to seeing the Trespass America tour when it rolls through Boston in a couple of weeks.
Worldeeeter said:
I'm always a tough sell on vocals whether they're clean or rough. 9 times out of 10 I'll be listening to clips online and immediately turn it off after the vocals start.
For my money Mikael from Opeth probably has one of the best death voices out there - very intelligible and full- throated. And his clean vocals kick ass.
- Feb 3, 2005
- 7,331
- 10,198
- Disclosures
- Endorsing artist: Bergantino Audio Systems and GHS Strings
I struggle with a lot of newer metal based on vocals alone. I just can't get past anything with scream/cookiemonster/etc. type vocals. I'm not dogging it, just my personal taste. I know it leaves me completely out of the loop on a lot of bands.
worshiprocker
Tonepump Junkie
- Aug 12, 2011
- 4,683
- 1,782
- Disclosures
- Endorsing Artist: Spector Basses
Well first off I want to say that you should take ANYONE's opinion with a grain of salt. Because people's opinions are based on experience and what we hear in our heads... not reality most of the time. Techs/players included.
I don't agree with the assessment that the 18v mod makes the signal hotter... I have not seen this with my basses, but is headroom on the Pick Ups, not the preamp.
We are essentially running 3 preamps when we run active EMGs, pre, amp... that's crazy to think about. lol
I have run the 18v mod in my CRFM used it live and practiced with it (solo) I noticed a difference in a couple areas. The bottom end (was tighter, sounded better when doing solo work) it was a cleaner tone, less grit and growl.
I have gone back to the 9v setup with my EMG/TP setup.
I've had this talk with Omer before, some people don't have an ear for all of the little nuances. Some people plug in and play and it sounds great. Some of us hear different things and tweak forever. So I would say to the inexperienced ear you wouldn't notice. I will also say that when I tried the 18v mod I was very skeptical. Definitely worth it, not my cup o tea, but a noticeable difference especially in a band setting.
Spector must have gotten wise the 18v thing, because the old TPs couldn't handle it and then they changed it so they could.
keep in mind the TP handles the signal from the pickups different than an EMG preamp. off to see my parents run a tri. be back later...!
delucajohn2000 said:WOW! I will be honest. The only time I have heard Dan play is in that Trioscapes live jam that was on Youtube and I was blown away by Dan's playing. After seeing your picture, I went to listen to some of BTBAM's songs and I am just amazed. This new song off their CD that is coming out soon has awesome bass tone on it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xi_TafYAcd8
WARNING Most will not like this kind of music
edit This song is just epic and I cannot stop listening to it. These guys kind of remind me of a MUCH heavier Dream Theater. I really want to be able to listen to Dream Theater but I am just not a fan of James leBrie's vocals.
Haha, I remember the first time I heard BTBAM. Check out the albums 'colors' and 'the great misdirect' if you haven't already. I got both of the songbooks too ( Dan tabs them himself)- I'm most of the way through prequel to the sequel, and maybe 1/3 of the way through obfuscation. Not easy tunes to work through!
Worldeeeter said:
I've heard reports that it's actually an ns2000/5, but it has a quilted top, which makes me wonder... I've also heard that its a Q5pro. Definitely Korean, whatever the case.
I also know that he was stringing it with D'addario half rounds, not sure if he still does or not- his page on their site has him using nickels and pro-steels. I think part of his sound is his tube amp- an old sunn 300 watt something-or-other.
bunkaroo said:
Agreed on Mikael- when I saw them live he was unbelievable. He'd be just laid back and playing when singing clean, but when the death vocals kicked in it was like he transformed into some kind of monster- Opeth ftw.
And I guess I'm pretty lucky, as I don't really mind screamed vocals too much. I think they can add a lot to the music depending on context. The band The Human Abstract is a good example- their singer for their album 'digital veil' has excellent clean vocals, but his screams are pretty cool sounding too. The songs 'Patterns', 'complex terms', and 'Faust' are pretty good examples.
I feel the same way though. I can't get past the growly vocals. Have you guys checked out Scale The Summit? Really great all instrumental band. Their original bass player (Jordan Peavey Cirrus 6 player fantastic BTW) left early this year and the new bass player Mark is using a Legend 6 now and is endorsed by Spector.
Brent
Brent
PhatBasstard said:First, the amp is not in the equation...at all. An 18 volt mod, for pickups and preamps that can handle it and claim, by the manufacturer (like EMG) to run with more headroom as such should not be any louder than running at 9 volts. It simply raises the ceiling before clipping occures within the pickup's own internal pre (such as EMG's) from the amount of magnetic signal taken from the vibrating strings. In other words, given everything but the voltage being equal, a given (hard) note that clips the pickup's internal pre at 9 volts may not clip it at 18 volts due to the higher ceiling available. It is not making them run hotter/louder.
After the pickups, if there is an equalization pre amp (Tone Pump, etc.), your tech is correct about one thing: it probably doesn't need the 18 volts. But unless you want to run a separate battery/power system for the pre (one battery for the pre, two for the pups), it's kind of along for the ride.
In a passive pickups scenario, unless the added equalization pre's manufacturer recommends it, an 18 volt mod is unneeded. This all has to do with the internals of the bass and has nothing to do with the amount of signal hitting the input stage of the amp. This is where your tech is way off base.
I've been doing 18 volt mods to almost all my EMG equiped basses (mostly Spectors
Most of us here seem to think the 18 volt mod is about our equalizations pres (EMG, Tone Pumps, whatever). It is not.
It's about EMG recommending 18 volts for the pres inside it's active pickups. Most can even be run at 27 volts.
However, some manufacturers (Aguilar, etc.) actually recommend 18 volts for some of their equalization pre's.
And also thanks phat. That was a great explanation that taught me a lot. I really appreciate it.
- Status
